Does Love demand we selfishly ignore the pain of loved ones?
Or does Love demand we share their fate so that we may do whatever is in our power to ease their pain?
2006-09-01 16:33:47 · 22 answers · asked by bobkgin 3 in Society & Culture ➔ Religion & Spirituality
It is interesting watching a group of strangers presume that because they don't know the beliefs of my loved ones, I can't either.
I shudder to think of how little they know their spouses, with that kind of logic.
Perhaps I was more interested in my loved ones than they. Perhaps I wanted to know what my loved ones believe, and they don't.
Which of us loves deeper, those who are ignorant of the beliefs of their loved ones, or those who took the time and effort to find out?
2006-09-01 16:46:16 · update #1
Squirelly: from what you are saying, Wainwright is throwing out Revelations 21:8. I could toss the entire Bible and claim to be a "Christian", but that doesn't make it so.
2006-09-01 16:48:31 · update #2
Malsvb6: My love for my wife and father is real, as was theirs for me. Love conquers all, even the fear of hell. I'll follow my love for those who have cherished me as I've cherished them.
Your shepherd has not loved me, nor demonstrated any love for me. it was my wife who comforted me in my pain, not your shepherd. It was my father who taught me wisdom, not your shepherd.
That your scripture condemns them to hell is a good enough reason for me to doubt your scripture contains any wisdom worthy of the name.
Many have chosen to ignore Rev 21:8, but I don't. Christianity is the whole book, not comfortable excerpts.
I chose Love, not a book that condemns good people for not believing in the divinity of the Christian god.
Which of us is better off?
2006-09-01 16:56:33 · update #3
Squirelly: I appreciate your effort. Most of my questions tend to provoke thought that goes beyond the ability to express. I disturb comfortable 'truths' in the hopes we can find deeper truths. Where most would say "God is Love" I say "Love is God". it should mean the same, but the emphasis for me is a healthy relationship with Love.
The scriptural god does not inspire a relationship in me. But Love is real, fathomable, and very beneficial to all it touches.
I've just lost my wife. My four year old son has lost his mother. Love is far more important in our lives than any god. Through Love we will overcome our loss and keep my wife in our hearts. Scripture god says forget them and focus on your own 'salvation'.
Love is not so selfish. And neither am I.
2006-09-01 17:17:17 · update #4
Claypigeon: Love conquers all, unless you give up. Love doesn't allow me to give up. If a loved one was dying of lung cancer, I'd still be there, offering comfort and Love.
2006-09-01 17:29:46 · update #5
Claypigeon: It is not my scripture that demands such decisions. It is the Christian scripture that places such a burden upon us, and it is for that reason I reject their scripture as false and embrace the power of Love.
And given the choices between heaven and hell, I choose hell for the sake of those I love. I've no more reason to believe in a false god who would send good people to hell than they did, nor have I heard one good argument to believe otherwise. All I've heard is 'the ship is sinking, every man for himself'. If they were in the water and I in a lifeboat, do you really think I will not jump in to keep them company and offer them comfort and my Love?
Either my loved ones are saved or I refuse salvation.
"...whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge..."
Ruth 1:16
2006-09-02 00:21:01 · update #6
Dr. Geoffery Wainwright, leading professor of theology at Duke Divinity School (the school is United Methodist, Wainwright is British Methodist), argues that it is not heresy to believe that God doesn't send non-Christians to hell, but that it may in fact be a valid Christian belief in light of the all-consuming love and compassion of God.
Wainwright won't admit this in his writings (he's very well published), but he has said it in his intro to Christian Theology class.
You can be a Christian and reject the idea that God sends people to hell. I believe there is a hell, I just believe it is reserved for ultimate evil, not people. I believe that Christ's love and compassion and sacrafice saved us all, not just those who believe.
God is Love, he says be with those you love, they are also those that he loves.
(More)
Actually, there are a lot of Christians who believe in Christ, and believe that as far as the Bible points to a revelation of Jesus Christ as God incarnate, the Bible is valid. But we also recognize that the Bible was written by men inspired by God. Inspired doesn't mean perfectly innerrant.
Christians are supposed to worship Christ, not the Bible. When you take one verse out of the Bible and say that you must believe that or you're not a Christian, then you're worshiping the Bible, not Christ. You might as well take Paul's letters that say women can't wear gold jewelry or braid their hair and say you're not Christian if you don't believe that.
Christians need to develop a theology based on the message of the Bible as a whole, instead of "proof-texting" (taking individual verses to prove our point).
I've realized I've gone way deeper into this than I meant to. There's only so much you can talk about on Yahoo Answers. There's not much room for nuance here, but I'm trying.
Between you and me (and anyone else who might read this), maybe you're right, maybe I've gotten so open-ended that I'm not a Christian anymore. If that's the case, I'm ok with that, because I feel right about what I believe.
I guess if I were given the choice that you're proposing, I wouldn't want to be in heaven with a God that sent my loved ones to hell.
