Christians, read this! I have listened to you plenty of times before; COLLECTIVE HEAVEN?

Question

I have read a little bit about the collective heaven theory, and I don't understand how it's possible. In the post on here about 'debunking a collective heaven,' the author asks about pizza as an example. The best response I saw to this question was that everyone's favorite type of pizza would be served. This makes sense, of course...But, here is one point that I truly cannot understand. I smoke. I smoke like a damn chimney. If I go to heaven there will be smoking if I desire it, correct? Well, then what about all the people who DON'T want smoking in heaven? Do they go to heaven too? The bible doesn't say smoking is bad, but it does say heaven is perfect, so how would we all go to heaven? Would there be smoking? Correct me if I'm wrong...But doesn't this prove Christianity wrong? Do not complain to me about trying to fight your religion, I seek knowledge, not anti-christians...If you are offended by this post you should re-read it and realize that I am honestly curious.

razor

Brinlarr, what if I still wanted to smoke? If I couldn't smoke it wouldn't be heaven, but if I smoked and you were there it wouldn't be heaven. Is there a cigarette or not?

Starrwoode, if we didn't have those things to do in heaven, would it be heaven? It seems like Christians are saying that they don't have any idea what heaven looks like or how it feels, they just think it's the perfect place for some reason. How does that make sense? They know nothing about a place that they call heaven.

Impossble_Dream, read the post above. That is exactly what I'm talking about. You are a prime example of the paragraph above. Good job.

Derek K, you cannot tell me to stop smoking. If I smoke, I'll get to heaven faster than you. So ha!

So you say, you are just like Impossble_Dream.

Odindmar, it sounds like you are saying that in heaven, people will see what they want to see. They will not see what really happens, they will paint their own picture. Reminds me of The Matrix. Could be true.

razor

Answer 1

It's a proven fact that smoking is bad for your health. If it's bad for your body, then it's one of satans ploys to keep you from doing whats best. We're supposed to take good care of our bodies.
Romans 12:1, "I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service." We know this verse is true and we ought to present our bodies a living sacrifice to a most holy God. With this in mind, let me ask you, did your first use of tobacco come at the suggestion of God? Were you in church services when the pastor convinced you, from the Word of God, that you ought to use tobacco? Or did someone other than a faithful servant of God introduce you to tobacco?
Do you use tobacco in the name (by the authority) of the Lord Jesus? Does the Spirit of God lead you in the use of tobacco? Romans 8:5, "So they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the spirit the things of the spirit."
I Corinthians 10:31, "Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God:". When you use tobacco, can you give God the glory for using it? Or do you wish you had never started using tobacco? Can you thank God that you use tobacco?

Would Christ have used tobacco? That's very doubtful, isn't it? If you use tobacco, are you being like Christ?

I Corinthians 6:19, "What, know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?" When we are saved, our body becomes the temple of the Holy Ghost, and we shouldn't defile the dwelling place of the Holy Ghost with ungodly tobacco usage.

Answer 2

Since this is addressed to Christians, I'll tell you what I've learned about Heaven from the Bible. First, it will be inhabited by "changed" people. Paul says, "We will not all sleep (die), but we will all be changed, in a monent, in the twinkling of an eye." We wll become "incorruptible." The Book of Revelation says that "nothing impure will ever enter into it." So I take that to mean that we won't be exactly as we are now and won't have the same drives and desires we do here. Here on earth, I'm sure we all have our own idea of what Heaven should be like, just as we all have diverse and incomplete perceptions of God, but when we get there, we'll understand why it's the way it is and we will not be sitting around disconteted because of the food or the lack of smoking sections. The particulars won't be known until we're there, but if we trust God, we can relax, knowing that we'll have peace, love and joy there without impurity. Whatever that means!

Answer 3

Everyone gets their own pizza! lol

I understand your point. Have you see the movie What Dreams May Come, Starring Robin Williams ( and a few other great actors that I can't remember the names to) The theory there was everyone paints their own heaven. There are places in heaven in which people can meet, if they wanted to.

The problem here is trying to explain a divine place using material metaphor. My advice, is not to worry about it. If you chose to, yes, you can smoke in heaven. And no, the non-smokers won't complain because to them, you're not smoking.

