Question from atheist to atheists.?

Question

Christians and Muslims: I respect religion and religious people, so please don't use my question as a bash-board.

Well, my assumption is, religion exists in most human beings and every trait the human beings have is a useful trait, so says evolution, so religion has kept its place during the ages. Also, please remember that there is a gene that determines if we are religious or not. (That is a gross generalisation but helps me express my idea.)

Atheists, what function do you think religious feelings serve in human societies and history. Please remember that there were/are pagan, shaman, Hinduist, Budhhist, Shintoist religions, too, and each have a different set of social rules.

Everybody, thank you for providing me with the most interesting, mature and intrigueing reading under the "religion & spirituality" topic.

The "genetic" makeup of spirituality was discussed in a magazine article. I'm aware that spirituality doesn't necessarily mean religion, but naming it religion is the best way to define belief without discussion. Anyway. Your answers have given me new basis for thought, and thinking never stops, does it?

Answer 1

OK, "evolution" doesn't guarantee that every trait is a useful trait. That's way too "directed."

The idea is that survival pressures (from the environment mostly, but with humans also from society) over long time periods will favor traits that enhance survival, meaning those traits will survive over the long-term. Traits that have a negative impact on survival will, over a long time, die out. Traits that are neither helpful nor harmful to survival...well, those come and go somewhat at random. There's no evolutionary pressure on such traits to continue or to die out.

Now you can debate whether being religious has a positive or negative impact on survival of humans...or whether it's one of those "no impact" traits. Or whether it's a "trait" at all...? And if there's been enough time for natural selection to work on whatever religion does for humans.

Here's my own take on the matter:
I think that in ancient humans (100,000 to 1,000 years ago), any way of thinking that helped organize them into cohesive societies had a net positive impact on our survival. Humans can survive better in groups that work well together, that support each other, that divide tasks among all the members of the group -- than they can out on the plains by themselves. So as one small part of early human society, religions could provide a basis for "rules" that made living in large groups possible, and enhanced our survival. The societal leaders in ancient times chose to pretend their "rules" came from all-powerful gods, as people were more likely to follow those rules if they thought they were of divine origin.

Currently? We still need rules in our groups (now called cities, nations, etc.), but human thought has provided better ways to come up with those rules than the ancient way of pretending they came from all-powerful gods. We now have the concepts of human rights outside of religion espoused by many countries, and much of it first expressed by the founders of the US. We can make our rules without pretending they have a supernatural origin to give them weight and meaning. In that sense, religion no longer serves the purpose it once did to help society hold together, and as such has gone from a useful thing to a neutral thing. You could even argue that it's now a negative thing, since it induces war and violence among the various different kinds of religion.

One final thought: "religion" doesn't exist naturally in ANY human being, it is entirely a construction of the human mind and a function of holding power within societies. What exists naturally in humans is curiosity which leads us to wonder about our origins, our place in the world, and if there's anything else besides this short life. The man-made construct of religion has always tried to provide answers to those questions, and coupled with its use in societal power structures it has been enough for many humans throughout history. But there are other ways of answering those questions -- science, for example -- that are now doing a better job of answering, are more logical and consistent, and have the possibility of gaining humans much more knowledge than religion ever could. You might call science, "evolution of thought" :)

Answer 2

I was just wondering about this the other day when somebody mentioned in passing that religion once had an evolutionary advantage. I didn't and maybe still don't completely get it but I suspect that the signs of religious affiliation could serve as a surrogate for family or tribal (really just a big family) membership. If you're roaming the african plain and come to some settlement and come across a house with some special colored curtains or the fire built a certain way you knew you could get food there (the sharing of food seems to be a way to confer an advantage, sharing mates would as well). Note too that like genetic traits, the tradition of religious practice is passed along by families.

As to religious feelings...I think trying to empathize with a hateful, vengeful sort of god would make one good militarily - your religious group will amass material wealth, food, mates by conquest ("you deserve them" says the judging god). People who believe in pacifist, empathizing gods probably live in large heterogeneous groups better. We will probably always try to mimic god. Godliness is what we strive for.

