Separation of church and state in schools--humanism and atheism?

Question

Why is the ACLU pushing for religions like secular humanism and aethism? (two separate religions--remember, a religion is an organized system of beliefs, even though many followers of these doctrines deny having any religion) If man claims to have an absence of religion, he is most likely worshipping himself, because it's like an absence of color--not possible. Something will always take its place.
Too many lawsuits outlaw any beliefs not embracing these ideas. How about we file a lawsuit to stop secular humanism and atheism from taking over our public schools--or at least allow it to balance equally with other beliefs?

Yes, black is the absence of color, but nonetheless...it's a color :)

Answer 1

One of the reasons creation is kept out of the classroom is because it centers around a creator as the reason we are here vs evolution which centers around spontaneous occurance. So in essence you have christianity vs athiesm. The constitution is often quoted by athiests and others in regards to the idea of seperation of church and state when it comes to this debate. Since creation is believed to be backed by religion, specifically Christianity, we cannot teach creation in our schools because this would violate this notion of seperation of church and state since in the minds of most people the government would be pushing one religon over all others. But is this fair?

One of the definitions of religion according to Merriam-Webster is "a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices" ~and~ "a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith." To further define it we could look at the definition of religious which includes "relating to or manifesting faithful devotion to an acknowledged ultimate reality or deity." Another important word to look at here is the word faith. Of the definitions that are given for the word faith we find the following: firm belief in something for which there is no proof, complete trust, something that is believed especially with strong conviction.

So now you may be asking where am I going with this? For a person to believe there is no God they have to do one of two things out right deny the proof of God's existence or have knowledge and proof that God does not exist. For the sake of arguement lets go with the second. Let's also assume that with in the knowledge humans contain there is no proof that God exists. Compared to all of the knowledge in the universe I will even go as far as to say that the knowledge we have makes up a whopping 1% of the total knowledge that exists in the universe. If that is true then the chances that the empirical proof for God's existence is contained with in the 99% of knowledge to which we do not possess. Based on this athiesm in and of itself is as much of a religion if not more so than any other religion, including Christianity. An athiest is religious in that they have faithful devotion to an ultimate deity or in this case as the definition suggests an ultimate reality. Since they do not believe in God they place themselves in a godhead position by putting all their faith in themselves and beiliving in an ultimately reality where a seperate entity (God) does not exist. Atheists have faith in this "religion" because they have a firm belief and complete trust in something for which there is no proof especially something that is believed with strong conviction. The fact is, there is NO proof that God doesn't exist. You would have an easier time convincing me that the world is flat than you would trying to convince me there is no proof for the existence of God.

My point is this, if athiesm is as much, if not more so a religion than any other religion based on the premise to which it is based, then everday the government is breaking the constitutional ammendment of seperation of church and state because they are promoting and pushing one religion (atheism) over all others to the point where it is evident in every subject taught and especially in the subject of science and our origins. To be fair and not push one religion over the other then it would only logically and rationally be prudent to provide ALL theories of our origins and not one over the other. Because the major element behind creationism is a divine creator it doesn't make Christianity more of a religion than athiesm. Every person, no matter their backgrounds, at some point in their life will put their faith in something. Wether it is God, themselves, an inanimate object (i.e. money, power), another god, etc. Becoming an atheist is not removing religion from your life, it is simply defining it in another method. It is taking God from a distinct and seperate entity to in essence becoming god within themselves by putting all of their beliefs and faith in themselves or as some would even say, within eachother.

And to make the statement that because a Christian who practices science is null and void because it is backed by religion is illogical since atheistic science is also backed by a religious belief and ideology. Science is not less of a science because a person is a christian any more than science is more valid because the person is an atheist. Both are still held to the same scientific laws, principles and methods when conducting experiments. An atheistic scientist's view is as much biased in their formation of theories as a christian scientist is. Science if used proper is unbiased to the persons beliefs. Science is nothing more than seeking truth and knowledge. 2+2=4 no matter how myuch everyone wants it to be 5. Another words truth is absolute. It doesn't care who you are or what you believe, but then this isn't how we conduct our scientific studies is it?

Answer 2

Actually, you answer your own question you state "a religion is an organized system of beliefs." Neither Atheism nor humanism are organized systems of beliefs. In particular atheism is definitely not a belief system but rather a tenant of many belief systems. The same is true of humanism, it isn't a system of belief but part of belief systems. For example, Budhism teaches that there is no theos, no God. It is an atheistic religion. Communism is an atheistic philosophy. Secular humanism is an atheistic philosophy.

There are two amendments to the constitution that are operative here. The first forbids Congress from supporting any "establishment of religion." Atheism is neither an estabilishment nor a religion. The methodist Church is an establishment of religion. The other amendment binds upon the states the restrictions upon the Federal government as a result of denying slaves their Federal civil rights through state constitutions. What is binding upon the Federal government became binding upon local government.

The constitution says you may put no religious idea into a state funded school. It cannot be Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism, Islam or Jainism. Atheism is not a religion, neither is humanism. Any system of thinking that has no reference to religious belief is acceptable under the constitution. This includes abhorant systems of thought as well, so good judgment is expected of the local governments as to the secular philosophy used. Secular humanism is really a gentle philosophy. Much better than say Hitler's National Socialism. Consider yourself lucky.

