How could abortion be murder if god refers to an unborn baby as a seed, and not a person?

Question

If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges [determine] stripe. -Exodus 21

Here god refers to "men" causing a woman to lose her unborn child. The unborn child being referred to not as a child, or a human being, but as "her fruit", merely a seed.

God clearly tells us "man" is the tree (or in some instances the branch), if this passage were to indicate the unborn baby was indeed human it would have been referred to as such.

Example: PSA 1:3 He is like a tree planted by streams of water, which yields its fruit in season and whose leaf does not wither.

God only left to the judgement of humans the punishment for minor, or "venial" sins. The fact that god leaves the punishment here to the judges means this is not a grave crime, and surely means that no life has been taken and no commandment has been violated.

For what its worth, as a response to one answer: My basic knowledge of biology tells me that is incorrect, scientifically one of the conditions for a living organism is the ability to maintain itself independently of an environment.

Lets go further and add lines 22-25,

"But if injury ensues, you shall give life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe. "

Note that this is conditional, not all cases where men cause a woman to lose her fruit involve injury that would constitute a mortal sin. "Life for life" refers to the woman being killed, "tooth for tooth..." refers to the woman being raped or beaten

Defiant one I have to say I'm disappointed, you had the best answer. You disagreed, but did happened to point out the 2 parts I knew I should have addressed but couldn't as I had to choose my 1000 characters wisely.

Then you decided to change your rational response to a question of interpretation about a specific bible passage into a character assault complete with comparisons to, amongst others, Nazis, Chinese dictators, and satan. Complete with such open minded assumptions as "you people sure like to kill a lot", based entirely on the way I'm interpreting a bible passage.

Answer 1

There are 26 times the Bible refers to a woman "with child", not "with seed", "with tree" or "with branch" . Seed refers to lineage, not to pregnancy. Branch is a metaphor you're trying hard to misunderstand.

You're very mixed up because you want to be. If you were to study the Bible and allow it to say what it intends to say (inductive study) instead of trying to prove what you want it to say by perverting it's intended meaning, you would understand, but you don't want to.

Here's your life verse: 2 Peter 3:5-7
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. KJV

Hey ! ! ! That's YOU ! ! ! !

Imagine that, YOU'RE IN THE BIBLE ! ! ! !

Answer 2

Ok but if the child begins as a seed in the eyes of god .....Is it not planted in the chosen woman for a reason.

The bible also refers to careless sex as a sin and says that sex is to be used to reproduce so therefore if you are gonna get all biblical then think about it.

You put yourself out there for the act of sex you need to as all our parents have said take the consequences for your actions.

This is coming from someone who lost a baby at a young age and was told I may not have children two years later I became pregnant again and feel blessed that God saw that I was unready at the time of my first miscarriage and gave me my little angel.

We have no right to take life away from someone or in this case something (the seed) they are all living and growing parts of the universe

Answer 3

if you imagine that they are fetuses only and under no circumstances children- a heart is thrashing- and what's one component that shows existence- a beating heart. - at 3 weeks after idea. 4,000 children an afternoon are aborted in united states on my own- and this isn't only documents on a Christian information superhighway web site- you'll stumble on that everywhere- and did you comprehend that below 2% of abortions done are in rape and for the health of the mummy? till they finally stop it - think about an abortion up till the day that your infant changed into further- so only days before the child may be as a results of be born- you ought to abort- so if you're preserving it is not a infant- even as DOES IT develop right into a infant. This challenge does get me going, for some causes- one as a results of the indisputable fact that is legalized homicide, and also i'd were aborted- my mom gave me existence and positioned me for adoption- and my 2 children are followed- if our moms had chosen abortion for us- we may were between the 50,000,000 children that were no longer given a probability to stay. AMEN- keep speaking the reality, possibly faster or later people will see the mild. INFINITY- so that is extra proper to take the existence of a teenager, then stumble on a thanks to take care of it- both your self or through adoption? no longer a infant till that is BORN? you've were given to be kidding????

Answer 4

Just b/c the translation says, "fruit" does not mean "fruit" is not a precious human baby. It does not mean it was a term used loosely having no important meaning. God also tells Adam and Eve to "be fruitful"...have many children. Humans do not have the priviledge to create life. GOD creates life and no man has the right to stop that life from entering this world...plain & simple.

Answer 5

First of all, "ABORTION" is the expulsion of an embryo or a fetus that is not normally able to live outside the womb. Spontaneous abortion or miscarriage may result from human imperfection or from an accident. Deliberately induced abortion simply to avoid the birth of an unwanted child is the willful taking of human life.

How should the Source of human life affect our view of this matter?

Acts 17:28: “By him [God] we have life and move and exist.”

Ps. 36:9: “With you [Jehovah God] is the source of life.”

