Was Jesus really the Messiah.?

Question

In the old testament the prophecy of the coming messiah said that he would be on the house and lineage of David. Joseph was of the house of David. Joseph was not Jesus' father. God was, right! So they tried to make Mary to be Joseph's cousin. However, it was not until the 20th century that a womans lineage counted. So if we are to believe the old testament prophecy than Jesus would not have been the one.

I does not matter!!! Him being the messiah does not matter. What matters is the message of the man Jesus. His message was to love one another. Mahatma Gandhi was a man who lived by the message of Jesus, yet many do not believe that he crossed over to "heaven".

If Jesus was the messiah, why are we not trying to live the way he wanted us to live.

Answer 1

NO, I do not believe Jesus was the Messiah.

Lets try it from a different approach.

Would a true Messiah or Prophet take some general rule that promotes good behavior and change it, and in changing it, not only weaken it but stick in a big fat loophole?

Prior to Jesus, there was Hillel. Hillel gave a version of the "golden rule" that read like this. "That which is hateful to you, do not do to other." That was somewhere around 50-100 years before Jesus. Hillel was and is one of the best known Rabbis so it is inconceivable that Jesus could have lived at that time and not have heard and learned about Hillel.

Now Jesus, in his Sermon on the Mount said, " Treat people the same way you want them to treat you." That is sometimes stated as "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

And therein is the weakness. In the Hillel version, the assessment of the deed is stated first, then the action. That is in the order that one would actually do something. One would determine if an action is correct, then do it.

In the Jesus version, the deed is stated first, then the assessment. That is not the order that one does things.
It would be like taking an action without thought and then afterwords evaluating if you should have done it.

So from a chronological standpoint, the Jesus version is weaker.
From the assessment standpoint, the Jesus version also has a failing and a loophole.

The Hillel version requires you to evaluate an action by what a person would NOT like done to them. We can pretty well agree a person would know what they would not like. And if they would not like it, they are clearly told not to do it to others. It is a restrictive requirement. If there is any doubt, the action is not taken. If there is error in assessment, at least you do not have a compounding error in action.

The Jesus version goes the opposite direction. If you would like something done to you, you are told to do it to others. It goes on an assumption that whatever you like, others would like also.
If there is error in assessment, you also have a compounding error in action.

Let us assume you like something strange, like being tied up and beaten. Because you like it, does that mean it is OK to do to others?

With the Hillel version, it would not even enter the picture because you evaluate based upon what you do not like. But with the Jesus version, since you would like it done to you, you are told to do it to others. And that is the loophole.

In my opinion a true Prophet, a true Messiah would not take something that is good and weaken it, they would not take something that is good and put in a loophole.

So putting all the other reasons aside, this reason alone is enough for me to say Jesus was not the Messiah.

Answer 2

You are wrong about the women's lineage not being counted... because there are two women listed in that lineage... Rahab and Ruth...and, not only were they both women...but, they were foreigners too.

The lineages provided in the scriptures are both different...one comes through David's son, Solomon...and the other through his son Nathan. The one listed in Matthew is Joseph's lineage, in Luke...Mary's.

You must understand...the passage in Luke does not state this lineage was Joseph's....it says that it was 'thought' to be through Joseph. Then it provides Mary's lineage.. which goes right back to King David.

And, yes it is crucial that Jesus is the messiah...you must understand, all scripture prophesies must align. And, they do... in fact...internal prophesies of the bible are the biggest proof of the accuracy of the bible and evidence of Jesus' deity and message. He proclaims to be, "I AM" - which is what God told Moses and is a premise of the Old Testament. When Jesus told the people he was, "I AM" he infuriated them because He was saying...he is God. Period....

I will assert to you that indeed...He must be the Messiah or he was a liar. I would not follow a liar...

And, yes...why are we not trying to live the way He wants us to live? A very good question...you must answer that to yourself...and, the rest of us will do the same since we are all responsible for only our individual selves in the long run.

Answer 3

Yes, he did have a very good message...even though he isn't the messiah! He can't be considered the messiah because he didn't come from two human parents and then you couldn't trace someone's lineage thru the mother...she only determined if the child would be jewish or not! anyways, Jesus did have a nice message, though!

