So Evolution is not provable?

Question

In my life, one of the greatest and most fascinatings I've discovered is science. It can explain and do so many things. Without science, we wouldn't have the flu vaccine, DVD players, cars, heat for our homes, or much else really. We'd still be living in caves.

Yet, I sit here day after day and watch as creationists deny science in almost every possible way. If creationists had their way, we'd still be living in those ancient caves.

If creationists had their way, Intelligent Design would be taught in schools in place of science.

Many questions have been asked such as "If we developed from monkeys, then how come there are still monkeys" and "Where is the missing link?". All of these show that there is a severe lack of education that needs to be rememedied and people should be extremely ashamed of.

Earlier tonight someone posted a link to something on You Tube. I followed the link and saw something interesting but it wasn't what really caught my eye.

contd......

You've asked for your answers and while I was browsing, I found them.

A video of Ken Miller doing a lecture on Intelligent Design. He's one of the formost cellular biologists in the world and a very intelligent man.

He debunks every single one of Intelligent Designs Theories.

In this video he addresses the missing link, genetic drift, genetic structure, natural selection, mutation, and every possible proof he can think of to debunk ID. Including why humans have 46 chromosomes while every other primate has 48 (and its not why you think).

The most interesting thing? This man is a Roman Catholic so he's a Christian. Just like you.

Now, this video isn't a short one. It's about two hours long. But if you want to become educated, this video will answer all your questions.

And so, for your perusal, a fantastic rebuttal of ID.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVRsWAjvQSg&search=Evolution%20Debate%20Creationism%20Intelligent%20Design

Ahh, but neither of you can be bothered to let me finish can you? Perhaps actually reading the full amount of what I posted would be good hmm?

And, I ask you, after you've seen what you're about to see in that video, can you honestly say to me that Intelligent Design is fact?

Its most definately not nonsense. Not if you understand Evolution. Thats something spouted by people that are afraid their religion will be put into doubt.

If you can't feel free to question, you're not free at all, are you?

Ahh I see, you're unwilling to actually watch the video to see the proof. You've just proven that you're unwilling to even remotely consider the facts and invalidated your whole argument by being completely unwilling to even consider the subject in its entirety.

Fear is never a good thing. So be courageous. View the information and learn for yourselves. You'll be amazed at what you find.

You see, he even addresses the common argument "It's a theory" and why evolution is not a theory. He even breaks down what that means in science.

But then, do you actually care about that? You aren't willing to consider the evidence, so you don't care, do you?

And, by so doing, you invalidate your argument because you're unwilling to consider an alternative answer.

I think many people here haven't even watched the video. They aren't even willing to consider it.

And not a single person has actually answered the question I posed because of it (with the exception of Santa Parrot. Thank you Santas Parrot. :) ).

Thank you to the very few Christians I've seen on here willing to even remotely give science an inch. You I can agree to disagree with. It's those that insist that ID be taught in schools as fact that I have a problem with.

And, as Ken Miller says in his video "Intelligent Design is forcing a student to choose between god or evolution. And, if you choose evolution, then you must be denying god."

Daniel, again, you didn't watch the video did you? It explained the missing link in there. It also explained how missing links work. But are you patient enough to actually watch it? As I recall, there's a saying common in Christianity... "Patience is a virtue". Apparently you have non, so are you virtuous?

me, five years ago, I saw an article about a man who'd solved the mathmatical equation for god in Scientific American. Yes, it was even on the news. Two years later, other mathematicians showed that his mathematical equations were not just wrong but so badly wrong they were actually laughing about it.

I sincerely doubt that all genetics could go back to one single woman. Though I imagine it can be made to seem so if someone is religiously desperate enough to prove themselves right.

Kirk, I agree with you but you can already see the thumbs down. They arent even willing to see the evidence. This man makes much better arguments in his lecture than I (or anyone else) could possibly say in 1000 letters on the YA forums.

I don't understand how someone can refuse to become educated.

