Catholic the original Christian?

Question

I have a fair amount of respect for the Catholic church, I appreciate the good they have done and the scriptures they have preserved. However I don't understand why they think they are the first and original true Christian church. Wasn't it Constantine 325 yrs after the death of Christ (and all the apostles) that the Nicaean creed was writen in an attempt to legitamize Christianity? A LOT can be warped in 300 years. Who gave them the authority in the first place? Constantine had power but that doesn't make his ideas any more right than other Christians of the day. Remember how Paul admonished the churches to stay on track and how far they strayed in so short a time. After the death of the apostles and 325 years of apostacy what makes people think the council could put truth back together? Faith has to be based on truth doesn't it?

I mean no offense, I have just felt frustration an my inability to understand the issues. I am interested in world religions but I prefer to get my information from authorities of the faith in question, not from well meaning but misinformed people of other faiths.

Answer 1

You're right. The original church of Christ fell into apostacy and disappeared from the earth, to be restored in the last days. The Catholic belief is that Peter (head of the church after Christ died) gave his Priesthood to a bishop, who became the first Pope. However, that can't be proven and some evidence shows that Peter died a few years before the bishop claimed he was given the Priesthood. Also, Peter was an apostle and would not have given apostolic power to bishop. The man who claimed the power became the first Pope and every Pope after that was voted upon by men - never chosen by God. Some Popes were extremely evil, some forced or bribed their way into the position, and none of them ever held the Priesthood power. Many are good men, true, but they are not God's chosen, and their church and teachings are very different from Christ's church as set forth in the Bible. (Baptism by immersion, not infant sprinkling; leaders will be a prophet and 12 apostles, not a Pope; no mention of nuns or priests or celibacy, no mention of granting sainthood to men; no mention of Mary being divine or accepting prayers; no mention of a trinity, they don't believe in revelation, and where are tithing and temples?)

You're right. Faith is based on truth. Seek and ye shall find.

Answer 2

Only the Holy Spirit can help. If you do not believe the Catholic Church embodies the Fullness of the Truth, it is either because the Holy Spirit has chosen not to bestow upon you the gift of Faith, at least not yet. Or, the Holy Spirit has indeed offered you this gift, and you rejected it.

Either way, whatever your source(s) of Catholic history are, it is clear that they are less than honest. Might I recommend the book, "Triumph: The Power and Glory of the Catholic Church.

It's an entirely synoptic account of the Church's first 2,000 years. It exemplifies the Church's accomplishments, but does not shy away from detailing it's mistakes either.

I highly recommend it. That is, if an honest history is what you are looking for. Good luck.

Let's pretend - for a moment - that the Catholic Church did start in 313. It would still predate ALL other Christian denominations. Eastern Orthodox did not go off on it's own until 1054, and Protestantism didn't get it's start for centuries after that.

If you want to argue that Catholic Doctrine has become corrupted in a mere 325 years - a claim which you cannot verify beyond your own unsubstantiated assumption - how does any alleged corruption of Catholic Doctrine prove other Christian denominations have it right? When you consider that Catholicism was the first Christian denomination, it is hard to believe any denominations branching off the original are going to be any more accurate.

Answer 3

just to clarify, i am not Catholic. and i make no apolgies or excuses for their teachings.

You assume that Constantine was the author of the Nicean Creed. This is not true.
Constantine only called the bishops of the churchs together to cannonize the scriptures and define the basics of belief of the christian church. Those beliefs are based on the scriptures and are NOT individual ideas.
What makes you so sure that in the 325 years of the christian church across the mediterranen that all those fellowships fell into apostacy? The truth did not have to be put back together because is was never broken

Faith is not based on anything tangible.

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. (Hebrews 11:1)

Perhaps you have not read the Nicene Creed, it is quite simple and agrees with scripture.
Here is a link. Please read it. I am sure all Christians would agree with it. Regardless of their Denomination

Answer 4

Quick answer to your first query: Nope.

There were already "early Christians" [or followers of the Christ, see Acts 11:26] or sometimes referred to as "Nazarenes" [see Acts 24:5] DURING the public ministry of Yeshua/Jesus and they proliferated through the first centuries immediately following His death. Actually, these 'early Christians' were the ones that the Romans fed to the lions in their coliseum for their Sunday entertainment matinee since the NFL hadn't been organized just yet... lol.

But you're right about Emperor Constantine, who organized the first all-encompassing, universal [hence the word 'catholic' is used] and the state-sanctioned Church which was appropriately named the Roman Catholic Church following the Nicaean Council around 325 AD. The church leaders were given official state powers to govern throughout the entire Roman Empire, which covered all of the civilized world at that time.

So... in a way perhaps, the RCC is the "original" ORGANIZED church that incorporated the teachings of Yeshua Messiah --whom they called thereafter "Jesus Christ", which is the Roman translation of "Iesus Kristos", the Greek version of His original Aramaic name-- and the practices and traditions of the then Roman pagan religion worshipping the Sol Invictus, the Sun god, on Sunday instead of the Sabbath and so forth and so on...

Insofar as her teachings and doctrines, all other anomalies that DEPART from what the Bible mentions is the result of what had been discussed and voted upon by the bishops and church elders of Rome and other outlying cities that attended that first Nicaean Council...

In fact, if you really want to dig a little deeper, you will notice that--since the RCC was commissioned to compile all the existing sacred texts and scrolls into one set of books [Greek, 'biblios' for books]-- the New Testament as a whole essentially goes more in-depth and more in-line with Paulinian doctrines --which suited the RCC much better at the time-- rather than staying true to the original early Christian ones that was practised by James, the Righteous... The latter, as you may know, was the brother of Yeshua and he became His successor of the early church and who became the first Bishop of Jerusalem...

