Omnipotence means that -everything- is God's will. How can that be limited in any way? (please read all)?

Question

People refer to the fact that God is limited because he allows for Evil to exist, and especially for all of us to have free will and make decisions for ourselves. Doesn't this go against the very definition of all-powerful omnipotence? If -everything- is your will, then NOTHING can be against your will. The existence of evil and sin HAS to be your will. The act of Lucifel to speak out against you and turn your angels away HAD to be your will. People themselves have only an illusion of free will because EVERYTHING HAS TO BE YOUR WILL! So how can all these die hard christians claim to have free will and pray to pursuade God to do something other than what will invariably happen, because if it happens (good or bad) it had to be his will to begin with? Why claim free will in the first place? Why worry about making people happy and deciding whether or not they will go to Heaven or Hell if it was your will what they did and what happened in the first place?

Answer 1

Sounds like a very good argument against Omnipotence...

God cannot cede power, because if he does, he is no longer all powerful, and therefore no longer omnipotent. He also cannot 'allow things to happen, because being all-powerful cannot be a passive thing. It has to be an active all-the-time always-present everything-is-my-will type thing, past, present, and future. God can forgive us because it was his will what we did in the first place.

Sorry, my fellow zombies, but we have only an illusion of free will if God is truly omnipotent...

But that still doesn't answer why he sends us to Heaven or Hell for what he willed us to do, does it? Wouldn't make sense... Therefore, we all go to Heaven? *YAY!* God is omnibenevolent too, right? so thats GOTTA mean that we all go to Heaven, cuz he's just that nice to begin with.

But wait, that doesn't answer for existence of Evil... Hmm...
I'm outa answers. Good luck with that one.

Answer 2

Oooooo I like this question! If there is anything at all you define as infinite about God then you are saying God IS everything. If God is everything then God is also everyone (think bubbles of limited awareness floating in the infinite ocean of God). Therefore your free will is actually Gods will. Before you yell at me about evil existing and not being God, think of the implications of what I just said. If there is only God there can be no evil, only the illusion of evil to the limited bubble of awareness that do not realize that everything is a part of the whole.

Answer 3

In order to understand this, you need to understand the nature of the god described in the Bible. And to do that, you have to think like a parent.

As parents, we have some measure of control over what our kids do. If it's raining we tell them they can't go out to play. If they play up, we ground them. If they ask, we try our best to explain things to them. And when they do well, we look for ways of rewarding them in an effort to teach them that the better they do, the better they get. In effect, we give them free will, but we also establish the parameters within which that free will can be exercised.

If we keep them in because it's raining we might tell them they can watch TV but they're not to kick a ball about in the house; they can play computer games but they're not to turn the volume up so loud tht we can't hear ourselves think.

Do we criticise a parent for establishing these parameters because they encroach on the free will of the child? And if we do, where do we draw the lines? Is it wrong to deny a child free will when we tell him not to lick the dead pigeon, put his fingers in the electric socket or play with the pot full of boiling water?

The god described in the Bible, if you take the time to study the book, is shown time and time again to demonstrate this type of parentalism. And the more you read, the more you begin to see the relationship between free will and the will of God. Problems really start when people apply their own definition of what free will is to a conceopt described quite clearly in the Bible, and begin to change the meanings.

So, for the record, free will in a Biblical sense is not, and has never been, the same as free will in the human sense. Free will in the Bible is freedom to do what we like within the parameters set by God.

The will of God also needs to be more clearly defined - once again people move the goal posts by deliberately changing the Biblical definition in to a definition of their own, and having done that, use their own definition as a stick with which to bash the Bible.

It's like me saying to you "Please don't do that" then you going off on one and shouting "How dare you tell me not to do that!" - not the same thing at all, eh?

Read the Bible, and understand it some time. You don't have to believe in God to do this - I don't. You don't have to let it change your way of life - I don't. But if you just stop taking everything out of context you'll see more clearly how it all works, and what religious people are dealing with.

