The French Foreign Legion: a model for the future EU Army?

Question

Since well over 100 years (don't know the exact date, but they were already around in the 1860s) France has had its Foreign Legion where men from all nations of the world could become soldiers. This multi-cultural approach is unique and could be the model for a future EU Army. Or do we really need 16 or 25 different armies with different standards, doctrines etc?

Answer 1

The multi-cultural approach isn't as unique as you suggest - Spain has had a Foreign Legion since the 1920's.

The FFL is a mixture of French conscripts doing their National Service and "the scum from Europes sewers". It's a proud army with a deserved reputation for toughness and discipline. The FFL will never turn you over to the Police no matter what crime you have committed, and while you are in, they are your family. You are not allowed contact with the outside world in the first 6 months and you are encouraged to sever all contacts with former friends and associates. Leave is rarely permitted owing to the high desertion rate, and when you sign on, it's for 5 years at a time.
Nationalities tend to band together and stick together - it's not the multi-cultural melting pot you imagine it to be.

Hardly the "model" for a new professional European army, and lets face it, why would you want a "European" Army? I don't see "Europe" being threatened by anyone's military forces at the moment...

Answer 2

There are principles held by the Legion that I think would be very valuable to any fighting force created for a multi-national and multi-cultural organization. The motto of the French Foreign Legion is Legio Patria Nostra which is Spanish for The legion is our country. The legion was formed by French King Louis Philippe to fight in Algiers on Mar.10,1831. When formed the legion consisted of seven battalions which were separated by nationality. The experience of the Spanish campaign caused the then commanding officer (the name escapes me) to reorganize the battalions and to mix nationalities into each battalion. The loyalty of the men was not to their country of birth or primarily to France but to their Honour and Fidelity and to the Legion. Their is a common language that must be spoken and understood by all members. An EU force may not have to speak French but they must speak the same language to be effective in the field and they must be loyal to the concept of the European Union and their Military organization so as to be able to operate in their home countries without hesitation.

Answer 3

They tried something like this once. It was called the Eurocorps - it was just shy of a Brigade in strength, a Franco-German effort started up in (if I remember right) the 80s back in the area of Strausbourg. It didn't work very well.

The Legion imposes its will by rigorous, brutal discipline, a French officer corps, and imposition of the French language, norms, and culture. That is how it succeeds in turning criminals into shock troops. Multiculturalism in the American mold simply does not exist, never mind the sort of "political correctness" that would prevent the Legion from even training its troops properly. Speak out of turn, you get rocks in the mouth. Walk out of step, you get beaten down - hard. Try doing that with a "multicultural" force with a dozen different nationalities, where the command language rotates year to year along with the command. I've seen the UN at work in peacekeeping. It's not pretty.

There's nothing in the EU framework that provides for a standing military force that supercedes that of its member nations. Such an organization is not only pointless, it is dangerous; by being accountable to no single nation, it risks violating the rights of all member states and serving a role like that of the Praetorian Guard, meddling in politics. Such an organization would be too close to the center of power in Brussels by its very nature. Never mind it having to coexist with NATO headquarters in the same city; what's the role of this standing military? Peacekeeping operations abroad? Defence of Europe - against whom? The Russians? The Turks, who happen to be part of NATO?

A standing military, once created, raises more problems than solutions if a proper raison d'etre is not formulated and strictly adhered to. Witness what has happened to the American military; conceived as a strictly defensive force in its early days of colonials fighting against oppression, only to become an agent of colonialism itself before assuming an uneasy role as overseer of a fractured hegemony.

Having a multiplicity of militaries is not necessarily a bad thing; there are distinct advantages, too many to list in this answer. Consider whether there's a legitimate need for a guard dog before going out and buying a mastiff.

Answer 4

Correction :
The moto of the legion Legio Patria Nostra... which is Spanish for.
Sorry : that is Latin. (A Frenchie who would use Spanish ??? be serious)

The motto of the French Foreign Legion is Legio Patria Nostra which is LATIN for The legion is our country.

The eurocorps exists and is a kind of multi-National force. And what about the Nato ?

Whatever a real multi-national army is not for tomorrow, therefor the countries are still to much narrowminded.

Answer 5

Why would you want a Euro Army. The Europe idea is **** anyway and will be rejected. As for the French foreign legion, I have friends in the Royal Marines and they have a few ex legionaries, who state that the Legion is not as good as you think and that the British paras and British Marines are far superior troops. They also said that U.S Marines were really crap too. They should know, they crossed trained with them. (all the gear no idea).

Answer 6

Speaking as a Brit the idea of a European army fills me with dread.

Europe cannot even agree on the correct shape for a banana never mind how to fight a war or protect the peace.

The Foreign Legion (both the french one and the spanish one) are formidable special forces units but endure hardship and brutality in their training that the average central European soldier (who is often a conscript) would not cope with. They cope with it because they tend to be very nasty pieces of work who are running away from something else.

Standardise on logistics like rifle ammunition etc by all means but please please please do not give the decision on when to surrender to the continentals....

Answer 7

Sure, every Legionnaire I've ever worked with was a flaming drunkard... When they were sober they were pretty good, I'm sure a lush could do better than most of the European armies...

Answer 8

I hope not. Whilst I doubt how far fighting solved anything anyway, I think we ought to give loyalty to our own country and the larger alliances of which it is part, not sell our allegiance for money.

Answer 9

It's now called the UN Peacekeepers.

Answer 10

yeah sure thing bob,murerers rapists buggerers of boys sadists theives and future mercenaries.