"he who takes the highest and most self-respecting view of his own welfare which it is in his power to conceive, and adheres to it in spite of conventionality, is a christian whether he knows it and calls himself one, or whether he does not."
i don't believe in god, but i was raised a roman catholic and i find this quote interesting. that is a good description of me, and i have always found that having those traits is a big part of why i am not a believer.
i especially find the words "his own welfare" interesting. any thoughts?
PS - please don't try to convert me, this is about the quote, not my soul.
2006-07-26 18:50:54 · 22 answers · asked by gwenwifar 4 in Society & Culture ➔ Religion & Spirituality
i forgot to say this is from "the way of all flesh" by samuel butler
2006-07-26 19:06:36 · update #1
Interesting quote...I don't really know why the author would have said "his own welfare" rather than the welfare of others. I also don't really see how self-respect would make someone a christian, since being christian would mean believing Jesus was christ. Depending on the context of the quote, it almost seems anti-christian...relating to the way a lot of (not all) christians seem to be more concerned about themselves than others.
2006-07-26 18:58:42 · answer #1 · answered by laetusatheos 6 · 0⤊ 1⤋
Whoever said this quote does not know what a Christian is. A Christian literally means a "follower of Christ." I don't know what else to tell you besides God is real. No I'm not preaching to you, but this quote seems to be based in the assumption that Christianity is a religion that has no roots in human logic, but rather in notion it was created by the "best formula we could think of" to explain our existence.
Is conventionality based on everything the world sees or by what God sees? By the worlds eyes, a lot of the things Christians do are not conventional at all. Things such as selflessness and looking out for the needs of others rather than our own. In this world, typically the most successful (again, by the world's standards) people are the ones who think "me me me." It does not make sense to people to give to others unless it would somehow benefit you.
As a Christian, I am not claiming to be this way already, but it is what I strive for- selflessness, helping others find truth, gaining self-control against my sinful nature, and other Christ-like qualities. I say this because many people tend to throw the self-righteousness darts after explaining what it means to be a follower of Christ.
As for the quote, it means nothing because it is based on a false assumption(which I mentioned above).
EDIT: I have trouble decifering whether this guy is a critic of Christians or just a very confused guy that thinks he is a Christian. The answer I gave was for the former...if it is the latter, then he is not a Christian. Either way, the quote holds no ground against a reasonably intelligent human being.
2006-07-26 19:09:24 · answer #2 · answered by stephenguise 3 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Highest and most self respecting view? This pretty much sums up humanism. This was the original sin of satan as well; He wanted to be God. When all you have is faith in yourself then you had better figure out what your going to do about the whole death issue. Can you personally control the fate of your own soul? Do you believe in God? If so what does He have to do with you?
Self-respect is not bad in and of itself but is certainly not all there is.
2006-07-26 18:59:07 · answer #3 · answered by foxray43 4 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Good Day!
The fear of the LORD is the beginning of Wisdom!
I do believe that you have your quotations from within! The true essence of Christianity is not merely involvement or membership in any religious affiliation but it is solely the HEART and SOUL issue. Many people consider themselves as Christians and some of them profess that they are in the right religion but if we will examine our lives, we absolutely fall in the qualifications of being a true Christians.
What do the words Christianity and Christian mean?
Some authors said that they have a very large distinction!
A particular person may be called a christian but will eventually fall in the qualifications in the true essence of Christianity!
What does Christian mean?
It means the person whose the root-word is Christ!
Christ-centered person!
Cannot leave without Christ!
Follower of Christ Jesus in Speech,mind and deeds!
Christians are not the member of Roman Catholic, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, SDA, Baptist, Pentecostal, Iglesia ni Manalo or any other but they are the followers of Christ Jesus!
If we will examine the scripture, the attitude of Christ is very peculiar and awesome even He is God he leave his Glory and became a servant to fulfill the task being given to Him.
He washed the feet of the disciples! the principle of servant-hood.
Has not committed sin, no deceit found in His lips.
Jesus Loves Mankind.
That is the true essence of Christianity!
With regard to your idea of non-existence of God,
ha ha ha you are just deceiving yourself!
Even Voltaire a noted atheist PRAY to GOD in a thunderstorm.
Ingersoll, when charge with being an atheist, indignantly refuted the charge, saying "I am not an atheist; I do not say that there is no GOD." I am an agnostic; I do not know that there is GOD"
A new convert to atheism was ounce heard to say to say a coterie of unbelievers; " I have gotten rid of the idea of Supreme Being, and I thank GOD for it"
ha ha ha ha ha
My argument are:
Even you deny to yourself the existence of GOD the fact will always proved that deep inside in your being there is a part that says there is GOD!