And I still have yet to see an actual answer to my question. I'm beginning to think they're so afraid of questioning, that they aren't even remotely willing to argue properly.

The second law is only applicable to macroscopic systems. The second law is actually a statement about the probable behavior of an isolated system. As larger and larger systems are considered, the probability of the second law being practically true becomes more and more certain. For any system with a mass of more than a few picograms, the second law is true to within a few parts in a million.

It also only applies to closed systems. You aren't in a closed system are you? And so it does not apply.

This your argument about the Second Law of Thermodynamics means absolutely nothing.

rav, the problem is if I were to show you the evidence that supports evolution, I'd have to be in your presence to do so. And you'd probably not believe it anyway. Which is why I said to watch the video because he does a VERY good job of explaining it without having to be in your presence.

I have extremely limited space on here to teach you anything but theres a two hour long video that will probably teach you more than you've ever known about the Theory of evolution that you're simply not willing to watch.

If you're not willing to educate yourself, that's your problem not mine. But it does say that your assumption Intelligent Design is fact is invalid because you don't have the education, or the proof, to back up anything you say. Guess what, it's only a theory on your part. Hows them apples?

howfuzzy, if that were the case, you'd still be living in a cave.

ibn, I really have to say thank you. That's the first truly intelligent and thought out answer that I've seen in reply to any of these questions.

But you make a supposition here, that because science has not proven that god does or does not exist, that he therefore MUST exist when that simply isn't the case.

The proper answer is that science has not YET proven whether there is or is not a god.

But that does not invalidate Evolution as the method by which all life became as it currently is on this planet.

Though there is the question of "morality" that is a fairly valid question.

Ian Malcolm in the movie Jurassic Park said it quite well "Your scientists were so concerned with whether they could do it that they didn't stop to think if they should".

But thats not a question for religion, it's a question for morality which isn't regulated by religion (despite its claims) but by society instead.

Josh, sadly, I think you just invalidated your answer when you said that I think we came from apes. Whats happened is that you still don't understand a word that was said and are still making false claims.

Its really a very little thing, you know. To understand that evolution doesn't say we came from apes. Not once, anywhere, does it say that. Only creationists and the uneducated say that.

novangelis, unfortunately I'm forced to agree with you. Sad, isn't it?

lexie, creation size has no merit because it isn't science. Its a belief. And creationists will ignore blantant facts in front of their nose if it gets in the way of their belief. You've seen it here and probably many other places as well.

Creation scientists look only for ways to prove creation right. Thats not looking at both sides. Its a very biased way to work and most scientific communities wouldn't even consider that science.

I think its you with the problem if you can't learn to accept that.

Answer 1

I asked a question like this just the other day.. If Darwin's theory of Evolution is not possible what proof do you have that it's not.. The only answers I could get are that the bibles says so or something of that sort... And another thing that I don't understand is when people say that we didn't evolve from apes, because they are still around... What does this have to prove? Why would the Ape population have to die out, just because humans evolved from them? Scientists already have proven how a spieces can evolve in todays time.. They have done studies on Stickle Back fish and can see the evolution in progress... A Stickle Back fish has 2 pretruding bone structures on the back half of their bodies.. These resemble miniture legs or fins... It is a defense mechanism use to prevent larger fish from eating them... When a fish tries to swallow them they pretrude their rear legs or fins and the larger fish can't swallow them... Now scientists have taken identicle Stickle Back fish, with their rear appentages in place and preformed this test. When placed in a tank with living trout the stickle back fish used their rear fins as protection against the trout... Their offspring natuaraly were born with the same fins.. But when another group of the same fish, with the same fins were placed in a tank that had no enviormenatl threat, it was almost immediately 1/2 of the next offspring were born without the rear fins... That people is eveolution in the making... And the other fish didn't have to die out to make this new type of fish... What it came down to is not even a seperate gene that made the other fish born without the fins, it was a simple chemical the was not released to activate the gene that makes the fins grow... So in otherwards genes don't even need to be present to make a change in animals, just the chemical makeup... i feel it's that certain chemical makeup that can fill in those missing links... And when it comes to religion, why is it so taboo to think evolution is wrong.. I am a catholic, and I believe in God very strongly... I look at it this way, what if God was the one that started everything just by a snap of his fingers, and now he's just sittin back watchin haow everything turns out... And when it comes to the bible, come on... Adam & Eve started the human race? Seriously, if you read the bible it says that Adam& Eve had 3 sons.. Cane, Abel,& Seth... Now the bible said that Cane killed Abel, and when he did he was banished to the neighboring tribe... Where the hell did this tribe come from? Also are you gonna say that Eve procreated with her sons to further the human race? The bible is a book that represents the events of the past, but the bible has been rewrote so many times that things have been exagerated quite abit... Most of it is true, but some of it is far fetched...

