Vain repetition in prayers! Protestants say it's wrong.?

Question

I'm a Catholic. We have Litany prayers that tend to repeat many of the same phrases over and over again.

Many protestants believe repetitve prayers are wrong!

Psalm 136 is a litany prayer, and is very repititve. Is that wrong too?

Gee, I don't like.....like a previous question on here from a protestant claiming repetive prayers are wrong.

Answer 1

Consider what's commonly called the Lord's Prayer (Mt 6; Lk 11) has been repetively prayed in homes, churches, schools, public meetings, prayer meetings, for centuries and decades as recently as the last decade; Consider such prayer has leaven in it (forgive us "as we forgive others"), has conditional (you first) forgiveness noted in the PS following such prayer model (if you don't forgive all men all trespasses, neither will you be forgiven), and that such prayer is notably given in request to a disciple saying teach us to pray like John taught his disciples, notably the John who lost his head for accusing and condemning a king.
http://www.godshew.org/ShewBread2.htm#LordPrayer

Consider it's to Our Father, which art, in heaven
(who has the same "hallowed" name as we do)
- give "us" our bread (grace of such law/grace)
- forgive "us" (not them, nor both them and us)
- deliver "us" from evil(law & law worketh wrath)
Consider these prayer requests are answered:
- ye are not under law, but under grace
- God hath forgiven you for Christ's sake
- we are delivered from the law
In each case grace has replaced the law

Consider also the past tense "forgiven" in Eph 4's conclusion is neither you first nor conditional, but God first, freely and unconditionally given unto all, while yet sinners, for there is no respect of persons with God, so it applies to all if to any at all.

Consider also the only true and lasting forgiveness plausible to any and all is via the abolition of law, since blasphemy the Ghost, speaking anything against the law thereof such Ghost, even if to say it's not fair as a child, is unpardonable, both in this world and the to come (as if more law what's to come... not on my watch).

Connecting the biblical dots we find:
Our Father, deliver us from evil: Mt 6
We are delivered from the law: Rom 6

And furthermore it's because:
whatsoever is not of faith is sin: Rom 14
the law is not of faith: Gal 3
only faith pleases God (Grace)
never took pleasure in such law

Our bottom line should be thank God,
that God in Christ: "the end of the law",
our peace who hath abolished the law.

The "grace" of our Lord Jesus Christ with you all. Amen.

Answer 2

Matt. 6:7 - Jesus teaches, "do not heap up empty phrases" in prayer. Protestants use this verse to criticize various Catholic forms of prayer which repeat phrases, such as litanies and the Rosary. But Jesus' focus in this instruction is on the "vain," and not on the "repetition."

Matt. 26:44 - for example, Jesus prayed a third time in the garden of Gethsemane, saying the exact same words again. It is not the repetition that is the issue. It's the vanity. God looks into our heart, not solely at our words.

Luke 18:13 - the tax collector kept beating his breast and praying "God be merciful to me, a sinner." This repetitive prayer was pleasing to God because it was offered with a sincere and repentant heart.

Acts 10:2,4 - Cornelius prayed constantly to the Lord and his prayers ascended as a memorial before God.

Rom. 1:9 - Paul says that he always mentions the Romans in his prayers without ceasing.

Rom. 12:12 - Paul commands us to be constant in prayer. God looks at what is in our heart, not necessarily how we choose our words.

1 Thess. 5:17 - Paul commands us to pray constantly. Good repetition is different than vain repetition.

Rev. 4:8 - the angels pray day and night without cessation the same words "Holy, Holy, Holy is the Lord God Almighty." This is repetitious prayer that is pleasing to God.

Psalm 136 - in this Psalm, the phrase "For His steadfast love endures forever" is more repetitious than any Catholic prayer, and it is God's divine Word.

Dan. 3:35-66 - the phrase "Bless the Lord" is similarly offered repeatedly, and mirrors Catholic litanies.

I hope these verses help you with understanding what God meant about repetitous prayers.

