Almost 20 years later, some people still won't admit it! Sorry folks, Sugar Ray beat him! Me and a couple of my boys had this argument for years. So the other night we decided to watch the fight again and make a scorecard and actually score the fight round by round. I scored it for Leonard 8 rds to 4. My other 2 friends who said before that Marvin had won even scored the fight for Ray 7 rds to 5 after sitting down and actually scoring the fight fairly and with an open mind. A true knowledgeable boxing fan cannot watch that fight and say Hagler won 7 rds. of that fight! No way! Marvin lost the first 4 rds and Ray won at least every other round after the 5th. Ray just outboxed him, period! There are some guys on this forum with great expertise about the sport such as Brad M. Brent F. Toughguy, Pancho, Smitty and others. I would like for them to watch this fight if they have it and sit down and score it fair and be objective. And in a few days say who they think really won it. Thanks. CB.
2006-10-22 08:29:06 · 13 answers · asked by Cool Breeze 2 in Sports ➔ Boxing
And just to add this, lokk at the cornermen of each fighter right before the final round. Angelo Dundee & Ray were already celebrating yelling "new champion" while Pat & Goody Petronelli looked like zombies. They knew Marvin lost! Their body lanquage said it all!
2006-10-22 08:34:25 · update #1
I always though Leonard won easily on points.
2006-10-22 08:51:30 · answer #1 · answered by onetruekev 5 · 0⤊ 2⤋
Well Cool Breeze, i always thought Ray won this fight and i thought Marvin would knock him out inside of 9 rounds. Marvin Hagler is one of my all-time favorite fighters but you have to admit when your guy loses, and against Leonard he lost. I did what you asked us to do and i watched the fight last night with a few buddies and we all made score cards and scored the fight round by round. Out of 5 guys 3 of us had Ray winning 7 rds to 5 and one friend had it 6-5 and 1 even for Ray and my last friend scored it 8-4 for Ray. It was fun actually scoring the fight with other people. Ray was just the better fighter that night. He was faster, sharper, smarter, and he had a great game plan. And i really think he got a little respect from Hagler in the first round. Watch the first few seconds of the first round and you'll see that Ray caught Marvin with a left hook that kinda knocked him back a bit, and you can see Marvin wanting to rush in after the punch landed but he hesitated for a moment almost as if to say "man, i kinda felt that punch"! Marvin would never admit it and i'm not saying Ray hurt him with that shot, but i think it got Marvin's attention and set the tone for a tough fight. Bottom line is, Ray fought a great fight that night! And like you said, the corner men's faces told you who really won. Great question and it was good to re-live a historic event in boxing like that fight!.
2006-10-24 14:10:15 · answer #2 · answered by Pancho 4 · 1⤊ 0⤋
Cool Breeze - I've seen this fight numerous times I have it on DVD and VHS. I did what you asked I scored the fight for the first time last night and surprised myself.
My impressions of the fight:
1) Leonard set the tempo early.
2) Hagler did not gain Leonard's respect.
3) Leonard punched in combination, while Hagler looked off balance and didn't punch in combination.
4) Hagler didn't seem to be able to get off his punches at the right moments during the fight.
Having said that I always thought Leonard won that fight by 3-4 rounds. I scored it closer. I had Hagler losing by 1 point 115-114.
As I said earlier if Hagler would have set the tempo of the fight and gained Leonard's respect he could have won.(yeah the old should've, could've, would've) Hell, I had Ray winning by 1 point. I say this knowing that Hagler is number one on my list of favorite fighters. He just didn't do quite enough to win the fight. In hindsight having said this I believe it would have been Leonard, not Hagler or Monzon, who would have gave Robinson a run for his money in a bout at Middleweight (a question I've previously posted). Leonard had the ring smarts to be able to do what needed to be done to pull out fights when he absolutely needed to. A sign of a great fighter. Leonard's not my type of fighter but you gotta take your hat off to him.