Answer 2

Some evolve as a result of a chromosome being became OFF, the genetic expertise is not continually stronger. You might recognize this if you happen to learn something external of creationist/evolution bashing internet sites. The complete factor in consistently having to replace vaccines and antibiotics is considering those little men are evolving. How paleontologists become aware of evolution is via fossils i.e. the dates of fossils discovered and the physiological alterations going on during species. MUTATION IS THE DRIVING FORCE OF EVOLUTION. You can't say provide an explanation for evolution BUT go away out mutation and model. That is like make an car with out an engine...you cannot.

Answer 3

Don't bother preaching to the pro-smallpox crowd. They want to be ignorant.

They are so ignorant that they think that the second law of thermodynamics appies to Earth which is not a closed system. They completely ignore the fact that if the Earth were a closed system, life couldn't exist, much less evolve. They don't understand that the energy in sunlight, absorbed by plants and then consumed by animals, counteracts the entropy they cite as the reason evolution cannot take place. They do not understand science. They just regurgitate pseudoscientific babble.

Answer 4

Why are things so Black and White. Many scientists are religious also. Look if science exists (which it does) and God exists (which he does) then is it possible the two can be together. In my mind God is the ultimate scientist in that he knows and can control the properties of an atom and smaller. Is it possible that God evolved Man to "Adam" and Eve. Yes, in evolution there has to be a "waking" point when man was able to think clearly on there own, that was Adam. Religiously, We don't know how long Adam was in the Garden, so couldn't he been the first to think. Look God knows what he is doing, and it's not our place to guess him. to discover and learn yes, but not to put words into his mouth.

Answer 5

OK!, I watched the video and it was interesting. I didn't hear anything in the video that would threaten my faith in god creating our universe. However, I did come to realize why so many people of faith are threatened by this. It comes down to the simple definition of the word faith.

Faith -----A belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.

There are many different varieties of faith. Some people have based their believes on literal translations of the bible or a word for word approach. Which contradicts the meaning of faith itself. Being they need some form of a fact "a written word" in order to justify their faith. Once new facts are given to them "pieces of the puzzle of creation" it requires them to question their faith. I think this is why people of faith have raised issues with the evollution theory. They feel that their faith is being constantly attacked. Indeed it is! I won't quote scripture here, but Jesus speaks about people of this type of faith in many of his parables.

Another thing I have come to realize is the evolution theory will never disprove god exists, It can only give you a reason or justification, not to believe in god. A discovery will never be made that can disprove God. However, it is possable for a scientific discovery to prove God exist one day. If you wait until then to believe, it will be to late.

I have Faith in God, it's not based on any logical believe or material evedince. It's strong and cannot be threatened. God created the the earth and all living things. The order in which he did it and from whom or what i don't need to know.

So, Thank you for the link and for the opportunity to grow my faith even more.

Answer 6

This subject has to be put to rest. We agree to disagree. I know it's not monkeys evolutionists talk about. It's a common ancestor with apes. I do believe in micro-evolution. See I am a Christian who knows something about science. I just think micro-evolution is adaptation or mutation. I think God designed creatures to go with the flow to ensure their survival. I think that would be intelligent, don't you? But the species, although having new characteristics, is still the same species. I will never believe that we are an accident. I will always believe in Our Creator. Science can try to prove all it wants and it will only strengthen my belief.

