Are you absolutely certain?

Question

An "absolute" refers to some kind of standard by which we understand or judge something as being either true/false, right/wrong, black/white, hot/cold, helpful/harmful, etc.
The atheist's claim to be able to "absolutes" without God rests upon a very basic error in logic. He has switched the meaning of the word "absolutes" without mentioning this to the theist. The so-called "absolutes" of the atheist are finite, cultural, subjective, imperfect, mutable and temporal. This is, of course, a contradiction of terms because the atheist's "absolute" is a non-absolute!
Such relative "absolutes" would be useless so far as ethics is concerned because we can make up whatever so-called "absolutes" Thus the so-called "absolutes" of the atheist are only the subjective projections of his personal feelings, ideas, biases, etc.

JT..It is not based on a false premise to those who understand the question posed

I am asking if one who holds that there are no absolutes, are you absolutely certain of that?

Answer 1

What is your question, please?

Answer 2

Are you saying that there cannot be absolutes in ethics without god? Or that an absolute cannot exist without god? Or what? I'm an atheist and I would like to answer your question but I can't understand what you are asking.

I can say that I am absolutely certain about things, even though I don't believe god exists. For example, time is an absolute that exists independently from the idea of god. Also, mathematics hold absolute truths. Absolutes do not have to be dependent on God's existance (which is what I think you are asking).

Answer 3

I am absolutely certain your post is a bunch of hand-waving, straw man beating, pseudo-intellectual hooey.

As an atheist I claim very few absolutes. As a scientific and critical thinker my views are always subject to revision based on new evidence.

Theists project their own subjective views and preferences onto their deity of choice because they need parental approval, even from an imaginary daddy, and haven't the honesty and courage to defend their own utterly subjective convictions with more than a non-responsive: "thus saith the Lord", falling back on the utterly subjective convictions of whoever the human being was that invented their god and put words in that god's mouth. They do this because they wish to squash debate of their own interests and opinions by appeal to a higher and unchallengeable authority that can never be called for cross-examination.

Wrong answer, but thanks for playing.

Answer 4

Huh??? What does it mean...."The atheist's claim to be able to "absolutes" without God? To be able to "absolutes"? You are using the word as a verb and as far as I know, absolutes is not a verb, so your question (if that's what it is) is meaningless. And your so-called "absolutes" show you have no idea about nuances. Things can be both true and false in certain circumstances and certainly can be both helpful and harmful depending on who is deciding that. And something can feel right to someone and still be wrong. You make a false assumption about absolutes....

Well put, Duck Phup! You've done it again!

Answer 5

I CAN be absolutely sure that certain things which are logical contradictions cannot and do not exist. For example: I don't have to search the entire universe to know for a fact that there are no "square circles" or "married bachelors" existing in it -- the paired traits are mutually exclusive.

In a like manner, there cannot be an "infinitely merciful and compassionate god" who tortures people forever and ever for not doing what he tells them to. Ergo, the biblegod (as described in YOUR BIBLE'S OWN WORDS) cannot, will not, and does not exist.

I can't and don't assert that there isn't a possibility that SOME sort of a being that might be categorized as a "god" COULD exist SOMEwhere; just that it will have no resemblance to the deities described in the scriptures of any of the Abrahamic religions.

Answer 6

Point taken, but to rant against all of this does little good. The decay of our culture is not due to atheism, relativism or modernism. These ideas have been around since the beginning of time. As the book of Eccesiastes states "there is nothing new under the sun." All of this is nothing more than the blinding of men at the hand of satan. His lies vary... each one laying waste to another soul. As christians we are charged with stretching out our hands to those who are reaching for the truth. There are several proclaimed atheists on this site that are genuinely uncomfortable with their atheism and are really are seeking the truth... Lets be gentle as our savaior was gentle.

Answer 7

You are wrong. An Atheist just lacks a belief in gods. I do not believe in gods. Instead I believe in mathematics. Mathematics is as absolute as it gets. It is none of the things you claim my absolutes are.

When you claim atheists do not believe in absolutes you are making what is called a false strawman. It is a form of intellectual dishonesty.

Answer 8

Well... that was quite a load of meaningless, pseudointellectual psychobabble. Whenever I see a question like this, I am appalled to be reminded that there are people out there who are so out of touch with their basic humanity, and reality, that they would not have any idea how to conduct themselves in society, absent the code of an imaginary supernatural being, based on the myths, superstitions, fairy tales and fantastical delusions of an ignorant bunch of Bronze Age fishermen and wandering goat herders.

Cooperation, altruism and love are innate properties of human existence... a more sophisticated version of the social organization that you can see among pods of dolphins or orcas, packs of wolves, lion prides and troops of chimpanzees. Moral consensus, moral conscience and mutual empathy are evolved survival traits. These are social constructs... the social lubrication that allows people to exist together. People come away with the misconception that they don't exist, absent religion. The religious puppet masters try to perpetuate that idea, in order to protect their conduits to wealth and power... but that is a canard. This has to do, entirely, with human nature.

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"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." ~ Steven Weinberg
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Richard Dawkins - The Root of All Evil Part 2.1 (moral behavior)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=mGLPViVW5ms

Richard Dawkins - The Root of All Evil Part 2.6 (evolution basis for morality)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=mGLPViVW5ms&mode=related&search=

Chew on this for a little while. Christians make up about 75% of the US population and 75% of the US prison population. No big surprise there.

Atheists, on the other hand, make up about 10% of the US population... but they make up only 0.2% of the US prison population. Now, isn't THAT a surprise? That means that atheists are FIFTY (50) times LESS LIKELY to be incarcerated than Christians. Pretty strange, huh, for a group that has no god-given guiding moral principals?

I can think of only two possibilities that might reasonably be said to account for this discrepancy:

1. Atheists are of a higher ethical and moral caliber than Christians, and thus are less prone to do the same kinds of nasty things that land so many Christians in the slammer;

OR,

2. Atheists are, overall, a lot smarter than Christians and thus, they are less likely to get caught in the course of their transgressions.

It's GOT to be one or the other... take your pick.

Answer 9

Atheists have only one thing in common, we do not believe a Supreme Being exists.

I do not know who has been lying to you, but atheists do not share any other ideology or philosophies, so your question is illogical and based on a false premise.

Answer 10

I guess you would have to go into a few more details of absolutes. For example, "thou shalt not commit murder" or the law of chastity would be good ones. Some of the other answerers seem a little confused.

Answer 11

Both sides of the fence are logically flawed. There is no certainty in regards to the existence of God, or much of anything in life, except for death. Death is certain beyond argument. God is not, whether you think he does or does not exist.