"If You Don't Have God (Jesus Christ) You Don't Have Wisdom??"(see details)?

Question

The title quote was inspired by an answer to my previous question.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AksQHuPxKMvK_7_H5tH6VZzzy6IX?qid=20061007101849AAZu4HX

I'm speechless. Your views, if you will. I will post the answer given as Additional Details.

if you dont have God (Jesus Christ), you dont have wisdom

if you dont have wisdom, than you usually dont have morality or not very good morality.

No morality means you dont have Godly values and ethics that lead to a stable and productive life

And once morality, values, and proper ethics are gone

the only thing left is Kause.Everything goes spiraling down-ward at that point; which is what's happening today, everythings quickly going downward.

Evil's being called good and good being called evil. The bible predicted such things would happen in the last days.

I encourage you to find Jesus Christ;accept Him into your heart

and never let go of Him; and dont let anyone take Him away from you.

Muffin Man....I hope you understand that I did not write the additional details. They were an answer given to a question I posed.

Iknowtruthismine....I DID NOT write that. I merely copy/pasted it from an answer to my previous question.

Answer 1

Jaw-dropping.
They lost me at the first line.
The audacity, for anyone to think that anybody who doesn't share their beliefs is an idiot.

Okay, based on their assumption, I'm stupid.
Evil.
Amoral.
Unethical.

And so are all the millions of other non-Christian people in the world.

Interesting how many people thought that this was YOUR point of view!!!

Answer 2

This is really just another way of saying "If you don't think the way I think, then you must be stupid". I don't believe that it is ever fair or reasonable to make such a claim. After all- we can read the writings of such people as Aristotle, Nietzsche and Descartes and we can find the flaws in their reasoning even though we might admit that we aren't as smart as they are. It all comes down to rhetoric. Some people have the ability to make a convincing argument. Sometimes even when the argument itself makes no sense at all, the method used to "prove" the points seems so logical that we are unable to disagree. All of the major purchases that I have made in my own life have been the result of this kind of salesmanship. That's why we have a three-day change-your-mind rule for major purchases. Okay I got off the subject a little bit, but I hope you'll know what I mean.

Answer 3

The person who wrote, ""If You Don't Have God (Jesus Christ) You Don't Have Wisdom??" was expressing his personal views. In support of this viewpoint, he presents an argument that is illogical. If he had said that a person who does not have (know) Jesus Christ does not have the wisdom of Jesus Christ, then he may have been correct. Abraham Maslow's hierarchy of needs lists the requirements for becoming productive which include self-esteem and loving and belonging. A person who feels that he is loved by God (Jesus Christ) and has self-esteem because he feels he is leading the "right" kind of ethical moral life, may become productive, but then so may other people who derive their self-esteem and sense of loving and belonging from other sources.

The statement regarding morality, "if you dont have wisdom, than you usually dont have morality or not very good morality" is based on wisdom being the wisdom of the knowledge of Jesus Christ. Ethics is one of the 5 branches of classical philosophy and morality is part of ethics, so logically whoever accepts the precepts of good and evil as defined by any ethical system would have "good morality". Morality depends on controlling the desires of anger, pride, envy, greed, lust, gluttony and sloth and making decisions based on the individual vs. society, the ends justifying the means and other difficult concepts which are delineated in religious texts.

The statement, "No morality means you dont have Godly values and ethics that lead to a stable and productive life" means to the speaker that if a person does not have God (Jesus Christ) and the ethics or values of the wisdom of Jesus Christ, then the person cannot have a stable and productive life. This statement is easily disproven by the many exceptions of Christians who never complete their education, who get divorced and who are totally unproductive. As well as the many non-Christians who become well-educated, have stable marriages and are highly productive.

