Who designed the designer?

Question

And who designed the designer that designed the designer etc...this might go on into infinity.

Reply to salient2:
thank you so much, I couldn't have put it better myself...you've really cleared this up for me.

Answer 1

It is special pleading to require that all things require a designer except the designer. If everything has a designer, then your designer has a designer and that designer has a designer. You can see the problem. Now If you say everything has a designer but that the designer does not need a designer, then your designer is not part of everything. If your designer is not part of everything then it doesn't exist.

It can be proven in mathematics that in order to design something a closed designing system must be at least as complicated (Kolmogorov Complexity) as what it is designing. If the argument complex beings require a designer had any validity then the designer would need a greater designer, and that designer would need an even greater designer etc.

It is funny creationists often make the argument that a bacteria is too complex to not be designed and then claim their infinitely more complex god just is and doesn't need to be designed cause it just is. Can we say the word "Hypocracy"? How about the words "Intellectual Dishonesty".

However we know from mathematics that something can appear to be designed without really being so. Just look at a fractal. The Mathematician Steven Cook proved a very very simple formula like Wolfram's rule 110 for example generates more apparent local complexity than is contained in the entire solar system.

We understand from mathematics how apparently complex systems come about and it is always due to selection effects. You take a simple but diverse set and select a complex subset from it. In order to do that you need a selecting agent. In the case of our universe we have a selecting agent. That selecting agent is our own existence.

The explaination is that reality is incredibly vast and diverse. Only in small apparently complex portions of that reality can beings such as ourselves evolve. It is not a coincidence, nor is it by chance we find ourselves in such a region. Instead it is a necessity.

It is a lot like the myopic snowflake who finds himself in a snowstorm and concludes he was designed by a snow pixie. His argument is that the world is the perfect temperature for snow to form. When in reality the world is vast and only in small portions of it can snowflakes form.

Or you can think of us as like a lottery winner who concludes there must be a cosmic cheater who rigged the lottery, when in fact there were simply millions of people buying lottery tickets and someone was bound to win.

Now that we have shown that a seemingly complex system does not need to be designed as long as it is part of a vast, diverse whole. How does that vast diverse whole come about. We obviously are getting into extremely difficult ideas here but several physicists are arguing that reality is based upon and indeed is, mathematics. By that they mean that reality consists of the class of necessarily true statements one can make about logical systems.

One physicist has even argued that the class of necessarily true statements one can make about logical systems is isomorphic ( mathematically identical ) to string theory. Basically arguing that nature is mathematically necessary. The reason it does not feel necessary is that we see so little of it, and that we see it from within it rather than seeing it as it really is.

So In conclusion there does not need to be a god. All that is necessary is a vast diversity. And that diversity might be simply logical necessity. Furthermore the requirement complex entities need designers is false and leads to infinite regression, and ultimately hypocracy and intellectual dishonesty.

Answer 2

Therein lies the problem with intelligent design. It's far too broad to make any real sense.

If God was the designer, then it makes sense. The spiritual dimension of existance is not bound to time. Therefore, there is no "before" in relation to God. Time began with creation, and will end with the destruction of said creation. God however, will continue to exist.

That's why God identified himself as "I Am" in Exodus.

Answer 3

The designer did, of course.

Answer 4

The Designer's time is infinite and He exists outside of us, nature and the universe. For Him, the definition of time does not exist. There is only one Designer and He has always existed and always will. Our thinking is finite and therefore it is a difficult concept for us.

Answer 5

the very first designer designed his name and decided to call him her self a designer

Answer 6

God was the beginning. There is no designer for the designer. Gos was, and always is. God is the beginning.

Answer 7

The disignee

Answer 8

An engineer.

Answer 9

this has been asked a few minutes ago. NOONE He was always there. Hes an eternal being who made all the galaxies...butterflies birds horses everything anc people too and we have souls!!

Answer 10

Nobody who can design somebody that always existed.. Time is only found in our universe therefore where time doesn't exist, things are eternal..

If you want to learn read this
http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/audio/newevidence.htm
http://www.godsci.org/gs/chri/testimony/seek.html
http://www.godsci.org/gs/new/figment.html