Answer 4

The royal pedigree of Jesus is affirmed throughout the New Testament. The Gospels furnish two genealogies of Jesus, one in Matthew (Matt. 1:1-17) and one in Luke (Luke 3:23-38), and both trace His ancestry to David. Throughout His ministry, Jesus allowed others to call Him the son of David (Mark 10:47 et al.). Paul said that Jesus sprang from David's line (Rom. 1:3; 2 Tim. 2:8). In the Book of Acts, which chronicles the early expansion of the church, the first reference to Jesus as the son of David occurs in an excerpt from one of Paul's sermons during his first missionary journey (Acts 13:23). The kingly descent of Jesus must therefore have been a teaching of the church from the very beginning.

The historian Josephus, member of a priestly family, said that he obtained his own genealogy from public records (1). He said also that catalogs of priestly marriages were kept in Jerusalem and other principal cities (2). If the ancestry of priestly families was so fully documented, perhaps genealogical tables existed for other Jewish families as well. Without such tables, the Jews would have had nothing to sustain their keen, even fanatical, interest in genealogies (1 Tim. 1:4; Tit. 3:9). Because of its importance to the nation, the nonpriestly family most likely to possess records of descent was the family of David. The Gospel writers surely would not have falsely represented Jesus as David's descendant if opponents of the church had ready access to records proving otherwise.

Even the Babylonian Talmud, an ancient source unfriendly to Christianity, acknowledges that Jesus belonged to the family of David. On the authority of Ulla, a rabbi from the late third century, the Talmud says that the Sanhedrin took pains to give Jesus a fair trial because He was "near to the kingship" (3). This is F. F. Bruce's translation (4). In the standard Jewish edition, the same passage reads, "connected with the government [or royalty, i.e., influential]" (5). The translation and the bracketed interpretation supplied by the editor are outrageously inaccurate and biased, as well as being impossible both historically and contextually. The Talmud elsewhere is wholly sympathetic to the Sanhedrin. Here, it is hardly suggesting that the Sanhedrin was pliable to undue political pressure. Moreover, the Sanhedrin in Jesus' day was not under any king but Caesar. The immediately superior authority was Pilate, a Roman governor. The only king in the area was Herod of Galilee, who was no friend of Jesus (Luke 13:31-32). When Pilate sent Jesus to Herod, Herod mocked Him and returned Him to Pilate for execution (Luke 23:7-12).

Just before citing Ulla, the Talmud says that for forty days a herald went out and cried: "'Any one who can say anything in his [Jesus'] favour, let him come forward and plead on his behalf.' But since nothing was brought forward in his favour he was hanged on the eve of Passover" (6). If Jesus had powerful allies in the government, why was it so difficult to find either honest or suborned testimony on His behalf?

Answer 5

Not if the prophecies count. Clearly he was not of the line of David through Joseph, Joseph was not his father. He was not named Emmanuel, and he did not establish a jewish kingdom in Isreal.
I don't know if he was the messiah or not, but according to the prophacies the answer would have to be no.

Answer 6

Both lineages of Joseph (Jesus' step-father) and Mary are recorded back to King David.

All Messianic prophesies are fulfilled in one person, Jesus.

Answer 7

You make a good point....
Christians identify Messiah with Jesus and define him as God incarnated as a man, and believe he died for the sins of humanity as a blood sacrifice. This means that one has to accept the idea that one person's death can atone for another person's sins. However, this is opposed to what the Bible says in Deuteronomy 24:26, "Every man shall be put to death for his own sin," which is also expressed in Exodus 32:30-35, and Ezekiel 18. The Christian idea of the messiah also assumes that God wants, and will accept, a human sacrifice. After all, it was either Jesus-the-god who died on the cross, or Jesus-the-human. Jews believe that God cannot die, and so all that Christians are left with in the death of Jesus on the cross, is a human sacrifice. However, in Deuteronomy 12:30-31, God calls human sacrifice an abomination, and something He hates: "for every abomination to the Eternal, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods." All human beings are sons or daughters, and any sacrifice to God of any human being would be something that God would hate. The Christian idea of the messiah consists of ideas that are UnBiblical.
So how have we Jews, who invented the term, always defined the term Messiah?

1. The Messiah is born of two human parents, as we said.But Jesus, according to Christian theology, was born of a union between a Human woman and God, rather than two HUMAN parents, as was Hercules, and Dionysis, as well as many other pagan gods.
2. The Messiah can trace his lineage through his human biological father, back to King David (Isaiah 11:1,10; Jeremiah 23:5; Ezekiel 34:23-24; 37:21-28; Jeremiah 30:7-10; 33:14-16; and Hosea 3:4-5). But Jesus's lineage cannot go through his human father, according to Christian theology, as Jesus's father was not Joseph the husband of Mary. According to Christian theology, Jesus's father was God.
3. The Messiah traces his lineage only through King Solomon (II Samuel 7:12-17; I Chronicles 22:9-10). But according to Luke 3:31, Jesus was a descendant of Nathan, another son of King David, and not a descendant of King David through King Solomon.
4. The Messiah cannot trace his lineage through Jehoiakim, Jeconiah, or Shealtiel, because this royal line was cursed (I Chronicles 3:15-17; Jeremiah 22:18,30). But according to both Matthew 1:11-12 and Luke 3:27, Jesus was a descendant of Shealtiel.

