I haven't picked on the Atheists in a while....?

Question

(Though often accused of being an atheist, I'm actually agnostic.)

Atheists: don't you make assumptions about the "god" issue that can't be tested or proven in any way?

Isn't it true that absence of evidence =/= evidence of absence ?

Why do you assume that no god exists if you can't demonstrate this?

Does it all come down to Occam's Razor and parsimony to you?

Isn't there a logical possiblity that you're wrong?



(that was fun... it has been a while since I picked on you guys! Know that I just want to see your perspectives ... I'm not attacking... I'd say that I'm playing the "devils advocate" but some nutjobs here go berzerk when they hear that term)

Answer 1

"Isn't it true that absence of evidence =/= evidence of absence?"

That is an excellent point.

Answer 2

I am aware that the idea of god cannot be disproven, but I'm still an atheist, not agnostic. I don't feel a need to disprove everything that someone makes up before I can decide that it's not true. Ever speak with a schizophrenic, or someone with dementia? Imagine if you had to believe everything they said, or at least not disbelieve it, until you went out and disproved every claim. A lot of them you wouldn't even be able to disprove, simply because they are the ones making it up, and they wont let you. That is not a sane way to live.

Someonething that does not exist will leave no evidence of it's existance, or it's non-existance. There logically simply has to be a point where you have give up and say "Ok, we've been searching for thousands of years and found nothing. This does not exist"

Answer 3

You are right in saying that there is no way to officially prove beyond a doubt that there is no higher power... therefore, I use logic and reason to tell me there is not one.

Here let me help you. If all the ancient religions of the world are wrong, then it stands to reason that they will continue being wrong.

Again, an example. I don't believe in aliens because of the type of people claiming to believe in aliens. People claiming to have been anally probed and then returned to earth. False sightings and fake crop formations. These people acting in such a rediculous manner have made it impossible for me to believe in them because I would rather not associate with them than believe. Do I think there is life elsewhere in the universe? Yes, because I'm not so self-important to think that we are all there is. Do I think it's a little gray man anally probing people on Earth?Of course not.

Yet, I have not quite gotten to the meat of the question. All I have said so far is logic proves to me that those people believing in religion and aliens are idiots, and rather than join them in believing and sharing belief with the idiots, I disassociate myself.
This still does not answer why I don't "feel" that there is a higher power out there. The reason for this is I don't feel there is a need to believe in a higher power at the moment.

Every question I might have that could only be explained by a higher power, science has explained for me. Everything short of the beginnings of the universe, and there are some guesses and theories on that. Far more theories than the alternative can offer me. I have seen no reason to believe that we have a soul, or that there is any sort of afterlife. This has probably been ruined again by the concept that the afterlife concept is housed amongst information about talking donkeys, burning bushes, frogs falling from the sky, seas parting and dead people coming back to life.

If I were to tell you that on the 3rd week of November, there will be a full moon when a 4 titties cow stands up, howls like a wolf, dances an Irish jig and then passes out drunk off Jack Daniels would you believe part of the story or dismiss it all outright as BS? There may ni fact be a full moon in the 3rd week in November, but you would dismiss it outright because logic dictates if the rest of the story is crap, it all must be.

The same it is for atheism for me. Well, don' think that covered it as best as possible, but best I can do now. :)

Answer 4

Atheists and Agnostics are just as proud, important and happy as the rest. All religions are a myth. An Agnostic approach would be noone can prove there is a god and noone can prove there is no god. Atheist believes there is no god period and do not feel obligated to prove it. Some Agnostics consider themselves Atheists, some do not. Kindness comes from with in your heart not who you worship. If you enjoy being a devil advocate I hope you enjoy it however I do not believe that dude ex histed either.
Here is a sight that may explain why you are being accused of being Atheist. http://www.religioustolerance.org/agnostic.htm
Selnyk made me laugh w/that cow story, that was good LOL!

Answer 5

Nothing wrong with having fun, and there's nothing wrong with making assumptions, but there is something definitely wrong when you make assumptions and pass the information off as factual truth as religion does, that's not fun.

If we assume the universe was created, then it’s reasonable to assume there was a creator. That’s as far as science has progressed today, but just look how far religion has progressed.

