Why do Athiests slam this way? What is the point?

Question

I am spinning from DuckPhup's commentary on "Religious" or "Christians"

He blatently states;
"Religious belief... particularly the Abrahamic death cults of desert monotheism (Judaism, Christianity, Islam)... simply cannot withstand the glaring light of reason and critical thought. It just evaporates. Poof. The fact that Christians assert and promote such ridiculous beliefs is a clear indication that they CAN'T (or WON'T) think properly."


I;m truly stunned at the ignorance. I am a christian, educated, and a "free thinker" meaning that I can come to my own belief system without being con'd (sp) by others. Where does this "death cult" mentality come from? It seems he is spouting the "party line" of many (not all) athiestic people that frequently cause an upraor on this site.
My beliefs CAN and DO stand up to the "glare" that he comments about. It also stands up to critical thought. I am always up for a "theological" debate. I enjoy them, when the other party is actually ....

debating intelligently... Noting Evaporates, nothing goes poof... it's just a different opinion then yours.
He (and many others) also claim often that the bible is hogwash and is ridiculous... what is so ridiculous about the message? Seriously, I'd like your opinion.

Girl Wonder: OK… if you can see where he get’s it… elaborate?

Modelicio: I agree with you to an extent but I don’t lump that into all atheistic people. Some don’t call names. Some sadly do.

Captain Athieism: I disagree

Duffmanrb: Valid Point

Beachbum : Of that there is no dispute. Enjoy your points.

MichaelX: Thanks for the sarcasm enjoy your points.

Mikey : see My response to Modelicio

Answer 1

I don't think he's "slamming" at all. He's stating what he thinks. He's allowed to, you know. And yes, I can see where he gets it.

Answer 2

To begin with, everyone has a right to their opinion on the subject of religion or anything else for that matter. From what you have posted, I do not see any "slamming" being done. All DuckPhup seems to be doing is stating opinion. But regarding your question, "Where does this "death cult" mentality come from," it cannot possibly be "party line" if DuckPhup is an atheist. There is no official atheist group which speaks for all atheists so that is an impossibility. Instead...

Given the fact that The Big Three, Christianity, Judaism and Islam have a history of dying for their religious beliefs, and murdering for them as well, it is completely understandable that a non believer might come to the conclusion that they are offshoots of a death cult. I'm not saying that conclusion is correct. I'm saying that I understand how that conclusion could be formulated.

My advice? Go ahead! Engage in an intellectual theological debate with those who agree with this premise. Personally, I would find it fascinating and stimulating to watch.

Answer 3

You closed by asking what is wrong with the message of the bible. Well... everything. The entire meaningful content of the bible can be reduced to a single sentence: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." The rest is just myth, fairytales, fantastical delusions, pseudo-history and commentary... quite a lot of it psychotic.

You said that your beliefs can withstand critical thought. If you really think that, then you ought to put it to the test. Read this essay, take two aspirins, and get back to me tomorrow morning: http://www.cdicarlo.com/paper_05god.htm


P.S.: Craig wrote: "That's a cut-and-paste job, if I ever saw one. He's undermining himself by not thinking up his own arguments, but it is still a good point."

Of course it's a 'cut-and-paste job', Craig. The question that my text answers comes up about ten times a day. The arguments are, indeed, my own. The first time I answered the subject question ("Why are atheists in the R&S section... etc.") extemporaneously. I have the good fortune to be blessed with enough brains to SAVE what I write, and reuse it when the occasion arises. Since this possiblilty did not occur to you, I can only surmise that you are not

Answer 4

DuckPhup often takes a somewhat extreme approach. However, it's not only the atheists who do this. So let's ignore that for now.

Let's get to the philosophical question -- Is there one and only one truth?

If there is one and only one truth, then only intelligent and mathematical thought can come to discover this truth. Reason and logic are the only tools philosophy has that can perform 'proof' and without proof there is no truth. Anything that can only be defended by, "Well, it's what I believe," or, "well, that's what [my holy text's name] says!" is not proof or truth.

To say, "I believe one thing, you believe another" is to assert that truth either does not exist or is unknowable. If truth does not exist, then every religion, faith-filled or faith-less is false. If it is unknowable, then only agnosticism is correct. Truth must either be knowable, every religion must be false, or agnosticism is correct. You cannot have any other option.

The problem with religion is that there is no way to prove the existence of a deity, let alone which one is the right one. Until you can observe conclusively the spiritual realm, you cannot know its properties. You can look at your holy text, but it cannot be proven from first principles -- it must be taken as a collection of first principles. Thus your religion cannot be proven, as first principles are the accepted-as-true axioms upon which proof is built.