The Bible teaches that God never created the universe, this world, and the humans living on it to act like automatons. This is the real miracle described in the book. He created the universe, the world and humans so that they could live whole and independant lives, hopefully within the rules he set out for them to abide by. Free will in the Biblical sense really boils down to your right to play by the rules (and reap the benefits - eternal life) or do things your own way, disobey the rules, and opt out of the benefit system. Gods will, in the Biblical sense, are the rules; guidance for people who want to go for the jackpot.

Answer 4

I don't usually answer religious questions. This one is interesting.

The main thing is that the human mind is sophisticated enough to make intelligent choices. God could have made us less than what we are. But to control everything, our every thought, every action, would make Man a lesser being than what he is. We would be meat in motion, robots with blood and no souls.

I think it's better the way it turned out.

Answer 5

God allow things to happen, he has total control. If he wanted to friend he could destroy the world.

Friend, turn your computer off, you make that choice its free will. But your underestimating the mind of God, he knows what you will do. But it would be unfair not to create sinners and give them a chance to be God's children.

Answer 6

I think you have misunderstood the concept of Christian free will..... or so it seems....... I has a person can choose to follow God , by his word, the bible or not....... that is my free will, or part of it...... I has a child of God can choose to forgive for a wrong done to me, that is part of my free will..... I as a woman, can ignore or follow the rules of the bible set forth for marriage, that also is part of my free will.... once Jesus is chosen by me, also my choice, also part of my free will, I can still make mistakes and sin and not do what I am supposed to do, part of my free will also, but I know also that I am forgiven by God... that is what Fathers do, fogive their children..... Gods will is for us to follow HIM in faith....... to trust in HIM...... to believe not only IN him but to believe HIM...... there is a difference....... God has know for ever what will happen at any given moment, yes He has, but He allows us to choose, our paths, our steps, etc...... if is Gods will, which means HIS intentention or destiny, for us all to come to him in heaven...... to be with HIM..... but we all can choose NOT to be with Him...... it is offered, but we do not have to accept........ God is NOT limited...... we are...... God holds and controls all things...... Evil can not be done with out His knowledge or allowance...... but we has his children, if we will only believe and have faith, have all the power to stop evil in its tracks........ we can not and never have had the power to worry about sending ppl anywhere....... that is NOT our call...... nor would I want the responsibility of making that call.... only God can see into a heart and or soul and know the real person....... God bless and hope you understand just a little of what I was trying to express here...........

Answer 7

In islam god created good and evil. and his will is that humans choose good over evil from their own will.

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"Verily We created Man from a drop of mingled sperm, in order to try him: So We gave him (the gifts), of Hearing and Sight. "

So we are being tested. In order to test us there has to be good and evil, and obviously we can't see god because it is a test.
No Man has EVER seen god. Seeing him amounts to cheating.

Now the everything that happens is part of the test that god allowed.

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"No kind of calamity can occur, except by the leave of Allah: and if any one believes in Allah, (Allah) guides his heart (aright): for Allah knows all things. "

This test is passed by being patient.

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"Truly man was created very impatient;"

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"Fretful when evil touches him;"

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"And ********* when good reaches him;"

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"Not so those devoted to Prayer;-"

Even godly people will be tested.

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"Do men think that they will be left alone on saying, "We believe", and that they will not be tested? "

And the test are gonna be difficult

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"Be sure we shall test you with something of fear and hunger, some loss in goods or lives or the fruits (of your toil), but give glad tidings to those who patiently persevere,

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"Who say, when afflicted with calamity: "To Allah We belong, and to Him is our return":-

So we need to be patient in such circumstances coz no matter what, we return to god. keep your eyez on the prize.


Now gods will is based on what people say and do.


Now what you do is your will and your will can never go against god's will. He allows you to indulge in sin. His will is to allow you to do as you please. hence the test.






But he only rewards those who do good and punishes those who do evil.

Answer 8

Omnipotence also means that God has the power to cede his power if he so chooses. That is, God can forgo his will if he likes, since he has all power--and it is definitely an expression of one's power to allow others to have some power (as in, personal choices, a.k.a. freewill).

Answer 9

yes. that's right. it cant be both.