Atheists: Will you conduct a "thought" experiment?

Question

I was watching "Contact" recently, and Elly is asked if she loved her father. She says "Yes". Then she is asked to "prove it", and she has no reply.

It is easy to demand "proof" of the existence of the divine before believing it exists. But if we demand "proof" that you think, or love, or do anything with motivation, you are as lacking of verifiable "proof".

If you accept that we all have thoughts, without being able to provide verifiable proof, why do you dismiss our experience of the divine for lack of verifiable proof?

Answer 1

Well, we can't, Athiesm is not about proving that God doesn't exist. We don't all get together on a Friday night, textbooks at the ready and sit around penning equation after equation. Athiesm requires just as much blind faith as theism, we ->"believe"<- there is no God. I have what you'd call divine experiences, but I don't attribute them to a tangeble higher power, I call them inspiration, insight, luck, that sort of stuff.

But, in a similar way, you cannot prove that you are having divine experiences. It's a double edged arguement, and one that, if thought about for too long, would break apart the boundaries of all stated fact.

We can't prove anything really, we only know what's what becuase our bodies process external factors into data that way. How do we know that grass is realy green, just because we all see it as being green. What if it was really red, but we just couldn't see it. Heck, I can't even prove I'm here right now, can you prove that you're where you are? It doesn't matter though, does it.

Maths professers will never deny that maths is based primarily on assumption. If science is based on mathematical principles, then our entire reality is just a patchwork of intellegent estimation and long shot guesses (although some things require more guessing than others). Reality is largely what you make it, consiously or not.

Answer 2

I'm always happy when i hear a new argument... especially one as well thought out as this.

Proof for intangible things is elusive which can be a point in the favor of god. However, god seems to be described in most religions as something if not tangible, then quantifiable. Things like this often leave traces of their existence and actions and this simply isn't observed. Secondly if the concept of god is taken through the logical ringer, it fails to hold up for very long. Again this depends on which god you are talking about, but they all fail at some point when logic is applied to arguments for their existence.

On the final front there have been studies that have suggested that there is a part of the brain that is specifically connected to religious experiences. In certain environments these can be activated and the subject will have a "religious" experience. The subject of near death experience has been studied quite extensively with results that support a naturalistic explanation... These experiences are also had by people who pass out in centrifuge training due to most of the blood being drained from their brain.

There is simply no good reason to believe in a god with the knowledge we have. The evidence we do have points in the opposite direction, and most people when pressed on their beliefs only believe for lack of a better option, not because they are privy to some exclusive evidence.

Answer 3

Not everything can be proven. I am not a disbeliever because you cannot prove the existance of God to me. It has nothing to do with proof for me. I was an avid believer until I was a teenager. I am a disbeliever because I just don't buy what you're selling. They say it's easier to believe when you're younger because faith is like water, and you are like a glass holding the water. As you get older, your glass gets bigger and harder to fill. Some people can continue to fill their cups, but mine ran dry years ago.

You may not be able to prove something by words but we prove daily whether or not we love the people we come in contact with by the way we treat them and the way we act around them. My father knows that I love him and does not need me to prove it.

If someone looked at you and told you that you were pregnant would you believe them? No, you would take a test. If you're a man you would probably laugh in their face, but the test would be proof. Some things need proof, and some don't. It depends on the person.

Religion and spirituality is different for every single person in the world. No two people will ever completely agree on every single thing. So therefore, I do not agree with you on the existance of god, and I do not agree with other athiests on the need for proof. I just don't believe.

Answer 4

One Comparison Would Be The Love She Has For Her Father And The Faith You Have Your God.

I Don't Doubt The Love She Has For Her Father And I Don't Doubt The Faith You Have Your God.

The Other Comparison Is Her Dad Exists, With Verifiable Proof (Within The Realm Of The Movie) Can't Say The Same For Your God.

Answer 5

I don't think that Atheists dismiss your belief in God. They just disagree. I see questions all the time asking how a person can have morals or ethics and not believe in God. Talk about judgement.

Do you see God as tangible? I did.

I am seriously leaning more and more towards atheism, myself.
Not because of lack of proof. It is because the religious people just send me running. If there is a God and He is all that they say He is, than how can the hate and judgement found in the bible be true?

Answer 6

Orion,
Good question. Elly was asked this question to point out to her that he does not need proof to believe in God, he knows there is a God, like she knows that she loves her father. He did not demand proof for him to believe in God. But do you think that he believes that Xenu is an alien ruler of the "Galactic Confederacy" who, 75 million years ago, brought billions of people to Earth in DC-8-like spacecraft? No, he does not believe that, but he does not dismiss it for lack of verifiable proof.
God and love are abstract thoughts that you don't need a proof to believe in them.

Answer 7

I don't doubt that your thoughts and beliefs exist but that is not the same as the object of your faith exists.

In your analogy you used the love of a father and daughter. Love is an idea, not something tangible, evidence can't be produced except in actions and gestures between them. God is supposed to be omni-present and not just a figment of our minds like love is so the two are incomparable.

Answer 8

I never deny anyones experience. Thats is fine; however, when you go further and claim it's not imaginary, (ie; a product of ur brains involvement with the world,) then you have a problem.

God is pure revelation, and therfore is confined to the private mind, and says nothing else whatso ever, about the real existence of god

Answer 9

It's not the fact of lack of proof for me. It's the fact that you think you are so right when clearly you're just the same as everyone.Clueless really

Answer 10

good Question.
I'm not Athiest, However, Love is all about Biochemistry, maybe it could be proven through some sort of analysis?