Answer 3

Praying in the Spirit is much better than pray a litany or doctrinal prayers because it is more personal. God wants a personal relationship with you, and this is best achieved one-on-one with God. Using the prayers that someone else has written adds an unnecessary third party to the mix. Protestants believe that a separate priesthood is not necessary to reach God, that each believer is a priest---the Bible says so. Praying in the Spirit take practice to become good at it, but it is rewarding. Praying in the Spirit can be either in tongues or in your first language or a combination of both.

Answer 4

It is in the bible that Jesus said not to pray repititious prayers, yet let them be heartfelt. Nowhere in the bible does it venerate Mary or call for prayers for the dead or prayer to the saints, or calling anyone other than God, Father, of praying the rosary.Those are all Catholic doctrines. If you are a devout Catholic and follow these things then I salute you for your steadfast faith in your religion. I just do not believe they apply, in any other way than for the preists and the pope to have more control over your daily lives.Why would the lord take the time to have prophets take down his word so that only one man could be allowed to read from it. And no man is perfect save God so how can the pope be infallible. Scripture is open to interpretation and that is what scares me most about Catholicism. I again apologize as I do not mean to bash Catholicism.

Answer 5

There are many differences in liturgy, dogma, doctrine, and practice between Catholics and Protestants. I personally am a Protestant but view Catholics as my brothers and sisters in Christ. There are denominationall differences within the Protestants also but really isn't it more productive to the spread of the Gospel for us to emphasize those things which unite us rather than those things which divide?
There are essentials of the Christian Faith that unite and there are non-essentials which are silly to divide over like the pentecostals who have varying degrees of emphasis on the evidence of the Holy Spirit and how it fits into the salvation plan. I was raised as a Pentecost but was out of that denomination for years before I was saved thru the deluge of gospel tracts sent to me by my brother when I was in the military. At that time I was into oriental philosophy. But I've been a Christian since the days of the Jesus People movement of the early 70's. I have since been involved in fellowship with everything from stoic Methodists and Nazarenes to Catholics, Messianic Jews, and Charismatic Baptists. And you know what? We have all had our peculiar ways and practices but it has always been our love of the Lord that united us. So....if you want to practice your Catholicism in the way that makes you feel close to God, more power to ya. Sometimes I pray in repitition and it comes from my heart and sometimes I make a prayer or petition to God in a personal conversation as I would if He were kneeling beside me. Is pointing out a wrong way to worship God in prayer really that essential to who we are as believers?

Answer 6

Most non-Catholics see the Rosary as a prayer of vain repetition.

Yes, it is repetitive, but if prayed correctly, it is not in vain.

When praying the Rosary, a person should be reflecting on Biblical events of the lives of Jesus and Mary

The list of mysteries below corresponds to moments in the life, passion, and death of Jesus and Mary's participation in them chronologically.

Joyful Mysteries

1. The Annunciation of the Blessed Virgin Mary Fruit of the Mystery: Humility
2. The Visitation of the Blessed Virgin Mary Fruit of the Mystery: Love of Neighbor
3. The Nativity of Our Lord Fruit of the Mystery: Love of God
4. The Presentation of the Lord in the Temple Fruit of the Mystery: Obedience
5. The Finding in the Temple Fruit of the Mystery: Zeal for God


Luminous Mysteries

1. The Baptism of Jesus Fruit of the Mystery: Openness to the Holy Spirit
2. The Marriage at Cana Fruit of the Mystery: To Jesus through Mary
3. The Proclamation of the Kingdom of God Fruit of the Mystery: Repentance and Trust in God
4. The Transfiguration Fruit of the Mystery: Desire for Holiness
5. The Institution of the Eucharist Fruit of the Mystery: Adoration


Sorrowful Mysteries

1. The Agony in the Garden Fruit of the Mystery: Contrition
2. The Scourging at the Pillar Fruit of the Mystery: Purity
3. The Crowning with Thorns Fruit of the Mystery: Courage
4. The Carrying of the Cross Fruit of the Mystery: Patience
5. The Crucifixion and Death of Jesus Fruit of the Mystery: Self-denial


The Glorious Mysteries

1. The Resurrection of Christ. Fruit of the Mystery: Faith
2. The Ascension of Jesus. Fruit of the Mystery: Hope
3. The Descent of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost. Fruit of the Mystery: Charity
4. The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary. Fruit of the Mystery: The grace of a Happy Death
5. The Coronation of Blessed Virgin Mary in Heaven. Fruit of the Mystery: Trust in Mary's intercession

All that non-Catholics hear is the repetition of the Hail Marys. They cannot see into the heart and mind of the person who is contemplating these mysteries, so it does appear to be vain repetition.

