Old Testament Laws???????

Question

I am a dedicated pacifist and a Christian, I believe Christ was/is a pacifist. There is one member specifically I am hoping will respond here and hopefully shed some light, but I forgot his user name so I can't go ask him lol. Anyway the question is, since Jesus taught the way of peace, and even in the Old Testament or Torah itself there are teachings of peace, such as in proverbs, my favorite OT book by the way. Why are there so many laws that call people to be put to death? Please no joke answers speaking badly of my faith or saying 'just because' thank you.

Answer 1

I know a lot of people will balk and argue at this response along with other and varying answers. Thats OK, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

The old books were written as far back as about 1500 years BEFORE the time of Christ. Writing styles and literary styles varied greatly and interpretation are also as varied. A great deal of what was written in those old books require a proper and thorough interpretation and quite often cannot be read and interpreted literally, although the essential Biblical "Truth" the passage or book is conveying is "Truth". Remember too, that Paul has told us our battles are not of flesh and blood but of (the spirit). We are in Spiritual warfare that is far deadlier than any real war. Death is also spiritual, not just physical. And Spiritual death is eternal separation from Heaven and God.

Jesus even used parables in the New Testament to make some of His points. He didn't lie, just used a fictional account to teach a point. A lot of these Old Testament stories would fall into the same catagory.

God is always the same..always was, will be, etc...never changing. God was not an angry mean God in the Old Testament and then changed to a nice kind loving God later in the New. It requires proper understanding of interpretation.

To address the issue of interpreting Biblical scripture and prophecy I have taken the liberty to add below a response I posted earlier just on that subject alone.
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The Catholic Church (if this is leaning toward a Catholic attack) actually does encourage Bible reading and scripture study. In the Mass (Daily and Sunday...Catholic Mass is held everyday, not just once or twice a week) there are the "Readings"...bible verses from the Old Testament, New Testament, and the Gospel and they all relate in the particular Mass.

Scripture is so important to Catholics that a system is in place that inside the Mass the entire Bible is read through in a 3 year cycle. You cannot say that about any Protestant church.

The Catholic Church does not tell its members what to believe as it imperically interprets the Bible, but does give instruction in how to read it, in that nothing should be taken piecemeal, but in its entire proper context. In other words, don't just read, "Don't judge lest ye be judged"...but the entire book, or at least chapter to get the full and proper context of that one statement.

The Catholic Church does recognize the Holy Bible and Sacred Tradition both as teaching authority for the Church. Most Protestant denominations have excluded a church authority and now settle for the Bible Alone, or "Sola Scriptura", which is why there are now between 40,000 and 50,000 different Protestant Christian denominations. When they disagree, they just split off and start a new church. There is mass confusion and little unity among all these groups and the primary reason is personal interpretation of Holy scripture.

The Holy Bible itself supports the belief in an Oral Tradition and central Apostolic Church teaching authority. Remember, there was NO New Testament or Gospel scriptures in the 1st Century...those are the people that wrote it...later. All of Jesus' teachings were oral, as well as the Apostles until they decided they should write it down.

In 2 Thess 2:15 it says to hold fast to the traditions (teachings) we have given you, whether ORALLY or by Letter. A clear distinction showing teaching was done orally and by written letter or scripture. And in 2 Peter 3:15-16 we see, "And concider the patience of our Lord as salvation, as our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, also wrote to you, speaking of these things as he does in all his letters. IN THEM ARE SOME THINGS HARD TO UNDERSTAND THAT THE IGNORANT AND UNSTABLE DISTORT TO THEIR OWN DESTRUCTION, JUST AS THEY DO THE OTHER SCRIPTURES. In 2 Peter 1:20 we also see Peter teaching simply that prophecy of scripture is not for private interpretation...we need the leadership of Apostolic authority to help us properly interpret scripture.

Yes, inside Holy Bible scripture it tells us we need a valid Apostolic Church leadership to help us with scripture. Thus the Catholic Church has the Magesterium....the teaching authority of the Church to work along side with the authority of the scriptures.

I hope this has helped you in some way, as well as someone else who is truly seeking.

God Bless

Answer 2

tough question, and the premise is that god is a pacifist. although God and Jesus would both prefer that we live in peace, the truth is that we all have a free will, and not every body wants peace, just like not every body wants to serve God, whether it be through Christianity, buddhism, Islam, or any of the gods that peoples worship.
The God of the old Testament had several reason for telling the Hebrew people to put others to death, one was to teach obedience, and the other was to keep them from being led into Idolatry. but the good news is that we have a new covenant with God bought by the blood of Jesus.

Answer 3

What you call the OT, I call the Holy Scriptures and the Torah is just the first 5 books of this. I guess I do not consider Christians to be pacifists. Today, Pat Robertson has called for assassination of Chavez, among some of his other famous statements on getting rid of world leaders.. And, the Crusades and the Inquisition were 2 of the bloodiest endeavors of the Christian faith. Pope Urban II called for a Crusade telling the people to go and kill as many non-believers as possible to assure they got into heaven. Doesn't that sound like a few fanatical ravings we hear today-----------and, I did say a few.

Answer 4

A very good question. I have a couple theories. The first is that these laws were given at a time before God 'wrote his law on our hearts.' Without some innate understanding of God's law, there needed to be something to convince them to follow it anyway. Second, I think these laws were largely a reflection of the people and the times. Remember when Jesus tells the people that because they were obstinate Moses gave them laws concerning divorce, but in truth no one should divorce? That seems to imply that the laws aren't always completely in line with what God ideally wants. Choosing such a strict legal/religious code would 1) fit the violence of the times, and 2) be an effective way of keeping the Isrealite people united - if the penalty for straying is death, not so many people are going to be tempted away by foreign cultures. The OT laws weren't made void by Jesus' death ('I have come not to abolish the law'), but he showed us how to interpret them as God wants. 'Love the Lord your God with all your mind, soul, and strength,' 'love your neighbor as yourself,' 'let he who is without sin throw the first stone.'