Answer 3

Uhhhh, you're a little confused, here. No doctrine is meant to be taught in school, and I agree with this. Now a lot of christians see the absense of doctrine as a doctrine in itself. This is untrue until the moment a teacher actively tells a child not to worship the god or gods of their respective religions. This act is not permitted, either. If your own beliefs conflict with something in school, you are allowed not to participate. For instance, Jehovah's Witnesses are not required to salute the flag because it has been deemed doctrinally problematic for them to do so.

To clear up evolution for a minute, evolution is only the theory that organisms adapt to their environments, changing their physical forms over time. How is this in conflict with the existence of god? isn't the best design one which can repair itself?

Now to explain what a theory is, since a lot of people seem to be lost on this point as well. A theory is an idea that has proven itself to be true, so far. We accept it as TRUE until we find a better theory. Don't like the current theories? Go use the scientific method to find NEW theories. That's how it works. If a theory is not true, it will eventually become outdated and be replaced by something that is more true.

Answer 4

Interesting. I attend a public school and was taught Evolution and the Big bang theory as part of my science classes. People who say creationism should be taught along side that are a little confused.
Creationism is a belief, it's part of a religion. It's not a science and in my opinion it shouldn't be regarded as one.

Everyone says that Evolution takes as much faith to believe in as creationism. Not so, one takes faith, the other takes a goddamn leap into the imadgination.

As for kicking humanism and atheism out of schools. I whole heartedly disagree. But do agree that each side should be given equal attention. Creationism should not be taught in science classes, but it can be taught in Religious studies classes where it belongs.

In my opinion no school should stand for anything except education. It should not be secular atheism, nor should it be secular christianity. It has to be an equal mix of both so each student passing through has the time and the information to make their own choice.

Answer 5

The separation of church and state are a results of two clauses of the first change to u.s. structure. those are the institution Clause and the loose workout Clause. The institution clause says that neither state nor federal authorities would set up an valid church, nor would they enact any regulations which help one faith, all religions or one faith over the different. The loose workout clause develop into extra to restrict state or federal governments from enacting regulations which restrict non secular practice. Atheism isn't a faith in any experience. there is not any doctrine there aren't any rituals there aren't any required beliefs. Evolution isn't portion of atheism in any respect. that's a clinical concept that's supported through important actual evidence besides as math and good judgment. As evolution is a clinical situation that's taught in technology instructions. Atheists are not calling for separation of church and state both. The structure does. The double familiar exists in those those who confer with themselves as strict constitutionalists and then, apparently ignorant of what the structure extremely says, ask your self the position the separation of church and state comes from and attempt to proceed as if no such idea is stumbled on contained in the structure. EDIT: through the way the word separation of church and state develop into by no skill blanketed contained in the structure without delay, it comes from the writings of Thomas Jefferson who develop into touching on the institution Clause of the first change.

Answer 6

Atheism ISN'T an organized system of beliefs. There is no atheist system of belief, kiddo, as atheism is ONLY "without belief in a god or gods". That's it. The rest is up to the individual atheist. There are no atheist prayers, no atheist holidays, no atheist rituals or sacred objects or holy lands. There is no characteristically religious feelings or supernatural communication or an organized social group.

Defining religion so broadly is a cheap trick and a sophmoric tactic. Atheism isn't a belief system for it is LACK of belief.

Atheism isn't taking over schools and neither is "Secular Humanism". Schools run by the state ARE constitutionally required to remain secular... secular, not to be confused with "Secular Humanism".

P.S. No, black ISN'T "still a color". It's STILL the absense of light and absence of color. We PERCEIVE it as a color but it's NOT. Still confused? "Black, while commonly referred to as a color, is in actuality the abscence of color." From Wikipedia.

Answer 7

ATHEISM is not an organized religion or organized belief.
It is what happens when a person has the guts to say this is not real and i have been fooled into believing it was real .
Just like Santa Claus.
I do believe schools should have a moment of silence for either prayer for the believers or reflection time for those who lost family members .
Schools should not however teach religion or creationism .
The ISMS you are so afraid of are not trying to take over your schools but are concerned with believers influencing children to believe the lie of religion.

Answer 8

"If man claims to have an absence of religion, he is most likely worshipping himself, because it's like an absence of color--not possible."

I'm afraid that particular statement is flawed. It is disbelief that is the default position in the absence of any indisputable proof of God's existence. Don't worry-when you religionists "accidentally" make slip ups like that you can be sure I'll keep you right.

Answer 9

Black is the absence of light, if that is what you're referring to by color. In terms of art, white is the lack of color.

It is still a lack of color. Humans choosing to classify it a color does not make it any less a lack of color.

Answer 10

Firstly, not believing in religion cannot be considered a religion by definition.

Secondly, you do not want equal access, if you did, you would have to allow devil worship as well, you want to foist your cult on to people whether they want it or not, and in areas where it does not apply, like science.

I believe that any bible class should include
a) genesis theories from all other religions, including paganism and the fact that we may have dbeen sneezed out of the nostril of a hairy space goat
b) there is no evidence for creationism, and the bible may simple be a fairy story.

Answer 11

Boy oh boy, do I love smashing small witted people...

Atheism is not a religion. There is no organized system of atheists.

A true atheist has no "beliefs", I know there is no god.

and an absence of color is white