but and commas?

Question

Shopping is difficult, but it is fun to do.

Shopping is difficult, but fun to do.

In the second sentence does a subject need to be written out? Isn't it implied? Without the subject in the second clause it still needs a comma, right?

Yet with "and " as a coordinating conjuction this is not true.

I should not use a comma in the second phrase unless there is a subject and that subject must be written not implied.

when do you use a comma with "but"

Answer 1

The comma is NOT required in either of the sentences you list. Yes, the general rule is to use a comma to separate independent clauses in compound sentences (with a co-ordinating conjunction). BUT there is a widely agreed upon exception for SHORT clauses.

Examples:

"Before a coordinating conjunction (and, but, or, nor, so, for, yet) to connect independent clauses, but OPTIONAL if the clauses are short (less than 5 words)."
http://academic.luzerne.edu/bpajka/six_ways_to_use_commas.htm

"Use commas to separate clauses in compound sentences.
"A comma usually precedes a coordinating conjunction (and, but, or, nor, for, so, yet) that joins two independent clauses in a compound sentence.

"With very short clauses, you can sometimes omit the comma.

"Always use the comma if there is any chance the sentence will be misread without it."
http://glory.gc.maricopa.edu/~kfurlong/sgcommas.htm

"[Use a comma] between two complete clauses connected by a coordinating conjunction: and, but, or, nor, so, for, or yet. Comma use can be OPTIONAL if clauses are short. Example: He frowned[,] but she did not understand why."
http://college.hmco.com/english/raimes/digitalkeys/keyshtml/commas_w.htm

"[Rule] A comma is ordinarily used between two independent clauses that are joined by a coordinating conjunction. The coordinating conjunctions are "and," "but," "for," "or," and "nor." ("Yet" and "so" may also be treated as coordinating conjunctions when this rule is applied.). . .
Note: When both clauses are extremely short and simple, the comma may be omitted"
http://www.english.uiuc.edu/cws/wworkshop/writer_resources/writing_tips/comma_use.htm

Incidentally, though your first sentence qualifies as "short" under the five-word rule of thumb some suggest, it might be better to word it as follows:
"Shopping is difficult but it is fun." Even better might be a shortened version of the other sentence: "Shopping is difficult but fun." "To do" is not necessary in either case; the "it" already refers back to the action. (In other words, a more explicit way to express the idea would be, "Shopping is difficult[,] but shopping is fun.")

Answer 2

Your first example is what is known as a compound sentence. It is two complete independent sentences connected by a conjuction. There are two ways of handling that. The first is to add a comma before the conjuction. and the second way is to just use the conjuction. Both ways are grammatically correct. The most common way is to use the comma.

In your second example, the last part of your sentence is a dependent clause, and it is not a complete sentence on its own because it has no subject. ("Fun to do" is not a complete sentence on its own.) Do not use a comma in that sentence.

Answer 3

An independent clause is one that can stand alone in a sentence.
A dependent clause is one that can not.
A Dependent Clause word is one that changes an independent clause to a depentent clause.
But is a dependent clause word.

Therefore the second part of the sentence is NOT a complete sentence on its own.

But it's fun to do.

See? That's an incomplete thought.

You always use a comma, when a clause WOULD be an independent clause without the connecting word.

You do NOT use a comma when the clause wouldn't be independent, in any case.

Shopping is difficult but fun.

Answer 4

But I the proper grammer police say; whats the differance hope to remember a spell cheque here worth the ten points. Signed Grammer Police! " I am a nut to used everything in the book!" Do you knotty think so?? hyphen hyphen Plus when I am not quite a wake I really goof it up~~~~ < Ain't that so!>!!

Answer 5

It's what Julie said.

Answer 6

English is my weak point .