Is smoking a sin? no. Killing some one with second hand smoke is. So, if you can smoke in such away that you don't effect anothers heal, smoke away.

Answer 4

I dont really buy the collective heaven theory because simply, what we DO know about heaven according to the Bible is that it is eternal peace and there will be no more pain, sorrow, death nor sin so regardless of WHAT it is, bad things dont exist there so even if we cant smoke in heaven, we wont miss it (I smoke like a chimney also) and if we CAN smoke in heaven, the non smokers wont be offended. It's all around peace, not "well John likes snow so it will be snowy in Heaven for him and Jane likes summer so it will always be 85 degrees for her" it is that neither John nor Jane will be concerned with the weather, they will be at peace always.

Answer 5

i think i missed the post you were speakin of however spritualists believe that each religion creates their own heavens and hells through the power of collective counsciousness ,They believe they are not actual in true unity with the Creator but a dead end along the way , a good happy type of purgatory if you will, so by that respect i'm not sure about the deatils like pizza and smokes but Muslim and Christains would go to different places as would different denominations of Christianity go to a sepearte palce for each only those not bound by this collective counciosness to truely progress and return to the creative source not really waht i believe but just thought i'd throw some interseting philosphy in

Answer 6

This is going to sound funny, expecially to people who know me, but here goes, NO that dosn't prove anything, and this is coming from a Satanist! LOL. Your theory is flawed from the beginning seeing most people who dislike smoking, just dont want to die from cancer and since we are talking about heaven and thus everyone there is already dead, I dont see too many people complaining. Now dont get me wrong the christian mythology is indeed flawed as well and there are many many more suitable arguments to disprove it. This is just a bad example of one. If you want better arguments, ask where did Noah get kangaroos, or who did Kane sleep with to create the third generation, or better still look to the garden of eden, Satan tells Eve that if she eats from the tree of knowlege "your eyes will become open and you will be as gods knowing the difference between good and evil", God said "for in the very day that you eat of this fruit you will surely die", "and she ate from the tree and her eyes were opened and she was as gods knowing the difference between good and evil..." -genisis. You could argue that Satan was not the first Liar that the church says he was but rather GOD himself lied to them both and purposely withheld knowlege. These are just examples of course and can be argued, at great length, for days still without changing one brainwashed mind. Let them believe what they will their faith keeps them sheep, mine makes me the wolf.

Answer 7

In the bible it does say not to smoke. It says that your body is a temple and we should take care of it. Smoking kills your body, so it is a sin, your doing what God does not want you to do, that is a sin. So realize you are sinning and quit. And what are you going on about pizza for, I wish I read the other question so I knew what you were talking about.

Answer 8

Heaven also isn't about having a magic genie to fulfill your wildest desires either. Its about being in a place that you can finally meet God face to face and learn to love him more and more. Smoking, eating, drinking, etc will all be dull compared to what we will experience there. I can't explain what it will be like. My one teacher compared it to this... A baby before it is born swims around in fluid inside of its mother. Now lets pretend the baby can understand a person talking to it. The person tries to explain how the ocean is. They say that it is like what the baby is floating it now, only millions of times bigger, and that it tastes different, and has other living things in it. Now, that baby would be able to understand some things about the ocean, you can swim in it, its wet, there will be other things in it, but until it is born and actually sees that ocean, it will never have a good sense of what it is actually like. Hope this helps...

Answer 9

Although the thought of heaven being what everyone desires seems good.....it does not go along with teachings. The main point that is missing here is simple. Our desires that we have in the flesh will no longer exist outside of the flesh. We will not have bondage of any fleshly desires. Our views will be Christ like in our thinking. Our mind can not fathom the levels of this understanding because we have nothing in the flesh to compare it to. It is beyond our reason or ability to comprehend what heaven will really be like.

Answer 10

I appreciate your honest question. I don't know for sure about smoking, but I feel it is a sin, and sin will not be allowed in Heaven. We will have a different kind of body and I don't think you will even want to smoke. I am a Dr. Pepper fanatic, I hope we have Dr. Pepper there! Guess we'll have to wait and see. It's gonna be great!