And I'm sure I'm way off the mark but the general question of the actual benefits of religion intrigues me.

Answer 3

I'm going to start by shooting down your blanket statement that every trait is a useful trait. Some traits persist past their utility. The "religion gene" is hypothetical. There is some evidence, but it's far from confirmed. Not all evolution is genetic. Our brains have evolved such that much of our behavior is learned, not encoded instinct. If religion creates better social mores that bind a society, that society is more likely to survive, long term. The questions are. "Has religion outlived its utility?", and, "With six billion people in the world, does religion create more fragmenation than unity?"

Answer 4

Not every trait is necessarily a useful trait. Some traits are not suitable for the environment and eventually cause the extinction of the species.

The function of religion was control of the people during a time that did not have law enforcement. If they are scared of some sky pixie they will obey the laws.

Following a religion is a process that is environmental in origin not genetic. If you submerse someone in religion from an early age they are brainwashed for life.

Answer 5

Interesting that you know about this study with evidence of a genetic bias for religion (studying identical twins reared apart, I believe).

Basically, we humans behave socially like apes do (I am not a zoologist so maybe I'm slightly off on the terminology:) Every tribe of apes has an Alpha male (the boss) and a few aspiring apes (Beta males etc.) who may one day challenge the leader. There are also a large bunch of meek animals in the tribe ("Omega" animals) who will never challenge the leaders.

I believe that human society matches that pattern very closely. Religion is the set of rules that we've devised to play this game by. Most people (Omega people) won't challenge the authority of the church, they are happy with their place in society. Some are unhappy with the status quo and want to improve things and challenge the rulers at the top.

Answer 6

Religion serves as some sort of guiding light.
It gives people, admittedly false, reasons for life, why we are here, and how we got here.
Some use it as a basis for morality; while others take it to the opposite extreme and use it for violence.

Religion was created to answer questions that at one point, were unknown to man. As science grows, the need for religion will be eradicated.

I.E Why believe in the Christian God over say, Zeus?

...

Exactly.

Answer 7

It serves as a social bonding experience, one that we seem particularly wired for.

It provides acceptable temporary answers to currently unsolvable problems, "How does lightening happen...?" "God..." two thousand years later, "How does lightening happen...?" "Atmospheric friction causing separation of charges and the dialectric breakdown of the air between cloud and cloud or cloud and planet." These sorts of temporary answers provide closure necessary for complex, abstract thought.

Humans, like all life, are intrinsically metabolically lazy. Thinking is a high-metabolism process, so it takes effort to overcome the urge to just 'idle'. Religion allows a viable means to do just this; the answers are given and that's the end of it, no thought required.

Just a few ideas, none mutually exclusive.

Answer 8

I say most religion is like a form of politics. I really do because it is responsible for war, killings and fighting just like politics. It's actually one of the reasons why I dislike religion so much. Its clearly like politics to me. Also it just serves to divide people.

I don't think all religion is like this though. Religions like Buddhism are really peaceful. They are more of a form of living and no worshipping of anything, instead respecting things. There is a difference and it shows. Have you ever seen a radical Buddhist on a killing spree to spread the word?

Prophets, etc = Party Founder
Priests, Imams, Pope = Party Chairman
The Believers = Party Members
The Religion = Ideology
"Holy Word" = Propoganda

Answer 9

No religion gene. Religion is merely an off shoot of our inherited and evolutionary social trait of humans. Mix the social nature of early humans with all of unexplainable natural events all around them and then complicate all of that with verbal stories handed down through many generations and you get religion.

Answer 10

Religion is an antiquated form of philosophy that seemed to help humans flourish at the time it was developed. Philosophy needs to evolve as our minds do, or we will develop technology that we aren't mentally prepared to handle.
But.. many people's lifestyles depend on things never changing, or they go out of business.
People are just like that. We dislike change because it puts us out of business, so we scramble to keep our lifestyle.
We are all self serving. We just need to be honest about that.