Are Theists unable to contemplate the concept of 'god' without using their religion's theological arguments?

Question

To be fair, I'll read "Atheist" arguments to try to understand what people on my wavelength are thinking, but I don't automatically accept everything an "Atheist Philosopher" has to say. There is a certain amount questioning that goes into understanding your own disbelief in a deity. There is always the possibility I could be wrong. I accept that fact though I find it unlikely.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, I rarely see much independent thought on the Theist side of the argument. You tend to get very rigid and regurgitated answers and questions.
For example:
"The world is too beautiful for no god to exist. Just look at baby eyes."
"Free Will explains everything."
"The world is perfect but humans came along and f*cked everything up." (And a perfect god created them for what exactly?)
Etc. etc. etc.

Hey PROUD MOM - My father died a month ago, do you see me praying? Try answering the damn question.

Answer 1

Well to be honest, our bibles never say just look into a baby's eyes and you will know that there is a God. Nor does the bible ever say that the beauty in the world means that God is real.

That being said. On my own, without my knowledge of the bible, I see creation. For creations to happen there has to be a creator of some sort. I cannot think that I want to bake a cake, I must actually do it. The cake is then created, I am technically the creator. The creation of the cake was made by the creator, ME.

If the cupboards and the cooler are empty, I can not create the cake.

So it all comes down to no matter what created thing, no matter how far back you go, something or someone created it. This brings about a modicum of faith. We do not know who created it, but we do believe that it was created somehow. The creation is known to us, but the creator is not. But, we have faith that it was created somehow.

Faith being defined as a "firm conviction". I have firm conviction that all things were somehow created by someone or something.

That brings about the word GOD. An unknown, unseen creator.
Something or someone that is unknown to us unless they/he chooses to be known to us.

Lastly, I would suggest that you read the book of Romans in the bible. Not with the intent of believing, but with the intent of seeking knowledge into what this book explains about the heavens and the earth and the inate knowledge that is given to every single human being of a creator.

You cannot know every thing about the creator from the heavens and the earth, but we can learn plenty. The few things that we cannot learn from our surroundings are forgiveness, and mercy and the end result. And of course exactly who the creator is.

Answer 2

Here's the problem.

Someone who believes in god cannot make a logical argument that you will accept, because a "theist" and an atheist use different principles to start from.

For example, if we argue about the best way to build a home, from wood or from brick, we must agree that both wood and bricks are matter and can be used for construction. Once we agree on that basic principle, we form our arguments for how to build the home. We can't argue that there is or is not a god because, to a theist, the existence of god is a basic principle that must be accepted before all other arguments can be made.

When we make competing logical arguments, they must be based on very basic agreed upon assumptions. To the theist, the existence of god is the basic assumption. It is a basic, absolute rule that is the foundation of logic. So the theist and the atheist will use two different sets of logic, and can never reasonably compare them.

Answer 3

Most theists will probably always use their religion's theological arguments (if it has them) to explain why they believe in the concept of "God" (however that religion defines it).

For myself it is more complex (and that's probably because I'm a Hindu). Hinduism doesn't really offer and answer. Of course this is a religion that in the Upanishads constantly makes the point that Brahman is almost equivalent to nothing without actually being nothing but what it is the seers can't put into words and just tell you that you'll have to experience it for yourself. Of course Hinduism is based upon this entire idea that you shouldn't just believe something because it's told to you, you should question it and find answers and hopefully experience whatever others claim to be true to find out if it is true for you, if it is real for you. Thus my only explanation for why I believe in "God" is because I have experienced It on my own through my religious practices (meditation, etc) even if only for a moment or two.

The only other reason I even accept the concept of God as proposed by Hinduism is that it somewhat matches up with scientific information. When inquiring a scientist about the Big Bang (which is pretty obvious if you look at the universe) and then inquire "what was before the Big Bang?" a scientist will answer "some kind of singularity where everything was contained." In Hinduism that singularity is simply "God". Brahman (one of the words used that gets translated as "God" and is Sanskrit Brah-Manah meaning "expanding consciousness") is basically that singularity. Brahman is often called sat-chit-ananda or being-consciousness-bliss. What it means is that it alone exists (everything came out of It), consciousness is what It is, and when we experience It we feel bliss. Hinduism just takes the basic science a step further by saying the entire universe is consciousness itself and that as this universe expands and eventually will change and turn inward on itself until dissolves away, that what is left is consciousness and that consciousness will then create yet another universe that will explode forth.

