2006-10-08 16:50:26 · 18 answers · asked by Anonymous in Society & Culture ➔ Religion & Spirituality
Christians, like atheists, and people of other faiths, are not all great logicians. There are people who have experienced Christ to one degree or another and their faith is difficult to shake. Proving to them that the Bible is false would have little effect on them. Experience trumps reason. If a person perceives that a circumstance is painful, pleasant, dark, soft, rough, etc. you may reason until you are blue in the face, but you are unlikey to convince them that their experience was false.
The Bible has led many to such individual experiences or revelations. There is no way to prove anything without referring to it. True, many people are caught in circular logic, but that does not mean that they represent all Christians. Some are far better able to communicate their experience than others.
The Bible is not true because it says so. Yet, there is much evidence of the Bible's truth within it. What is even more undeniable to the believer, is the joy, purpose, and love that is brought to the faithful, obedient, reader who seeks God earnestly. Without reason (inductive and deductive) what could we know or even suppose about the unseen?
For those who might be interested, a short simple book about the evidence for God, Christ and the Bible as well, is 'Mere Christianity' by C. S. Lewis. Lewis does not use circular reasoning and refers to the Bible only in general terms.
To dismiss the Bible because of a particular Christian's poor rhetorical skills is a logical error as well. To dismiss the Bible because of our own 'dim light of reason' is yet another grievous error. God gave us reason to use, but heaven does not await only the intelligent. Intelligence and reason are good things, but they are not the main thing. This is the arrogance of gnostics, most of the intelligentsia, and even some theologians. Following Christ is a matter of the heart. I can use reason to remove some stumbling blocks you may have regarding some truths of God, but I am powerless to change your heart or to cause you to seek revelation from God.
The Bible has important information to form people who love God, but information is insufficient alone. Can I prove this to you? No. I can't even make you think about it. I can only encourage you to read the Bible, to ponder, to consider the writings of people with far greater minds than ours. Even if you don't believe, your mind will be expanded.
The chronological snobbery of our society is an amazing thing to observe. Brilliant people of all ages and cultures have thoughts for us to consider. We are fools to observe everything, every truth, through a lens of western logic. Western logic has its self-defined limits and its serious prejudices.
Yes, circular logic is fallacious. Fortunately, my belief in the Bible, God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit are not based on reason, Scripture, or tradition in themselves alone. There is also my personal experience that you can choose to believe or disregard. You can call this experience delusion or self-hypnosis or whatever, but that doesn't make you correct and it certainly does nothing to convict me of error. Consider also, the if, then pattern of something so basic as Euclidean geometry. Even this, one of the most basic examples of logic and enlightenment relies on circular reasoning in the form of postulates, which it then uses to prove themselves. Some circular reasoning and even faith is required to get past the definition of knowledge according to DesCartes. (Cogito ergo sum.) All other knowledge is at least somewhat circular and dependent on faith. Faith always precedes knowledge. Think about that one.
If I thought that I could teach you some special knowledge about Christ, which would be responsibe for saving your soul, then you could rightly call me a gnostic, but that is not the case. Seek God because the evidence is abundant in nature. Seek the life-changing revelation. Reason and science are not the answer but they can help if you take away the blinders.
2006-10-09 01:28:48 · answer #1 · answered by Nick â? 5 · 4⤊ 1⤋
The tautology or circular reasoning is only fallacious if the Bible isn't true. If the Bible is taken as an axiom, there is no logical flaw. You don't accept the axiom, but that does not make the method of reasoning problematic.
2006-10-09 00:06:00 · answer #2 · answered by Aspurtaime Dog Sneeze 6 · 2⤊ 2⤋
To quot the bible to prove it's truth is not only illogical it is a complete lack of reasoning and common sense, I listen to all these Sunday morning preachers on the radio and how they are trying to justify what is written is all truth, all they can say is send them money so they can fight the non-believers, money money and more money that's all these hypocritical preachers understand, they don't give a dam about people or God, It's disgusting hearing these blood suckers on the TV and radio quoting the bible and exploiting it to gain financial wealth shame on them and shame on those that support them.
2006-10-09 00:19:13 · answer #3 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 2⤋
If you're looking for a Christian to admit to this, good luck. It's always been a logical question, but never receives logical answers, unless it's from someone who doesn't follow the book. It was one of the questions that got me ummmm...removed from Bible school in my youth though (grin).
2006-10-09 00:15:07 · answer #4 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 2⤋
There are several proofs that the Bible is the inspired word of God, but you have to know what's in the Bible in order to understand this.
The Bible contains 100s of fulfilled prophecies.
Hundreds of archeological discoveries collaborate the people, places and events mentioned in the Bible.
There is a unity throughout the 66 books of the Bible, even though it was penned by about 40 authors from diverse backgrounds.
2006-10-09 00:00:51 · answer #5 · answered by David S 5 · 3⤊ 4⤋
I love that just because it's so crazy. Seriously, how do you dispute that?
Me: I don't think the Bible is true
Random debater: Of course it's true, the Bible says so.
Me: Oh....um.....huh?
2006-10-11 17:13:07 · answer #6 · answered by Miss. Bliss 5 · 0⤊ 1⤋
I thought it was standard practice when doing research to reference outside materials to support the one you are using. Some people just have issues with logic and the rest of us just suffer from their ignorance.
2006-10-08 23:58:21 · answer #7 · answered by Moonsilk 3 · 2⤊ 1⤋
Yes, indeed. And I notice that for every question unfavorable to the defenders they come up with come back with an inane answer in the form of a page and verse number.
2006-10-09 00:00:17 · answer #8 · answered by Beejee 6 · 2⤊ 2⤋
yes, i have been saying that all along.
using the bible to prove itself is the ultimate in stupidity -- a fatal flaw in logic.
the christian book -- edited and compiled by a pagan roman emperor, as a tool of political power and empirical strength. the whole notion has always cracked me up...
even paul was wrong when he thought jeebus would come back during his life. none of its prophecies are fulfilled (unless you apply ridiculous jumps in logic -- like the rest of the silly book's premises...)
2006-10-08 23:52:36 · answer #9 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 4⤋
Yes; it's called "circular reasoning," and it is one of the most basic fallacies. It is illogical to say, "You can believe me because I say I am telling the truth."
2006-10-09 00:55:14 · answer #10 · answered by aviophage 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