Answer 5

The old testament also says that there's a time for war and a time for peace..yes? Even Jesus warned his Disciples that they should sell their cloaks and buy a sword.
You forgot to mention that the Quran talk about peace.
It's the same people who study the holy books that make laws of execution and hangings. Fidel Castro was educated in a Jesuit's college. Bush is a born again Christian and the leader of Iraq is very well schooled in Islam.
You said no jokes but I can't help laughing aloud at the foolish unreligious things that religious leaders do.

Answer 6

There are a great deal less human laws that call for putting someone to death than in the Bible actually. We dont put adulterers and homosexuals and witches to death but the Law said to do so. I believe in peace and mercy... but should we show mercy to someone who doesnt care? Only certain states have the death penalty and these people did exactly what was punishable by death, it isn't like they didnt know, they just didnt care if they died for it or, thought they'd get away with it. Now I live in a death penalty state and if I committed the crimes that bring on a death sentence, then hell yeah!! Kill me... dont let me get away with it, dont sit me in a cushy jail cell for the rest of my life where I have no more responsabilities, get 3 square meals a day plus snacks and free college courses and medical care and make hard working people pay to keep me alive. Make prisons more of a punishment and then maybe I will oppose the death penalty.

Note: Arent you glad people werent standing around opposing the death penalty in Jesus' days? We'd be in bad shape if the death penalty had been outlawed then huh?

Answer 7

The old laws are hard to wrap your head around aren't they? I think if people had been living the way they were being called to, acting like God intended, the put-to-death laws wouldn't have been necessary.

I read once that there was never a Jewish record of anyone ever stoning an unruly child. It was kind of a reference parents could use to keep teens in line. I'm not sure I agree.

I'm just thankful Jesus came along. I'd hate to have to slaughter goats to make up for my sins. I think this is one of those things we'll always have to wrestle with. There was a ton of war in the Old Testament too.

I think God was really serious about having a pure people to represent Him. That's why the laws were so strict.

Proverbs is a way cool book. I used to think it was better than Psalms until I picked up on the prophecies in Psalms.

Answer 8

First of all I don't think Christ was a pacifist. There are places in the bible that say it is okay to have a just war. Remember the commandment is not " thou shalt not kill ,but thou shalt not murder." God backed a lot of wars in the bible. I will have to side with you on putting people to death for crimes, I am not so sure God approves of this. On the other hand there are some people so evil, that I myself think they need to be exterminated. You keep the faith for the meek will inherit the earth. I don't mean meek as a bad term. Live long and prosper.

Answer 9

People are put to death in the OT because they did not adhere to the strict rules of GOD. They perverted themselves and nature with their own love for themselves. If one truly loves GOD and believes HE is the Truth and the ONLY truth then how can that person do anything other than follow what he set down as your creator? Since they OT people did not have the intervention of the mercy of Jesus to interceed on their behalf and remove their sin they had to be put to death . GOD said he would destroy the body to protect the spirit and the bible specifically says GOD cannot abide sin. If HE had then Jesus would not have had need to cry out Father, why have you forsaken me? when he gave up his spirit. At that exact moment Jesus had taken on his own flesh the sin of all for the sole purpose of reddeming them and giving them a way to enter into the kingdom. Take some time reading over the depiction and retelling of the crucifixion and just be awed by how much Jesus really did for us. HE decides everything...therefore HE chose the crucifixion and every part of the Passion that goes along with it. If you look at it from that aspect you can only stand in awe. I wouldn't choose to do that for anyone single person much less the world. I would accept it if it were required of me to save my children perhaps, but not to choose every slap and mocking word. Never mind the thorns and nails.

Answer 10

Actually, the Jewish religious leaders distorted the laws of God, probably to keep their perceived power. They held the laws over the people's heads and limited them so badly that God had to send his only begotten Son down to earth to dwell among the people and teach them the meaning and Spirit of the law. When Christ came and started teaching the truth of the Holy Spirit, the religious officials hated and scorned him. He did such horrible things as drink in public, associate with whores, visit with the sickly, help the weak, associate with tax collectors, and break their perceived law of the Sabbath.

Why did he do this? To help people. He took the Word to those who would listen rather than those who would condemn others. Jesus knew the TRUE hearts of the people. Jesus was compassionate, loving, and kind... but was He perfect? This may get me alot of flak, but remember when He overturned the tables of the moneychangers? Even Jesus could be pushed too far and took action. Some churches make up names for this, calling it Holy this or that, but face it... Jesus just lost His temper because He saw what they were doing to the people at His Father's house. Jesus came into the world not to condemn us, but to free us from condemnation. It's the self righteous who use the laws of God to condemn people.

I heard people condemning the new Superman movie because Superman, a representation of the Son of God, wasn't "perfect" in their opinion. I know from experience that if Superman had been living in this day and age, it's very LIKELY that he would fall in love with a woman and she would cheat on him. Good women are as few and far between as hard core women's libbers say that good men are. Luckilly, I finally found a good woman. It took me 50 years and 3 cheating wives, but I finally found one.

That's how I see it, and I'm C.R. Jennings

Cal-el & Swissy