But that's just my own humble opinion. I don't really have any real proof other than my own experiences to back up any of what I believe. I believe it because I have experienced it and Hinduism is the best that has been able to explain those experiences. The fact that others explain those experiences differently or can't at all really explain them isn't really all that odd. What I may call "God" you probably don't, you may have another term. In another religion what I call "God" may be defined as something else and "God" being defined somewhat differently that again more relates to the experiences of the philosophers who defined it that way for that religion. As a Hindu I believe we're all still talking about the exact same thing, we're just looking at from various different angles and perspectives.

In the end, for me anyways, the question of whether there is or is not a God or even how one defines the word God is all irrelevant. If the religion has nothing to teach me about how to improve in my relations with other people and perhaps give me yet another perspective on the world and universe that perhaps I hadn't yet thought of or experienced, then what use is the religion to me? Religion, afterall, is just a tool that one uses to reach spiritual goals. We may all have different spiritual goals, but then again we all have different religions. Just as you wouldn't use a hammer to tighten a screw you'd use a screwdriver, so too is it with religions. Ultimately, though, all religions do provide us with atleast one thing: the chance to look more closely at ourselves and to look deeper within ourselves for the universal truths about our own inner Self and help us to live our lives in a more compassionate, peaceful, and harmonious way with one another and the world and give our lives a little sense of meaning within the dimensions of the larger universe. Whether one is theist or atheist that does not change the fact that we are all human (whatever that means to each of us).

Excellent question, thanks for asking.

Peace be with you.

Answer 4

No one will ever be able to prove to you that God exists. On the other hand, no one will ever be able to prove that God does not exist. We are at an impasse.

As a child, getting involved in evil things, makes you realize that there is scary, evil things out there. I have also had, some really amazing, wonderful, unexplainable things happen to me.

Am I to believe that the evil I have seen and experienced is fake. Am I to believe that there is evil and no good. When you pray for help and you get it, is it fate?

I made a decision to follow Christ because I believe in God and that Jesus died for my sins. I won't hide that fact. I don't think He exists, I know He exists. He has made it very clear to me. I have asked God point blank questions and He has answered me in the most awesome ways.

I guess you will have to judge for yourself, but I know the road I'm taking.

Answer 5

Not unable, but insecure. If you believe strongly enough then you should be able to argue both sides of the point. Does that mean that you would do it on a regular basis? No, but you should be able to rationalize, or atleast explain what you believe without the "canned" answers of religion. If you haven't found that in Theist then it's because you haven't met the ones secure enough to tell you the whole truth.

Answer 6

I really can understand a lot of what you feel. I grew up in a church that left me with more questions than answers. My research on my own was even more frustrating, as I ended up with an extensive 'collection of contradictions.'

For me, I didn't get to know God until I stepped away from religion all together. I asked, He answered, that was good enough for me. I don't think religion is inherently bad. But I've seen a lot of inherently bad people use, or mis-use, Religion. And politics, and race, and gender, and science, and on and on.......

Answer 7

"There is a certain amount questioning that goes into understanding your own disbelief in a deity."

FINALLY. its hard to take seriously the beliefs of a person who does not question their own belief/ disbelief and vows they will follow that belief forever. it shows unintelligence, brainwashing, and that your beliefs do not require thought. you come here and see theists and atheists alike saying, "i'll never change my opinions, they are absolutely correct" and expecting to win people to their side. why not just be braindead?

Answer 8

Well, I don't contemplate the concept of God (other than in Anselm's Ontological Argument which requires it), but God himself. The answer to your question is no. Arguments for the existence of God do not mediate or predicate my belief or apprehension of him.

Answer 9

We aren't suppose to be able to figure out God,his existences and powers and who he is, is so complex,that our little human brains can't fathom him,and that's why people have such a hard time with believing in him,they can't grasp how almighty he is ,he's so way over all of our heads......there is no explanation that anyone can come up with that will ever describe him........the ones that believe,we have faith that one day we will see him in ALL his Majesty.....and we will!!!!!!!!

Answer 10

I've yet to meet or talk to a true atheist.
Everyone always turns out to be agnostic instead.

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