give me the reasons why you do not believe in him. IF you only think that he is a folk tale why what proof do you have? what proof do you have that he is not real.
2006-10-06 08:12:04 · 25 answers · asked by knowssignlanguage 6 in Society & Culture ➔ Religion & Spirituality
He very definitely could have been a "real" rabbi, but absolutely not the messiah. The messiah will be a great human leader who will bring peace on earth and justice for all humanity -- Jews, Christians, Muslims, atheists, etc. When there is peace on earth, we will recognize the messiah because he will be king of Israel.
Messiah : The Criteria
Judge for yourself:
Did Jesus fulfill ALL these criteria?
The Jewish tradition of "The Messiah" has its foundation in numerous biblical references, and understands "The Messiah" to be a human being - without any overtone of deity or divinity - who will bring about certain changes in the world and fulfill certain criteria before he can be acknowledged as "The Messiah".
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First of all, he must be Jewish - "...you may appoint a king over you, whom the L-rd your G-d shall choose: one from among your brethren shall you set as king over you." (Deuteronomy 17:15)
He must be a member of the tribe of Judah - "The staff shall not depart from Judah, nor the sceptre from between his feet..." (Genesis 49:10)
To be a member of the tribe of Judah, the person must have a biological father who is a member of the tribe of Judah.
He must be a direct male descendant of King David and King Solomon, his son - "And when your days (David) are fulfilled, and you shall sleep with your fathers, I will set up your seed after you, who shall issue from your bowels, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for my name, and I will make firm the throne of his kingdom forever..." (2 Samuel 7:12 - 13)
The genealogy of the New Testament is inconsistent. While it gives two accounts of the genealogy of Joseph, it states clearly that he is not the biological father of Jesus. One of the genealogies is through Nathan and not Solomon altogether!
He must gather the Jewish people from exile and return them to Israel -"And he shall set up a banner for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth." (Isaiah 11:12)
Are all Jews living in Israel? Have all Jews EVER lived in Israel since the time of Jesus?
He must rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem - "...and I will set my sanctuary in their midst forever and my tabernacle shall be with them.." (Ezekiel 37:26 - 27)
At last check, there is NO Temple in Jerusalem. And worse, it was shortly after Jesus died that the Temple was DESTROYED! Just the opposite of this prophecy!
He will rule at a time of world-wide peace - "...they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore." (Micah 4:3)
Have you seen a newspaper lately? Are we living in a state of complete world peace? Has there ever been peace since the time of Jesus?
He will rule at a time when the Jewish people will observe G-d's commandments - "My servant David shall be king over them; and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall follow My ordinances and be careful to observe My statutes." (Ezekiel 37:24)
The Torah is the Jewish guide to life, and its commandments are the ones referred to here. Do all Jews observe all the commandments? Christianity, in fact, often discourages observance of the commandments in Torah, in complete opposition to this prophecy.
He will rule at a time when all people will come to acknowledge and serve one G-d - "And it shall come to pass that from one new moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me, says the L-rd" (Isaiah 66:23)
there are still millions if not billions of people in the world today who adhere to paganistic and polytheistic religions. It is clear that we have not yet seen this period of human history unfold.
All of these criteria are best stated in the book of Ezekiel Chapter 37 verses 24-28:
And David my servant shall be king over them; and they shall all have one shepherd. they shall also follow My judgments and observe My statutes, and do them. And they shall dwell in the land that I have given to Yaakov my servant, in which your fathers have dwelt and they shall dwell there, they and their children, and their children's children forever; and my servant David shall be their prince forever. Moreover, I will make a covenant of peace with them, it shall be an everlasting covenant with them, which I will give them; and I will multiply them and I will set my sanctuary in the midst of them forevermore. And my tabernacle shall be with them: and I will be their G-d and they will be my people. Then the nations shall know that I am the L-rd who sanctifies Israel, when My sanctuary will be in the midst of them forevermore.
If an individual fails to fulfill even one of these conditions, then he cannot be "The Messiah." A careful analysis of these criteria shows us that to date, no one has fulfilled every condition.
Certainly NOT Jesus.
2006-10-06 08:37:28 · answer #1 · answered by Hatikvah 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋
I think you're asking a two-part question
1) Do you believe that jesus is "god"?
2) Do you think he existed?
As far as #1, there is no god so therefore no, I do not believe in jesus' divinity.
For #2, you don't prove a negative so the burden of proof is to prove that he existed. The simple fact of the matter is that there is no primary historical source that someone name jesus lived. The only documents we have were written decades or even centuries after he allegedly lived.
All sources (canonical and non-canonical) are based on verbal stories passed down over the decades, just imagine a 30 year game of telephone being played by people who speak different languages and have different levels of education.
Until indisputable proof is presented, I will continue to think that a person named jesus ever existed...
Now, I'm predicting a total of three emails from christians. One will want to find out more information and try to engage me in a good debate, the other two will call me stupid and say I'm going to hell...
2006-10-06 08:13:40 · answer #2 · answered by JerseyRick 6 · 3⤊ 0⤋
And on the other side, what proof do you have that he IS real?