Rom. 14:12: “Each of us will render an account for himself to God.”

Does Jehovah view the life of a child as precious even during the very early stages of development after conception?
Ps. 139:13-16: “You [Jehovah] kept me screened off in the belly of my mother. . . . Your eyes saw even the embryo of me, and in your book all its parts were down in writing.”

Has God ever stated that a person would be called to account for injury to an unborn child?
Ex. 21:22, 23: “In case men should struggle with each other and they really hurt a pregnant woman and her children do come out but no fatal accident occurs, he is to have damages imposed upon him without fail according to what the owner of the woman may lay upon him; and he must give it through the justices. But if a fatal accident should occur, then you must give soul for soul.”
(Some translations make it appear that in this law to Israel the crucial matter was what happened to the mother, not to the fetus. The original Hebrew text, however, refers to a fatal accident to either mother or child.)

How serious is the willful taking of a human life for a reason not authorized by God?
Gen. 9:6: “Anyone shedding man’s blood, by man will his own blood be shed, for in God’s image he made man.”
1 John 3:15: “No manslayer has everlasting life remaining in him.”

Ex. 20:13: “You must not murder.”

Does a doctor’s opinion that allowing a pregnancy to go full term would be harmful to the health of the mother justify an abortion?

Medical opinions are sometimes wrong. Would it be right to kill a fellow human because that one might harm his fellowman? If at the time of childbirth a choice must be made between the life of the mother and that of the child, it is up to the individuals concerned to make that choice. However, advances in medical procedures in many lands have made this situation very rare.
Many mothers have been abandoned by the men who fathered their children. But in a home where both husband and wife live by Bible standards, the husband will really love his wife and children and loyally stay with them and provide for them. (1 Tim. 5:8; Eph. 5:28-31)
if we personally are to receive that kind of love and respect, we also have to apply Bible standards in our attitude toward the members of our family. How does the Bible say that we should view the children that we produce? (Ps. 127:3; contrast Isaiah 49:15.)

Answer 6

Abortion is not murder. If it were, it would be illegal. People would be sentenced to life in prison and get the death penalty for having an abortion.

Abortion is wrong in some cases, but overrall, it's the woman's body and the woman's choice. Anyone who doesn't like it? Tough. That's the way it is; accept it and shut up.

Answer 7

Nice try. You intentionally left the next verse out so as to deceive the people who read your 'question'. Let's see what Exodus 21 verses 22 AND 23 state, "If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give LIFE FOR LIFE."

Mischief referring to the ‘fruit’ dying or being damaged.

Oh, and in case you missed it (which I doubt), the first part of that verse says, "and hurt a woman with CHILD".

You probably think that something does not qualify as 'life' if it cannot maintain itself independently outside of its environment. Let’s see you live independently of your environment. We’ll take away the clothes someone made for you, take away the food that is grown for you, take away the warm shelter that someone made for you. In fact, let’s just drop you in northern Alaska, and see how long you ‘live’.

Or how about that baby in the womb? After it comes out of the womb, let’s see how long it lives independent of its environment. Just leave it outside on its own for a few days. I suppose it doesn’t qualify as life either, by your standards, so now we can kill them outside of the womb.

In China, where many of the atheists there think as you do, they are only allowed to have one child, and everyone wants a boy to provide for them in old age. If a girl is born, many Chinese leave the baby outside on its own to die, so they can try again. Yes, these are the same atheist Chinese who murdered over 80 million of their own people after the wonderful atheist revolution.

People like you sure do like to kill an awful lot. I wonder why that is. I don’t know … could it be ……. Satan …..?!?!?!

You are probably one of those people that think abortion is okay simply because it is legal. Did you know that in Germany in the 1940's it was legal to kill Jews? The Government made it so. Do you do whatever the government says is okay? Do you agree with the current US government? Can they give you the green light to sin?

All around the world today, killing and persecuting people who the current 'governments' do not like, it is legal to do so. This is just proof that our nation is slowly following the Godless nations of the world in making sin legal so as to continue in it.

In Matthew 24, Jesus states, “But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.”

And what was it like in the days of Noah? Here's a little cut from Genesis chapter 6, “And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually … The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth. And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.”

Answer 8

Tell 'ya what...when you are having this discussion with the God you don't believe in, and He is telling you that the child that you don't think is really a child when you murdered him/her belonged to Him...try twisting His Word, which, of course, you don't believe. I'm sure it will help your case.
When that happens, (and I'm sure you don't think it will), I'll bet you'll remember this day.

I'd say "tell me how it turns out"...but I don't think I'll be seeing you once it's all over.

Answer 9

Who cares what's in the bible? Basic biology will teach you that upon fertilization, a new life has been created.

Answer 10

The child being the seed is just speaking metaphorically.