The judges scoring in the fight: Split Decision; Judge Lou Fillipo:115 Hagler-113 Leonard, Judge Jo Jo Guerra: 118 Leonard-110 Hagler(he must've hooked up with Cheech and Chong before the fight), Judge Dave Moretti 115 Leonard-113 Hagler.
My round by round scoring.
1) 10-9 Leonard 2) 10-9 Hagler 3) 10-9 Leonard 4) 10-9 Leonard
5) 10-9 Hagler 6) 10-10 even 7) 10-9 Hagler 8) 10-9 Leonard
9) 10-9 Leonard 10) 10-9 Hagler 11) 10-9 Leonard 12) 10-9 Hagler.
Thanks for a good question Cool Breeze.
2006-10-24 09:59:26 · answer #3 · answered by Brent 5 · 1⤊ 0⤋
I've answered this question before.
Marvin Hagler is my favorite boxer of all time. It still pains me to watch that fight, because though I have tried over and over again to convince myself that Hagler was robbed, the reality is that Hagler was outclassed by the best fighter of the 80's.
You are absolutely right about the attitudes of the respective corners during the fight. Gil Clancy, one of the commentators, even alluded to that at one point. Hagler's corner was quietly shocked as Leonard and Angelo Dundee's brilliant fight plan began to unfold, and they had no answer for it.
Leonard's corner, on the other hand, was defined by Dundee's exclamation to Leonard at the end of round 10: "Six minutes to the title!"
As obviously as Leonard was winning - from the calculated, methodical nature of his corner, to the way he came out each round more confident than the last, it was equally obvious that Hagler was losing. Goody Petronelli couldn't say much, and could only give Hagler basic advice.
Even that stupid little dance Hagler did before the decision was read told you that he knew he'd lost. And lost badly.
To Hagler's credit, though, is that he never came back and potentially tarnished his legacy, the way Leonard did.
By staying retired, he ensured that forevermore if there are 10 fight fans in a room, 5 will say Leonard drilled him and 5 will say Hagler was robbed.
2006-10-22 18:30:21 · answer #4 · answered by Anonymous · 2⤊ 0⤋
Leonard won that fight but what people don't remenber is that Sugar Ray dodged Hagler for years. He caught "The Champ" later in his career when he felt he had a chance. Leonard is no dummy...even he knew that in his prime Hagler would've destroyed him. I've always felt that Sugar Ray cheated us...because what could've been would have been greater than what was.
2006-10-23 21:02:30 · answer #5 · answered by rob d 2 · 1⤊ 0⤋
Leonard was carried by the money-men, the networks for years, to the detriment of real boxing stars like Thomas Hearns and Marvin Hagler.
2006-10-23 16:40:23 · answer #6 · answered by kingstubborn 6 · 1⤊ 0⤋
I saw it live on PPV at a bar and thought Hagler edged him, 2 weeks later they showed it on regular TV and I scored the fight....... Ray fought a fantastic fight and clearly won. To much beer and emotion on fight night I guess eh! lmao
2006-10-22 19:30:11 · answer #7 · answered by Anonymous · 2⤊ 0⤋
i agree leonard won, hagler backups should be more upset that perhaps hagler gave leonard too much respect and should have moved in on him like he did thomas hearns, hagler had that fault at times the antofermo fight #1 the duran fight the briscoe fight but at other times her was a ruthless tiger likr antoferme rematch the minter fight,hearns hamsho, to me it seems hagler wanted to prove he could outbox leonard to gain respect and he could`nt.
2006-10-22 20:48:13 · answer #8 · answered by letitbemetheone 3 · 2⤊ 0⤋
sugar ray won by simply stealing rounds, doing the shoe shine, fighting the last 30 seconds of the fight, kinda reminded me of the the roy jones vs. tarver 1.
2006-10-24 01:05:46 · answer #9 · answered by mr.kick 3 · 1⤊ 0⤋
Ray Leonard won that fight. Reasons:
Smaller ring
Less rounds
Smaller gloves
Marvin's ego which let Ray have all this things
Ray was busy the last minute of every round
Hagler's over confidence
2006-10-23 00:58:11 · answer #10 · answered by smitty 7 · 2⤊ 2⤋