There are no society, tribe or community in the world that there is no belief in the Supreme Being(s) who is more powerful and need for obeisance and worship, the One who created them.
No theory of an "ETERNAL SERIES" can account for this created universe. No matter how long a chain you may have, you must have a staple somewhere from which it depends. An endless perpendicular chain is IMPOSSIBILITY.
"Every house is built by some man"
so this world in which we live was built by a designing mind of infinite power and wisdom.
If you will still enforce atheism,
THE HOLY GOD and SUPREME BEING who sits in the heavens would eventually laugh at such ABSURD ATHEISM!
GOD BLESS YOU!
2006-07-26 21:41:22 · answer #4 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
It is false ---That quote is from Samuel Butler---- The Way of All Flesh---
( John 14:Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.)
Only the Holy Spirit can do that ---- (convict you of sin and the need to repent and accept Christ as Savior) ----
these are just mere words if the heart is cold and rebellious
2006-07-26 19:12:07 · answer #5 · answered by jaimestar64cross 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
I am an atheist. I disagree with the quote. I believe being a Christian requires more than embracing one or two abstract attitudes. I don't see how someone could disbelieve that Jesus Christ was the son of God and still be a Christian
2006-07-26 18:58:55 · answer #6 · answered by milo.3600 2 · 0⤊ 0⤋
I think it's a circuitous quote. Since the quote seems to suggest that an individual who puts his own view of what is self-respecting as well as what he determines to be his own best welfare above all, that would seem pretty self-centered and unwilling to listen to criticism. What is the plumb line? Just one's own opinion? Most people, in their own estimation, are good. Where is the humanity in this view of self-aggrandizement?
2006-07-26 18:58:36 · answer #7 · answered by Debra G 1 · 0⤊ 0⤋
He who takes the highest and most self- respecting view of his own welfare which it is in his power to conceive, and adheres to it in spite of conventionality, is a Christian whether he knows it and calls himself one, or whether he does not. A rose is not the less a rose because it does not know its own name.
What if circumstances had made his duty more easy for him than it would be to most men? That was his luck, as much as it is other people's luck to have other duties made easy for them by accident of birth. Surely if people are born rich or handsome they have a right to their good fortune. Some I know, will say that one man has no right to be born with a better constitution than another; others again will say that luck is the only righteous object of human veneration. Both, I daresay, can make out a very good case, but whichever may be right surely Ernest had as much right to the good luck of finding a duty made easier as he had had to the bad fortune of falling into the scrape which had got him into prison. A man is not to be sneered at for having a trump card in his hand; he is only to be sneered at if he plays his trump card badly.
Indeed, I question whether it is ever much harder for anyone to give up father and mother for Christ's sake than it was for Ernest. The relations between the parties will have almost always been severely strained before it comes to this. I doubt whether anyone was ever yet required to give up those to whom he was tenderly attached for a mere matter of conscience: he will have ceased to be tenderly attached to them long before he is called upon to break with them; for differences of opinion concerning any matter of vital importance spring from differences of constitution, and these will already have led to so much other disagreement that the "giving up" when it comes, is like giving up an aching but very loose and hollow tooth. It is the loss of those whom we are not required to give up for Christ's sake which is really painful to us. Then there is a wrench in earnest. Happily, no matter how light the task that is demanded from us, it is enough if we do it; we reap our reward, much as though it were a Herculean labour.
2006-07-26 18:57:17 · answer #8 · answered by Bolan 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
WRONG
WRONG
WRONG
Being a Christian means being a Christ-like figure
Being a Christian is being connected with God
Being a Christian is following the Bible AND having a relationshp with God
You cant have a relationship without God without following the Bible and you cant be called a Christian without following the bible
2006-07-26 18:56:50 · answer #9 · answered by 0110010100 5 · 0⤊ 0⤋
the only thing that would harm this quote for any religion is the insertion of the word "christian" which really means followers of CHRIST. like you, i'm a roman catholic too...
it's a powerful quote. it only points to the fact that whoever understands, perceives and lives within the reason of life would attain wisdom... however it still points that one would be a follower of Christ in this manner... if he attains wisdom... which would be attacked by other religions........
good luck, though...
2006-07-26 18:59:35 · answer #10 · answered by VeRDuGo 5 · 0⤊ 0⤋