For the record, I believe that JC may really have lived 2000 years ago. However I don't believe he's the Son of God or anything, just a visionary man. And this is based soley on the fact that it's hard to imagine all this hullabaloo about some guy that lived all those years ago if he didn't really exist.
2006-10-06 08:16:17 · answer #3 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 0⤋
I see no evidence that any god is real. I've never seen a burning bush, seen a sea, lake, pond, or even a puddle part, seen a dead man brought back to life, or anything else. The bible is full of contradictions, as well as stories that sound like a primitive person's attempts at explaining how the world works when they have no understanding of science.
But I have seen religion used to justify bigotry, war, prejudice, crime, homophobia, and more. I have seen or heard of religious people that intentionally hate, hurt, rape, torture, and kill others in the name of their religion. And I have seen or read of scientific studies that explain the way the universe works in a much more rational and testable way than what the bible says. If you want to believe in a god, whether christian, islamic, vedic, norse, roman, or greek, that's fine with me. Just don't force your beliefs on me, or ask me to pay for it via taxes, tax breaks, etc.
Freedom of religion includes freedom FROM religion.
2006-10-06 08:27:54 · answer #4 · answered by Ralfcoder 7 · 2⤊ 0⤋
He existed as a man. Nothing more.
The only proof I will accept of him being divine is the same proof he gave Thomas.
Funny, he loved the non-believer Thomas enough to give proof, but I've never seen him show up to let ME put my finger in the holes in his hands. Hmm.
Proof enough for me.
2006-10-06 08:16:29 · answer #5 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 0⤋
i belive that jesus existed, and he was a prophet from god that preached chrsitanity to the jews.. yes that happend and thats true..but whats not true is that he was NOT the son of god, he is not divine. God is not born, nor give birth, he has no sons..jesus kept saying "my father" yes but we always pick on that,, he also said "my father, and your father" "my lord and your lord" and when asked when the day of judgment is ganna be, he said that he didnt know, and that was only knowledge that god knew...i know that if jesus was actually god he wouldnt have said my god, he would have known everything and when the day of judgment is going to be. God is one, this is called monotheism, he is not 2 nor he is 3, beliving that god is more than 1 is true heresy, and it is hypocritical if you belive he is, because jesus specifacly said that there was a god that wasnt him...that was not my opnion those were facts that i said, because i am a muslim, and this is stated in the koran, the last book from god. The god of islam is the same god of christanity, and jews. and you should at least consider what is being said in god's last holy book...we all know that the bible is not perfect it has been worded, so not on any gorunds that you should base your belives about god using the bible, the koran is last complete book from god that was never worded...so in summary, jesus existed, he was a miracle sent from god, the miracle was that he was born without a father, he was chosen by god to be a messenger and a prophet , he preached christianity to convert the jews, and his soul was sent to heaven by god. he was not crucified , god saved him from the jews, and made them think that they were killing him and he placed a man in his place and made them blind to jesus..jesus was not killed...jesus is not divine, and he isnt the son of god.
2006-10-06 08:34:18 · answer #6 · answered by masry 2 · 1⤊ 0⤋
You are excused for not knowing that the burden of proof lies with the person who is making the claim... not with those who are unimpressed with the claim. After all... you are a Christian, so such lapses in knowledge are to be expected. Despite that, though, modern biblical scholarship makes a very compelling case for the idea that Jesus never existed... that he was, in fact, entirely fictional.
The Jesus Puzzle
http://pages.ca.inter.net/%7Eoblio/jhcjp.htm
http://jesuspuzzle.humanists.net/home.htm
Beyond that... since god is imaginary, it stands to reason that any son of god would have to be imaginary, too.
Debate: "Does God Exist?"
http://www.cdicarlo.com/paper_05god.htm
http://godisimaginary.com/
2006-10-06 08:15:44 · answer #7 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 0⤋
No proof, but a lot more evidence than you do of the contrary. It is unnecessary to cite it here, but see reference for an interesting take on this. In any event, belief in this or any other religious precept is provably useless. (If you want the details, contact me via avatar.)
2006-10-06 08:16:51 · answer #8 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 0⤋
Personally, I do believe in him, just not in a Christian view. When researching many, many different religions or belief systems, you find similar stories in each of them. The words or names are different, but the stories are the same. Because of this, I believe that similar things happened, but over time, different sects have taken the info and possibly added/taken away info to make it better fit their beliefs.
2006-10-06 08:23:51 · answer #9 · answered by tabby_24_2000_2000 2 · 1⤊ 0⤋
I believe that Jesus historically existed.
but that he was just a guy. no more divine than you or I, and that he was a very potent mystic and Kabbalist.
but definitely not a prophet, messiah, god incarnate, or anything of the sort.
simply put... I have no reason to think he was anything other than as I've said I believe.
2006-10-06 08:18:02 · answer #10 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 0⤋
I don't have OR need any proof. It the other way round. You have to prove he exists if you want me to believe. I'm an unbeliever 'by default'. I'm not an 'active unbeliever'. I just don't care about godly stuff.
2006-10-06 08:22:16 · answer #11 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 0⤋