Shock Collars... Cruel or not cruel?

Question

I have no opinion on this, just getting yours.

Why are you guys yelling at me? I don't have one on my dog, and besides, I said I have no opinion. So please stop saying "Wear one and see how you feel!" Just getting opinions from you here, not hostile behavior....

lovemylab, are you implying that I'm lazy? My dog is perfectly well behaved, I have trained my dog for hours on end... I never said I was going to use a shock collar, I feel so insulted....

Answer 1

"there is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance --- that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
Herbert Spencer

I trained a lot of dogs before the e-collar was even invented, and for a fact the only reason the e-collar even exists is because a trainer felt that there had to be a more humane way to train a dog than what we were doing.
Condemnation of the e-collar comes from pure ignorance, and no where else.
NO TRAINING DEVICE HAS THE ABILITY TO BE CRUEL, that distinction belongs to the person using the device.
Over the years I have seen far more dogs abused with a normal flat buckle collar than with an e-collar
The e-collar is nothing but a one mile long leash, and is used exactly like any other leash. I have to laugh at those that say "put it on yourself and see how it feels" if you only knew ;)
The very first step to fitting a dog with an e-collar is to place the dogs normal training collar (choke chain or whatever) around your forearm and MATCHING the intensity of a correction with the dog normal lead to the intensity of the e-collar. This way the two have exactly the same meaning to the dog. I see little advantage in using an e-collar on a house pet (except maybe for teaching recall), but if you are going to train your dog to "handle" the e-collar is a God-send

LoveMyLab
As a Lab owner you should have at least some inclination of the kind of games we play with Labs. Take the time to go to a Field Trial or Hunt Test and see what these magnificent animals are capable of doing, when they are properlly trained. But I warn you, you will see very few dogs there that were not e-collar trained.

Answer 2

Intresting question - they have their place if properly used. Imagine a dog that is constantly jumping the fence. Eventually her will probably get hit by a car become seriously injured or even killed. What is more humane? Allowing this to happen or using a device that can curb that behavior. You must know how to effectively use the collar as a learning device and not to torture your friend. Electronic collars offer effective training and behavior modification when properly used by a knowledgable professional. Never leave the collar on 24 - 7. Only during training exercises. I have been an AKC certified Canine Good Citizen trainer for more than 15 years. A well trained and obedient dog is a blessing to any family where as an untrained pet is a constant chore.

Answer 3

I do not use e-collars. But I do believe that there are cases in which e-collars are a valuable training device....snake adversion for one.

I have read the responses, I highly doubt many of these responses are based on nothing more that an emotional out cry to the term shock collar. If you use the term e-collar, half these people would not have had a clue. In fact, it is real easy to tell who has real dog experience in here from those are just know it alls.

Tom is correct.....more dogs have been injured by the common every day flat buckle collar.

In fact, an INEXPERIENCED (note the word) dog handler is more apt to cause injury with the ever poplar quick-fix device know as the Gentle Leader than an e-collar.

Answer 4

No not cruel when used properly, and yes my shock collar (used only for off leash training in public areas) has also been used on me-my arm up to level six when I decided it hurt. This collar saved my dog from being hit by a car and attacked by another dog. It improved his recall by a thousand percent and I don't give a crap what everyone else thinks! My dog used the collar for about a month of outdoor training so less than 24 hours and he is great off leash now. Rewards are now installed on some models and training videos and guides are supplied. If needed, use it, don't loose your dog to a lack of exercising all options!

Answer 5

Like it or not........And now I am going to make everybody mad.....There are cases when a shock collar is the only option left training a dog. ..especially if the dogs behavior is life threatening. I know a man who resorted to a shock collar because his dog was a regular Houdini. The dog could get out of any enclosure he was put in,,,,,,,,covered, locked , crate whatever.. the dog was a house dog and escaped from the house through a plate glass window almost killing it. over 60 stitches He spent three days off from work and put a shock collar on his dog. Stood outside and each time the dog came to the window shocked it. The dog will not go towards the windows anymore. I personally think they are cruel but not as cruel as dropping off at the pound or letting the dog get hurt...As much as I hate to say it ... I know what he went through.......It worked.