Now, as for the morality of belief -- so long as one honors the rights of all to believe as their courage and convictions lead them without interference, then they should be shown no interference. Evangelists of any faith should be silenced as agents of interference. Let people come to you as they have questions, or even just say, "Hey, we have this god, we really think he's b!tching, here's a pamplet and if you would like, we'd love to have you join us, see ya' around..." This is the essence of respect -- leaving people alone or neutrally giving them your idea so they can inquire if they wish to.

Now, not all members of a religion preach stupidity. However, the simple fact is that faith and reason cannot coexist. Either you must deny some aspect of reason or you must cripple your faith. To do so is to deny the truth, and thus value, of both. One cannot have it both ways.

Answer 5

Your post is proof of what he is saying. Your cult is based on blood sacrifice, first of animals in the Old Testament, then of Jesus in the New Testament. What sort of God wants blood sacrifice, and in that light how is the Israelite God any different than Chemosh or Baal?

In many ancient cultures, the killing of a human being, or the substitution of an animal for a person, was an attempt to commune with the god and to participate in the divine life. It also sometimes served as an attempt to placate the god and expiate the sins of the people. It was especially common among agricultural people (e.g., in the ancient Near East), who sought to guarantee the fertility of the soil. The Aztecs sacrificed thousands of victims (often slaves or prisoners of war) annually to the sun, and the Incas made human sacrifices on the accession of a ruler. In ancient Egypt and elsewhere in Africa, human sacrifice was connected with ancestor worship, and slaves and servants were killed or buried alive along with dead kings in order to provide service in the afterlife. A similar tradition existed in China. The Celts and Germanic peoples are among the European peoples who practiced human sacrifice. Christians all agree these practices are barbarous, but are always blind to the identical symbolism in their own cult.

You have not in fact objectively and critically analyzed your beliefs. If you had in fact objectively analyzed your beliefs the post you reference would not have been lost on you, as it clearly was, or evoked the visceral and emotional, and I must say, quite unreasoned response. This doesn't make you stupid., but it does a show gigantic blind spot where your cultural programming kicks in, as it did even with geniuses like Blaise Pascal.

It is very difficult for us to grasp the degree to which our socialization colors our thought processes, particularly socialization we received in childhood before we could critically examine the propositions we we're indoctrinated to believe in. The differences between Mithra-ism and Christianity in comparative religion terms are minor, almost negligible, but every Christian I know immediately pronounces Mithra ism stupid superstition the moment they hear it explained, by will argue vehemently about how reasonable their own belief is.

It is true that your beliefs withstand the glare, but not because you actually examine them in the light of day. It doubtless offends you, as it does everyone when you suggest they've been suckered by prejudices they'd learned before they could think, but that's the truth. If you're as bright as you think, you'll figure it out.

Answer 6

I am a theist. I believe in God. Really, I do.

But in Y!A, the ateists make more sense. There is so much ignorance being spewed around this board, I can hardly blame DuckPhup for trying to expose it. The things that people profess to believe on this site often fly in the face of logic, and it's like a fiery accident: I don't want to see it, yet I can't help looking on in astonishment.

So is it a slam to point out thses fallacies, as DuckPhup does in the rest of his post? I don't think so!

Answer 7

It seems- to me that ignorance is most common in materialistic conviction. One may choose to bash a belief & hope because they want to feel better than they do. Intellectually or however they let it manifest. Whether the feelings of less worth are imposed by society or chosen blaitanly are individualistic, Yet we all go thru hard times due to our predatory physicallity & response to past predatory experiences. I wish Ya The Best A' Love while overcoming the trials

Answer 8

Look at how many wars have been in the name of god. I see so many people. Religious people who are so afraid to look "outside" of the "good" book. That is the free thinking part. I am not out to disrespect anyone. But I find so many ready to disrespect me and my lack of belief. As you read answers above me. He is voicing his opinion just like all the religious people telling me I am going to hell .

Answer 9

But would we really be debating theology or mythology.... I simply don't know where to draw the line.... once you start talking about talking burning bushes and sticks turning to snakes and manna falling from the sky to feed people, the line blurs a bit you see.


Also, I have found DuckPhup to be one of the most intelligent answerers on this site, and I guarantee you he's ahead of every believer that has ever answered any of my questions. That is an unbiased opinion as well.

Answer 10

That's a cut-and-paste job, if I ever saw one. He's undermining himself by not thinking up his own arguments, but it is still a good point. If you are as educated as you claim, how can you not see the glaring condradictions between the Biblical stories and scientific fact? How can you claim to be a "freethinker" when religion clouds your mind to those whose opinion differs? (demonstrated perfectly by this question)

Answer 11

You wrote, "Penn Jillette and Richard Dawkins dont get on the internets merely to inform Christians that they are incorrect." No – they have their personal web pages, podcasts, and YouTube channels for that.