Merry Christmas.

Answer 7

You could also research one of the world's most brilliant men of all time, Albert Einstein. He believed that science is the study of God's creation. In order to prove evolution, you would have to take all things into account. The great flood of Noah's time caused great disaster so it would be impossible to tell what "millions of years" old things are and how they came to be. Even today, it is only referred to as the theory of evolution and nothing more. No lecture, even a four hour one, could have the answers.

Answer 8

And what makes you think you are the expert on the subject of evolution? What exactly makes you think you are more qualified than the creationist scientists,who have exactly the same degrees of education as evolutionist scientists? Does creationists scientist's belief in God really make them less intelligent and less qualified to study science? Are you so biased and close/small-minded as to think that creation science really has no merits whatsoever? Unless you look at the scientific facts from both sides of this debate,you have no right to call us severely uneducated when it is crystal clear who the real uneducated people here are - those who have only bothered to look at one side of the issue. At least creationists study and research both evolution and creation before they come to any conclusions. Evolution has too many unanswered questions,not to mention totally illogical conclusions made to fit the evolution model,while creation answers everything,not only biblically but scientifically,as well. It only takes an open inquisitive mind for the truth to be realized. You can't continue to dismiss the scientific evidence creation science has and call yourself fully educated on the evolution vs. creation debate.
The real fact here is that those who don't believe in God are,by prejudice,going to except evoution as fact,even though there are innumerable problems in the theory. The fact that creation science is the one pointing out the problems of evolution is all it takes for you people to ignore them. That,my friend,is called being indoctrinated by the one and only science you will allow yourself to believe....the science of evolution. Sounds like true brainwashing to me.


EDIT : Just to clarify, I am by no means against all the life-changing benefits science has given mankind. But when those in science abuse their power and try to make themselves out as being "gods",that is when I start questioning the motives behind their science. Power and fame are potent reasons for many big names in the scientific field to promote themselves and indoctrinate their beliefs unto unsuspecting and gullible people who are willing to believe anything they say in the name of science. Many scientists are willing to do whatever it takes to be considered the "authority" in their particular field of science. After all,a few lies,alterations,or even a few well-organized hoaxes to promote what they believe won't hurt anyone,right?

Answer 9

Look dude, show me the empirical evidence of an actual observation of one species becoming another species. And don't give me the changing finch beaks and fruit flies and bacteria adaptation because that doesn't suffice. Darwinists have this peculiarly religious habit of extrapolating macroevolution from microevolution, a purely faith based conclusion. They belch out this universal mandate that all beliefs must be empirically verified yet the "scientific" belief that all life arose spontaneously without intelligent design has not and can never be empirically verified and not even the most brilliant minds in science have the foggiest idea how DNA could magically organize itself in the first life form. I love it when you guys do that because it exposes your worldview to be a mere faith based philosophy. Please, at least be intellectually honest and say you cannot empirically defend a naturalistic origin of life.

Answer 10

OKAY, I listened to this guy and he seems to say nothing, but the same jargon used among many evolutionists. He tends to belittle creation scientists as a group of people who don't understand science or its meaning. Further, he states evolutionism as fact, and a theory based on facts. However, he never gave blatant facts to back his notion. He only continued to prod through several topics in an attempt to debunk creation science. I, having listened to both sides, understand creation scientists don't totally deny evolution happening in small, or limited circumstances. However, they deny evolution over a period of billions, and billions of years. I've listed some sites, however not exhaustive, still some decent starting points.

http://www.answersincreation.org/index.htm
http://www.answersincreation.org/rebuttal/aig/daily/20060505_takingdinos.htm
http://www.drdino.com/contact.php
http://www.cfni.org/books.php
http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/
http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs

Lastly, if you want to believe we came from apes. Be my guest.