Answer 6

I once had an elderly lady for a friend. She had a wonderful little dog. A mix of some sort. She had the dog trained well and it behaved very well. Learn here https://tr.im/Oy0xT

She kept an uncovered candy dish on her coffee table with candy in it. The dog was forbidden to eat the candy. When she was in the room observing the dog he did not even appear to notice the candy. One day while she was in her dinning room she happened to look in a mirror and could see her dog in the living room. He did not know he was being watched. For several minutes he was sitting in front of the candy bowl staring at the candy. Finally he reached in and took one. He placed it on the table and stared at it, he woofed at it. He stared some more, licked his chops and PUT IT BACK in the bowl and walked away. Did he want the candy, oh yeah. Did he eat it? Nope. They can be trained that well but most, I'll admit, are not trained that well. When I was a young boy, maybe 5 years old. We had a german shepherd. He was very well trained also. My mom could leave food unattended on the table, no problem. She would open the oven door and set a pan roast beef or roast chicken on the door to cool. No problem. He would not touch it, watched or not. But butter? Whole other story. You leave a stick of butter anywhere he could reach and it was gone. He was a large shepherd so there were not many places he could not reach. Really, I think the number of dogs trained to the point they will leave food alone when not being supervised is very small indeed.
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Now if we are talking obedience training, not food grubbing, that is a different story. Way back when I was first learning obedience training one of the final exercises was to put our dogs in a down/stay and not only leave the room but leave the building for 15 minutes. The only person that stayed was our trainer, not the owners. Most of the dogs in my class did not break their stay, which would be an automatic fail. I'm happy to report my dog was one of the ones that passed.

Answer 7

I think it depends on what you are going to use it for. I've used them and i think they do work WHEN USED PROPERLY. I don't believe in starting training with one but for very advanced training it is a great tool. If you are teaching advanced obedience then it is great for the recall and anti aggression. If you are doing protection training, they can be used to teach a dog to not take food off the ground or from a strangers hand.

The biggest thing with any training collar (leather agitation collars, choke chains, fur savers, prongs, e-collars, and the Belgium punisher (nails on a leather belt)) is that most people think they can train a dog using a simple nylon snap link collar. Little do they know that a dog that wants something IS GOING TO break that collar. Also, it depends on the dogs character that determines what types of collars are going to be used. For example, on a soft dog that responds quickly to verbal correction you should not use a prong or a Belgium punisher. ON the other hand, a dog that you can lift off the ground by the collar and hold him up their for many minutes before he drops an item after yelling and pulling on the leash obviously need something harder to correct him. Hell, think of this, MOST schutzhund/IPO/KNPV titled dog have used at least choke chains because of their temperament. They are normal training tools. Do all dogs need them, No. Should all dogs use them, No. If you have a dog that is hard or stubborn, Yes.

Answer 8

I'd say it's cruel to use pain to train. Off the top of my head, I can't think of a situation where there isn't an alternative.

If a dog is taught that it can rely on it's owner for protection, then it's easy to minimize their barking.

On the other hand, some breeds are virtually bred to bark. Hard to justify asking an animal to behave in contradiction to it's breeding.

Cruelty is often a bedfellow of convenience though. So it'll be hard to convince erm.. the cruel lol, that they are indeed cruel, when they've found something that serves them :P

P.S. the statement about having tried one on is totally irrelevant. The conductivity, grounding, and nerve sensitivity of a dog are highly variable and not the same as those of a person. Further, the person chooses the option with an understanding, whereas the dog has niether choice nor understanding in the situation. Fear contributes to pain.

Answer 9

Since having a dog for the first time...training (any kind) could be considered cruel. You have to yank their collar if you want them to heel. You have to speak stern if you want them to sit.(while training of course). It's pretty ruff stuff if you want a well trained and behaved pet. And all of the pet owners that don't agree with me probably have pets that run the show in their households.

Answer 10

Definately cruel! Would you like shock therapy? That is the lazy man's way out of TRAINING their dog!!!!!!!

No I'm not implying anything, stating my opinion like you asked for. You didn't state that you were using one and I didn't state that you were lazy. I said people who use them to keep their dog "in line" are lazy. There are several alternatives to shock collars. There are static collars which are less "shocking", spray collars which let out a slight citrus mist that dogs don't like to deter them from what they are doing. If you watch the Dog Whisperer you'll see several ways. Last night it took him all of a few minutes to break a dog's habit of running away every time she got near the front door by simple methods such as shushing her and using hand gestures.