Religion states (fact) there was a creator called God, that God still exists, God also created places called Heaven & Hell, God wrote an instruction book called the Bible, God will banish evil people to Hell, God will send good people who follow the Bible to heaven, that people referred to in the Bible (like Jesus) will return to Earth, and a whole raft of other statements of fact. That’s right, religious fact, not assumptions.

Now tell me truthfully, if science doesn’t even know yet whether the universe was created or not, but religious believers state: “not only was the universe created by God, here’s a whole lot more proof and facts to go with it, what do you think?

Either religious believers just have vivid imaginations or suffer from a common mental illness. I think commonsense and logic would suggest that religious believers are mentally handicapped.

Answer 6

I guess I am not so much a fan of proving or disproving God- you are just arguing abstracts and discernibles....not for me.
I would rather find ways to open the theists mind to your rewards being here on earth, practicing tolerance and acceptance, taking care of our planet and each other, all in all making it a better place.
Is that as difficult a task as playing peek-a-boo with God?
Probably

Will I keep trying?
Yup

Answer 7

God is one possibility (except that the Bible paints a logical contradiction of him). It is an extremely ridiculous possibility...more ridiculous than Jello-salad being the creator...because omnipotence and omniscience are outrageous concepts. For God to be omnipotent instead of almost omnipotent is a phenominal leap towards improbablility. He's also a character out of a book. People have made up many gods, they like to. Capital G is just one of them. A personal creator that is omnipotent, omniscient, perfectly good, perfectly loving of US, looks like us, and has no origin is the most preposterous thing I've ever heard, or could concieve of. No wonder they have to catch people when they're young to spread this idea (akin to Santa, tooth fairy, etc...).

Answer 8

I do not think that god does NOT exist, I just DON'T believe in god, a more agnostic approach to the situation.

I'm the type of person that if I don't have god dancing right under my nose, I'll deny his existence forever... =)

Oh, and by the way, god was never sufficiently proven, so I feel I do not have to disprove anything first.

Answer 9

THOR would be interested to know whether devlsadvocar's knowledge of Occam's razor and Parsimony is possibly no deeper than Wikipedias' definition as the context in which he uses them does not make sense to the question he has asks.

Answer 10

A slight possibility, but yes, the absence of evidence is evidence of absence.

Answer 11

Consider the following sentence:

I do believe that god does exist.

That sentence can be negated in two ways:

1. I DO NOT believe that god does exist.

2. I believe that god DOES NOT exist.

The first sentence expresses the WEAK atheist position, also known as the AGNOSTIC-atheist position. The second sentence represents the STRONG atheist position.

The weak atheist position is characterized by an ABSENSE of belief, brought about by the lack of evidence that would be necessary to bring about or sustain 'belief'. In this sense, the absence of belief in god is equivalent to an absence of belief in Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy and Thor. The weak atheist (agnostic) position bears no burden of proof, since it is not asserting anything to be 'true'.

The STRONG atheist position is arrived at by a CERTAINTY that god DOES NOT exist, and implies that compelling evidence exists to support such a certainty. That being the case, it would seem that the strong atheist position DOES bear a burden of proof, since it is asserting that 'no god' is a 'true' proposition.

Intuitively, it would seem to be reasonable to acknowledge that there could be some variations or nuances between those two positions, but I don't know how to characterize them.

I am more of a 'snotty' atheist... but I think that has more to do with my utter contempt for people who create their world view from the myths, superstitions, fairy tales and fantastical delusions of an ignorant bunch of peripatetic Bronze Age goat herders, with no credible evidence, than it has to do with my lack of 'belief'.

For just-plain 'agnostics', I guess the most accurate way to present their viewpoint is to say that "... the jury is still out" with respect to whether any gods do or do not exist... i.e., there is insufficient evidence to support a decision either way. There is some overlap though, with the 'weak atheist' position, since for both, the assertion "I do not believe that god exists" is TRUE.

I think that 'belief' itself is the culprit, since it effectively cuts off the mind from the intellectually honest consideration of alternative possibilities.

"An agnostic is basically an atheist without any balls." ~ Stephen Colbert