2006-09-01 16:40:27 · answer #1 · answered by squirellywrath 4 · 2⤊ 0⤋
I believe that love demands that we do what is in the best interest of the people we love. Sometimes this means we can't ease their pain. Example:
Sombody you love had a great life with many friends and oportunities, but somewhere along the way they hit a rough patch and began using heroin. The end up broke and without a place to sleep every night. When they don't have money for heroin they start to have withdrwal. What do you do? Do you give them money? If you do they will go and buy more, and you have eased their suffering. If you don't they will suffer. If this was happening to someone I loved I would not ease their pain, but would instead try to help them end their addiction, which is a miserable and painfull process.
On the other side of this I would without hesitation give my life so that someone I loved would life.
Sometimes easing the pain of a loved one is the right thing to do, but other times you need to put them in more pain because it is in their best interest.
2006-09-03 04:24:45 · answer #2 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
I apologize for the answer earlier, it was a poor attempt at humor.
The bible references "high heavens", and the Muslims believe in something like 7 heavens. That being said. I believe there are in fact different level of heavens, (like purgatory for Catholics), for the different levels of commitment. I cannot believe a just, loving God would condemn someone to an eternal hell, literally. I think hell that is mentioned in the bible is reserved for Satan and his ilk--and for those who refused and worked against God, in their lifetime.
I have put myself in a scenario, where what would I do if I were God. And being a father, I think I can have the sense in judging someone as a father (God) would judge his children (us).
Who knows?
2006-09-01 23:42:29 · answer #3 · answered by amish-robot 4 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Trying to help a loved one stop smoking so they stay healthy is an act of love. Stabbing yourself in the chest because they didn't quit and are now dieing of lung cancer is an act of stupidity.
Everybody makes their own choices and must deal with the consequences of those choices. The loving thing is to try to encourage good choices. No matter how we feel or what we do, their 'fate' is their own.
2006-09-02 00:24:12 · answer #4 · answered by claypigeon 4 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Love is everlasting, I have loved ones that I know dont share the beliefs that I have died, that doesn't mean I love them any less. however if in the second question you are referring to going to hell to be with loved ones and comfort, I share your sentiments but Hell is solitude, as there is always joy and comfort in heaven there will be none in Hell. I hate answering these types of questions because it honestly does pull at me because I can relate, but I have to speak according to my beliefs because they are who I am. imagine if five small sheep got lost in the woods, two of them fall into a pit and cannot escape from it, yet three others remain lost and lose sight of each other as well. one of them hears the shepard approach them and sees how happy he is to have found his lost sheep, would that sheep then decide to jump into the pit with the two that have no means of escaping because the route they chose led to an unfortunate end, or would that sheep then follow his faithful and loving shepard to search for the other sheep that have not yet been found?
2006-09-01 23:47:08 · answer #5 · answered by malsvb6 3 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Love doesn't demand that we ignore the pain of our loved ones. God loves these people even more than we do. God doesn't want any of us to be in Hell. That is why all believers need to tell our loved ones about Jesus.
It would be so terribly sad for me to know that one of my loved ones died without choosing Jesus as their Lord and Savior. However, I do believe that God's grace is there for people who do not understand who Jesus is. If we do understand that He came to the earth to become the ultimate sacrifice for our sins and then we don't choose to follow Him, we have made that choice for ourselves. I would never follow someone else to Hell but I would do everything in my power to tell them about Jesus.
My brother was a drug addict and a non-believer for 35 years. I spent a lot of time speaking badly about him. Then one night, God told me to stop criticizing him and to pray for him. He reminded me that I was also a sinner, saved by Jesus. Within about two weeks my brother was arrested and sent to jail. He requested a Christian rehab and was sent to the rehab for 18 months. God changed his heart. He passed on about 4 years ago but, I know that he had accepted Jesus and is now with Him. Prayer for God to change people does work.
2006-09-01 23:50:14 · answer #6 · answered by 4HIM- Christians love 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Going to hell would do nothing to ease anyone else's pain. What do you think Hell is, an evil room where we can keep each other company?
I am going to Heaven. It makes me sad to think that others are not, but there is nothing I can do about that. They've made a choice, and so have I.
2006-09-01 23:39:33 · answer #7 · answered by mynickname 3 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Love never demands.Lv means sharing and caring, may it b happiness or may it b sorrows.LUV cannot b defined in words so i'm nt talking about it any further.I believe in iternal lv and believe that its power continues even after death.So if i hv 2 make a choice between heaven and my lv i'll surely choose my lv.4 me,being with my lv means being in heaven
2006-09-01 23:49:12 · answer #8 · answered by JOJO 2 · 1⤊ 0⤋
If you've not shared enough Hell-on-Earth with them, then by all means follow them to the fiery pits of Beelzebub's realm.
The other side of it is, of course, that, if they really loved you, they would have made sure to wind up in Heaven. If they're Hellward bound, maybe they're just not that into you.
2006-09-01 23:37:47 · answer #9 · answered by Biff 3 · 0⤊ 0⤋
assuming all the axioms inherent in the question are true and a convention vision of hell (and also my biases, conscious or unconscious) then:
the intent is not that the good would work their way into hell as that would increase suffering (theirs) and not alleviate the suffering of their loved ones and perhaps would be used to increase the grief of their loves ones
2006-09-01 23:37:29 · answer #10 · answered by larry n 4 · 0⤊ 0⤋