According to the Jewish definition of the term, the Real Messiah will make changes in the real world, changes that one can see and perceive and be able to prove because these changes take place in the real world. It is for this task that the real messiah has been anointed in the first place, hence the term, messiah -- one who is anointed. These changes, that one will be able to see and perceive in the real world, include:

1. The Messiah is preceded by Elijah the prophet who, with the Messiah, unifies the family (Malachi 4:5-6), which is contradicted by Jesus in Matthew 10:34-37.
2. The Messiah re-establishes the Davidic dynasty through the messiah's own children (Daniel 7:13-14). But Jesus had no children.
3. The Messiah brings an eternal peace between all nations, between all peoples, and between all people (Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-4; Ezekiel 39:9). Obviously there is no peace. Furthermore, Jesus said that his purpose in coming was to bring a sword, and not peace (see Matthew 10:34, as referenced above.)
4. The Messiah brings about the universal world-wide conversion of all peoples to Judaism, or at least to Ethical Monotheism (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Zechariah 8:23; Isaiah 11:9; Zechariah 14:9,16). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.
5. The Messiah brings about an end to all forms of idolatry (Zechariah 13:2). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.
6. The Messiah brings about a universal recognition that the Jewish idea of God is God (Isaiah 11:9). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.
7. The Messiah leads the world to become vegetarian (Isaiah 11:6-9). It isn't.
8. The Messiah gathers to Israel, all of the twelve tribes (Ezekiel 36:24). Many of the ten lost tribes remain lost.
9. The Messiah rebuilds The Temple (Isaiah 2:2; Ezekiel 37:26-28). It hasn't been rebuilt.
10. There will be no more famine (Ezekiel 36:29-30). People starve to death every day.
11. After the Messiah comes, death will eventually cease (Isaiah 25:8). People die every day.
12. Eventually the dead will be resurrected (Isaiah 26:19; Daniel 12:2; Ezekiel 37:12-13; Isaiah 43:5-6);
13. The nations of the earth will help the Jews, materially (Isaiah 60:5-6; 60:10-12;
14. The Jews will be sought out for spiritual guidance (Zechariah 8:23);
15. All weapons will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9,12);
16. The Nile will run dry (Isaiah 11:15)
17. Monthly, the trees of Israel will yield their fruit (Ezekiel 47:12);
18. Each tribe of Israel will receive and settle their inherited land (Ezekiel 47:13-13);
19. The nations of the earth will recognize that they have been wrong, that the Jews have been right, and that the sins of the Gentile nations, their persecutions and the murders they committed, have been borne by the Jewish people (Isaiah 53)

Answer 8

Jesus IS the Messiah. but just because most of the world try to ignore him doesn't mean he's not the son of God. I hated christians a few years ago because i was ignorant, but It wasn't until i felt his presence and proof of his power and love did i get baptised and welcomed him in my heart. The message of Jesus is being spread, but it is up to individuals such as your self to help change majority of the population to live right. because God uses people whom we least expect would reach greatness.

Answer 9

My dear, you were born into sin. If you believe, then you live as Jesus would want you to. Or at least your base would direct you in the right direction. But the choice is still yours. You know the way you are suppose to go, but because of your indecision you don't always go that way. Please don't be so naive to believe that Christian believers have no sin. We do. Just our thoughts try to keep us there. The Devil has inserted sin to our thoughts. He cannot hear our thougbts but see's our actions and hears our voice. He then knows you are letting sin lead you through life. A good Christian base brings us out, but it is a perilous journey. God has given you the chance to keep the devil under you instead of equal to you by sending his Son Jesus Christ to die for your sins. He has taken all sin on his shoulders and allowed God to forgive you. Believe it or not, the choice is yours, take it or leave it!

Answer 10

Cause the devil is blocking, and jesus did the impossible, he walked on water, cast out demons, brought the dead back to life, and healed the sick. That really is a messiah specially if he hasnt shown any temper except the time he destroyed the church when he found out they turned it into a market, gambling, place.