Atheists, pagans, wiccans, and others who don't believe in the God of the Bible?

Question

I'm curious - what "evidence" would you need to see to believe that God and his son Jesus is really real? This is a sincere question, I want to know if you're just looking for physical evidence, some kind of miracle before you will believe? Please take this question seriously, and really think about it. I mean, if you saw a vision of God telling you that it would rain blood, and the next day it did - would you believe then? Or would it take a visit from a real-live angel? Are you waiting for "proof"? Or do you feel indifferent about eternity, the afterlife, all that stuff?

If you're waiting for proof, please explain - what kind of proof? What kind of "evidence" are you hoping for?

Answer 1

Fair enough. It was respectfully asked and I will answer in kind.

When I say I want 'proof', what I am saying is that I want you to give me a set of axioms upon which we can agree. For example, "The universe exists", would be an axiom -- you can't actually prove it, believe it or not, because the only way to establish its 'truth' is experience, which is not proof.

With these axioms, I want you to use standard logical calculus to construct either an inductive or deductive proof wherein the final conclusion is, "Therefore, the God of the Christians exists."

Unfortunately, by the very nature of religious questions, this cannot be provided. Though, for that matter, it cannot be provided for atheism either.

Answer 2

Atheist here. I may believe in god(s) if there was even a little bit of evidence that one existed. There's no way I could believe in the god of the Bible though; it has properties that are mutually exclusive, proving it's nonexistence. It's like a 4 pointed triangle, such a shape cannot possibly exist. Not to mention the Bible is full of contradictions and Christianity has so many other concepts and problems that I just can't accept from an all powerful, all knowing, and all good god. If it was so obvious that any god existed, I don't think there would be any debate about it, atheists, or questions like this.

Answer 3

From an athiest perspective -

I am not waiting for evidence. I have reviewed and analyized the world I live in and have come to the conclusion that the god you believe in does not and cannot exist.

It is a matter of conceptualization based on conclusions made.

The idea that some miracle or an angel showing up would some how convince me I have been wrong all this time is unrealistic. Unrealistic because I can trace the historical origins of angels to a time and place, knowing they never existed as a concept before. I can debunk recorded miracles with some objective analysis.

So it comes down to my perception of reality versus yours. My reality does not include what you believe to exist, therefore I cannot percieve anything you suggest occuring as incentive to believe as being remotely possible in the first place.

While I respect that you have beliefs, I do not share your view of how the world and universe works.

The belief in afterlife predates christianity. People generally cannot grasp the concept that it might be all over in the end, and hope or believe that there is more. While I can respect this need and desire, I do not share it; so I would rather live my life to its fullest with the full expectation that when I die its game over.

Answer 4

There is no possible proof for God, or any claims about the divinity of Jesus. Both of these points have been demonstrated by thinkers like David Hume. Now, someone could show us hat thy are in contact with some intelligence beyond what physics would predict. For instance, you could bring someone making such a claim into an observatory and ask them the sunspot actvity. Have them say what it is every 30 second orso. 8 minutes after each prediction, whenthe light cone from the sun reaches earth, verify or refute their prediction. If they are correcteach time, this would suggest their claim was correct. But it still wouldnot be proof of God.

Answer 5

Something I think you're failing to understand...

Pagans are generally POLYTHEISTIC, meaning we worship more than one deity and acknowledge the existance of multiple deities. Being a Pagan does NOT necessarily mean that we "don't believe in the God of the Bible".

I believe the God of the Bible, YHVH, is real. Furthermore, I believe that Jesus was a prophet at the very least, and perhaps even attained divine status. I just don't worship either of them. No type "proof" is going to change that. I have plenty of proof that the gods I worship are absolutely real, so proving that your God exists isn't going to invalidate the existance of my gods, and certainly isn't going to convince me to rush off to church.

What I don't buy, the Judeo-Christian concept that I think is a bunch of fictious rubbish, is the whole Heaven & Hell thing. I believe in reincarnation--in the Buddhist/Hindu sense--that everybody continues to live infinite future (and past) lives. Again, no "proof" is going to change this belief, as I'm positive that you're model of the afterlife is just plain wrong.