The Rosary, prayed correctly, is not VAIN repetition. It is a prayer that helps us contemplate and understand the lives of Mary and Jesus and how their lives teach us virtue

Answer 7

By its very definition, a psalm is "a sacred song or poem of praise," so declaring it to be a prayer, much more a litany prayer, is a long stretch.

Regardless, the problem is not the vain repetition IN prayers, but the vain repetition OF prayers. A lot of Amens, hallelujahs, and "Praise the Lord"s can be repeated when we Christians (both Catholic and non-Catholic) pray, and there is no problem with that. The problem that most non-Catholics have is the vain repetition of Our Fathers, Hail Marys, Glory Bes, and the like.

When Christ gave Matthew 6: 9-13 (well known to many as the Our Father) it is not to be taken as a prayer in itself, but rather as a manner in which to pray. If each line of the prayer is studied (as opposed to being taken blindly as a formula) one will see that in our prayers we must declare the following:

- That God is our Father (a declaration of loyalty)
- That God's name is Holy (a declaration of respect)
- That God's Kingdom will come (a declaration of hope)
- That God's will shall be done here as it is in heaven (a declaration of obedience)
- That God will provide for our earthly needs (a declaration of faith)
- That God will forgive our sins, and in the same way we must forgive others' sins (a declaration of humility)
- That God will not bring us into temptation far greater than we can handle (a declaration of trust)
- That God will save us from sin and evil (a declaration of help)
- That all kingdoms, powers and glory belong to God (a declaration of His sovereignity)

Thus, a person can repeat the Our Father hundreds of times, but unless he actually means these things in his heart, then the Our Father, coming from that person, is a vain repetition. And for him to think that God will hear him the more he repeats such does the same thing that the heathen do. (see Matthew 6: 5-7)

Most Christians do take prayer for granted, praying only when in need, in want or in trouble, as if God is a genie that can grant your wishes. God listens to our prayers, but he listens just as if you were speaking to a friend who is in a higher position than you but one you are close to and can trust. If you would repeat the same thing over and over again, wouldn't that friend be weary of hearing you? What more of our Lord, who listens to many that pray the Our Father but do not mean any of the things written there?

When you speak to another, you speak what is on your mind, right? Surely you do not have to pull out index cards and give a prepared speech to that person every time you speak to him, right? How much more wearisome it must be for God, who listens to people read the mysteries and declare the creeds, yet what He wants to hear is what you really want to say to Him.

At the same time, prayer is not just a Christian talking to God, but is also a means for God to talk to that Christian. If you constantly keep talking to God, surely you must give God a chance to talk back to you, right?

So when we pray, we must mean the things that we pray. If you really declare and believe in every single line in a litany or an Our Father, then your prayer will be heard. But if you only believe in part of that formulaic prayer, better to pray those parts alone and be honest in your heart, rather than to pray the entire prayer and be a liar...

Answer 8

anthonyinkc,
Heh. Protestants say . . . . it doesn't really matter does it? I mean what Protestants say?

But what did Jesus say?
Matthew 6:7
But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

And to top that off, about who they are praying to . . . Mary? MARY?
"For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus" (1 Timothy 2:5).

"In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groans that words cannot express. And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints in accordance with God's will" (Romans 8:26-27).

Mary just isn't going to be there for you. You are not worshipping God in prayer. You worship with strange doctrine, not divine.

Answer 9

Jesus said not to pray in vain repetitions. I think what He is saying is don't be routine all of the time in prayer.

Answer 10

see you left out the key word in your question VAIN, VAIN, VAIN.

if you've said the same prayer over so many times to the point where you can't even feel its meaning or significance, its time to change it up...