The next statement, "And once morality, values, and proper ethics are gone, the only thing left is Kause. Everything goes spiraling down-ward at that point; which is what's happening today, everythings quickly going downward." is confusing. I do not know what the speaker means by "Kause". I thought it might be German for "cause" but that would be Grund. I also tried Dutch, Norwegian and Swedish. Perhaps the speaker means chaos? He implies that when no one has the wisdom of Jesus Christ, that no one will have morality and unproductivity and chaos will ensue. This would be disproven by the success of the communist country, The People's Republic of China whose GPD according to the CIA world factbook was $8.859 trillion (2005 est.) and where morality is not a major issue as the crime rate, divorce rate and HIV rate is much lower than so-called Christian nations.

Finally, the speaker says, "Evil's being called good and good being called evil. The bible predicted such things would happen in the last days. I encourage you to find Jesus Christ; accept Him into your heart. I could not find any verse of the Bible that predicts during the last days that evil would be called good and good would be called evil. On the other hand, I did find these verses which seem to be appropriate:

1Cr 3:18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.

So perhaps the wisdom of Jesus Christ is that a person should not believe himself to be wise. It would seem so.

As regards the last days, Jesus did say in the Bible:

Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

Perhaps it is the love of Jesus Christ more so than the wisdom that the world needs.

As regards evil and good the bible says:

Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].

Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

It seems that a person does not have to worry about the existence of good or evil but merely to use good to overcome evil

Rom 12:21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

According to what Jesus taught, a person should:
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
and
Mat 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

So it seems that the wisdom Jesus Christ teaches is not good vs. evil or morality vs. chaos but simply love and forgiveness. And that makes sense because to keep anger in a person's heart will destroy him physically and psychologically as well as, perhaps, spiritually.

Answer 4

Well, Spooky, at least you added punctuation for him!

In a similiar vein, my sister has a plaque on her wall with a poem called "Marriage Takes Three." The fact that it has no artistic merit as poetry aside, it is an abomination of verse claiming that marriages can never succeed unless Jesus is asked to enter.

I guess that explains the divorce rate among born-agains being so high.

I'd go on, but evidently I am not wise, so I shouldn't offer my opinion.

Answer 5

GREETINGS,
That might not necessarily be true. Basically if you deny God and His Son Jesus Christ then you will not have the whole truth. Along with truth comes wisdom and knowledge for if you know the truth then you will gain in wisdom and knowledge by being able to understand the input that you are receiving and be able to discern the choices available to you and then make the correct assesment of a situation or gain in your overall understanding of the world about you.

a work in progress

Answer 6

Cut out the preaching (whoever is doing it...)

Plenty of people (current company included) don't have Jesus Christ in their lives and carry out righteous and morally rich lives. Three simple rules guide my life (do my best, do what's right, and be empathetic to others) and everything falls into place.

To state that if one doesn't believe in a mythical figure from a story book then they cannot have morals and values, then whoever posted this is quite ignorant.

Answer 7

"I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotism." -Albert Einstein

"All thinking men are atheists." -Ernest Hemingway

"The Bible is not my book nor Christianity my profession. I could never give assent to the long, complicated statements of Christian dogma." - Abraham Lincoln

"I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life, I absenteed myself from Christian assemblies."
-Benjamin Franklin

"They know that it is human nature to take up causes whereby a man may oppress his neighbor, no matter how unjustly. ... Hence they have had no trouble in finding men who would preach the damnability and heresy of the new doctrine from the very pulpit."
-Galileo Galilei

Answer 8

Wow. That seems a little rough.

So, if you're not a Christian, you're a moral-free, ethics-free beast who can't have a productive life. Wow.

And I thought the whole thing was about getting to heaven LATER and they're supposed to reject all the money and rich people, who seem to be leading pretty darn productive lives.

Answer 9

nothing but a very dusty street and a person driving a sprinkling machine through it. practical wisdom as a variation of the following formula : 2+2=4. empiric and egotist character.

Answer 10

I agree with you SPOOKY. All morals and values have gone out the window. It is not going to be much longer until Christ makes His return. I would love for it to be right now, but I do not control this, unfortunately.

I sure hope a lot of people are able to find Christ before the end. I think your details are a good start, SPOOKY.