Peace be with you!

Answer 5

Ignatius of Antioch, written in the year 110.

"Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop or by one whom he ordains [i.e., a presbyter]. Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church" (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]).

What "Catholic" Means
http://www.catholic.com/library/What_Catholic_Means.asp

CHURCH & PAPACY
http://www.catholic.com/library/church_papacy.asp

Here is a list of Popes which clearly shows an historical, unbroken line of apostolic succession from the Apostle Peter to our current Pope. I won't list them all because there isn't room here to do it.

1) St. Peter (32-67)
2) St. Linus (67-76)
3) St. Anacletus (Cletus) (76-88)
4) St. Clement I (88-97)
5) St. Evaristus (97-105)
6) St. Alexander I (105-115)
7) St. Sixtus I (115-125) -- also called Xystus I
8) St. Telesphorus (125-136)
9) St. Hyginus (136-140)
10) St. Pius I (140-155)
11) St. Anicetus (155-166)
12) St. Soter (166-175)
13) St. Eleutherius (175-189)
14) St. Victor I (189-199)
15) St. Zephyrinus (199-217)
16) St. Callistus I (217-22)
17) St. Urban I (222-30)
18) St. Pontain (230-35)
19) St. Anterus (235-36)
20) St. Fabian (236-50)
21) St. Cornelius (251-53)
22) St. Lucius I (253-54)
23) St. Stephen I (254-257)
24) St. Sixtus II (257-258)
25) St. Dionysius (260-268)
26) St. Felix I (269-274)
27) St. Eutychian (275-283)
28) St. Caius (283-296) -- also called Gaius
29) St. Marcellinus (296-304)
30) St. Marcellus I (308-309)
31) St. Eusebius (309 or 310)
32) St. Miltiades (311-14)
33) St. Sylvester I (314-35)

The Complete List of Popes:
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12272b.htm

260) Pius XI (1922-39)
261) Pius XII (1939-58)
262) Blessed John XXIII (1958-63)
263) Paul VI (1963-78)
264) John Paul I (1978)
265) John Paul II (1978-2005)
266) Benedict XVI (2005—)

Answer 6

The Church started with Jesus who gave the keys to Peter. Catholics claim Peter was the first Pope, around 30 A.D., give or take a few years.

Mt 16:18 -
And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.

IMO the Catholic church was the first church, but over the years they have gone the way of the "traditions of men." The true church today is the believers in Christ, the people, not a denomination.

Answer 7

The followers of Jesus, after His death, were first called Christians at Antioch. In the beginning of the Christian religion there was only one church. The Church separated in 1054 into the Eastern Church and the Western Church. The Church at Rome became the Roman Catholic Church. The Church in the East called themselves the Orthodox.

I have answered this question in great detail before, so this is the short version.

Answer 8

Did Christ not say to Peter, You are the Rock upon which I build my church? The gates of hell will not prevail against it and I will be with you always.

Did Christ LIE!? Should what Christ establish die with man?

The last book of the Bibles says, this is the Word of GOD, Nothing shall be added and nothing shall be taken away!

When we turn to HISTORY, what was the name given to those who followed Christ in year 600 AD, or 900 AD, or1200 AD?

Only two descriptions that are found! Christian’s or "The Church"

When, in history, do we have all the different names, starting to show up! Well after 1350 AD! Where were they from the time Christ rose until then? Christ said, "I will be with you always"
Did He lie?

Historically, all the denominations of to day can be traced back to a man? And none of the go back further than 1350!

Since they were started by man and not Christ, do you want to say that Christ had to start all over again because He failed to keep His word the first time?

Note all the Different books that have been written and given the name BIBLE! Why do the all read differently? Why would someone want a VERSION of the Bible, when it is written, NOTHING SHALL BE ADDED AND NOTHING SHALL BE TAKEN AWAY! Current America has, among others, The NEW AMERICAN BIBLE! What is this, is there some special Bible for America, different from the rest of the Christian World?

Have you not noticed that all the different denominations are negative towards Catholics? None of them can trace their beginning back, before 1350, not even up to that time?

Peter and his successors can be traced back thru history!
Christ did not abandon what He instituted!

Answer 9

Your logic is flawed and your faith is full of holes.

Jesus founded his church and promised to guide it, keep it, and to remain at the head of it until the end of the age.

When the original apostles died, they were replaced by others who were similarly consecrated to God, and so on, right up through today.

The truths they taught, and still teach, were the exact same truths Jesus taught to his apostles, and the very same truths which the Holy Spirit brought to mind for them at Pentecost.

Constantine was most certainly moved by God to do what he did, just as Cyrus of Persia was, in the old testament.

You need to put your faith in Christ AND his universal church, not in the later day false teachings of a few misguided and disgruntled men.

Anyone who claims God's one, true church was corrupted by the likes of Constantine or anyone else, makes God out to be a powerless liar.

He's not.

Answer 10

Although Emperor Constantine was a)the first Christian ruler, & b)was influential in getting the Council of Nicea going in order to challenge heresies & get the Holy Bible put together, he was not the founder of the Catholic Church, nor was he ever Pope. The Pope during Constantine's time(& the Council of Nicea)was Pope Sylvester.

The Papacy goes all the way back to St. Peter the Apostle. There were even Popes who were Martyred during the Roman Persecutions. St. Peter, being the first one.