Answer 6

Physical evidence would be good, but I would accept something equivalent to a claimant raising people from the dead under tightly controlled and monitored conditions. And, able to do it repeatedly under those conditions.

But, there is no possible way I would accept someone's word that they witnessed a miracle unless it could be duplicated and had no other rational explanation.

And, the bible has no credibility, so quoting or citing the bible is pointless. Or, any other book based on the bible.


Edit: No, I would not accept dreams, hallucinations, visions or anything similar as proof God exists. I believe the universe to be interconnected siince we are all made of the same "stuff," and it is possible to receive communications through various means beyond our comprehension, but that is not evidence of some supernatural entity's existence.

Answer 7

I believe that many deities exist but this does not mean that I worship them all and I do not believe that any of them are all-knowing, all-powerful, all-positive, or all-negative. If I were to have a vision of a deity telling me that it would rain blood, I would probably think it was my own storm god, Taranis. I would make an offering to Taranis and thank him for his blessings. The thought of the Christian god would never cross my mind because he is not one of the deities that I worship. I am not waiting for proof of the Christian god. I have never practiced Christianity or read their holy texts, so why would I even think about their deity?

I am looking forward to going to the Otherworld after death and feasting with my deities and my ancestors before incarnating again. I'm not indifferent about it at all.

What "evidence" would you need to believe in my deities? Are you waiting for "proof"?

Answer 8

I've read the whole bible (multiple overlapping studies) and found that the God of the old testament acts like a schizoid 14 yr old jerk most of the time. Also, some of his "miracles " would land him in a concrete cell in the Hague as a defendant for war crimes today.

The whole "Resurrection and salvation thing" makes absolutely no sense what so ever. It smacks of "keeping them in line" so bad that I'm really surprised Xians haven't tried to 'lessen" its importance in modern times.

Another thing is that Xianity and all the other monotheistic religions tend to be the Knowers and the True Believers. Someone wrong, right?

Look at nature - it's beautiful and diverse yet it's elegant simple. That seems like the handy work of god to me. The bible seems like the work of controlling, angry men that used religion instead of swords to control those around them.

Now, I do find much to be applauded by men and women of the various faiths. I've read about many of the saints and mystics of xianity and the Sufis and dervishes of Islam. I absolutely love some of the mental and physical teachings of the Hindus and Buddhists.

Know what impresses me and makes me want to do what someone is doing? When they are living a good life and concerned for the welfare of those around them.

Cheers!

Answer 9

I try to keep an open mind, but I see no evidence that any gods exist. I want to know if Brahma, Tien Ti, Allah, Zeus, Odin, Amon, Ra, Aten, Marduk, Asshur and the Hebrew god Yahweh (mistransalated as Jehovah) exist...don't you? You should consider that these other gods may exist and will punish you if you believe in Yahweh instead of them. The First Commandment of Moses indicates that many gods exist, so you may be worshipping the wrong one. I think Zeus can beat Yahweh in a fight, for Zeus has lightning, while Yahweh just bores one to death. I see much proof that gods don't exist. The Bible has dozens of contradictions and scientific inaccuracies. If it is the word of Yahweh, he is an ignoramus, so I can easily outwit him. I worry as much about afterlifes as I do about Santa Claus not bringing me gifts if I misbehave. Mature men aren't motivated by childish rewards and punishments. I am not very likely to see any logical and scientific evidence to prove imaginary things exist, e.g. gods, devils, ghosts, ET's, Bigfoot, Loch Ness monster, dragons, etc.

Answer 10

I would not consider myself atheist because I believe in something, just not anything that has so far been defined in a religion. I am personally not looking for evidence that God exists. I know in my heart that he does not. Just like you know in yours that he does. If I saw a vision of God telling me that it would rain blood and it did then I would wonder why. I would not believe it was God however. I believe in a higher power, but not the Christian God. I also believe in an afterlife but I don't believe in it the way Christians do. I don't believe in the devil or hell. There is absolutely nothing I can currently conceive of that could prove to me that God exists or that christianity is the only true religion. In my mind, all religions are true religions.