Could you christians please explain this contradiction?

Question

You say that everyone has free will.
You also say that god created everything and knows everything.

If god know exactly what is going to happen to everyone, everywhere at all times, then how can you have free will?

In order to have free will, god would have to be wrong sometimes. Anything else wouldn't be free will, it would be an illusion.

nersez -"ur an idiot ask a pasture" Why would I ask a field for grazing animals for the answer to this question? Who's the idiot?

Jae- No, first you would be making an educated guess. You would not KNOW whether or not the kids would eat them. They might not eat them. You would still only be guessing. Also if GOD knows EVERYTHING then he would know absoultely whether or not the kids would eat them. In order for him to know absolutely, then the kids have NO free will.

I can't believe how many of you use the 'the junkie will get high if you give him money' argument to defend your position. Just because you gave a junkie money doesn't guarentee he will get high. He might decide that day to quit. You don't know. You could be wrong.

Making a guess is not the same as omniscience. It isn't even close. The powers that are attributated to god are that he is all knowing, all powerful, and all creating. Therefore he would be responsible for everything. EVERYTHING. If he is responsible for creating everything and knowing exactly how it is going to turn out, then there is no guessing. He would just know it all and how it would turn out. Therefore, NO FREE WILL.

Answer 1

God knowing what choice YOU will make does not change the fact that it is YOUR choice. your logic is flawed. their is no contradiction.

Answer 2

I've heard of this argument all too often. Essentially, you state:

God is omniscient.
God knows that you will initiate event X.
You cannot initiate event Y at the time event X to occur.
If so, God would be wrong.
God cannot be wrong.
Therefore, you must initiate event X.
Therefore, you have no free will.

This is a fallacious argument in determining the conclusion. I'll give an example to show how so (excuse the sexist stereotypes):

Assume that the world's greatest psychologist devises a test to predict human behavior. Since this psychologist is not perfect, his ability to predict is not perfect. If we were to rate his prediction ability, it would rate about 95/100. Now, he approaches a female target subject. He offers the subject either the choice to receiving either a $1000 dollars worth of tools or a $1000 dollars worth of jewerly. The psychologist predicts that the woman will take the jewerly. And lo! and behold, so she does.

What happened here? The woman clearly made a choice out of free will and chose the jewelry. And yet, the psychologist knew what she would pick. However, he did not coerce the woman. In this same manner, as the psychologist has a prediction ability of 95/100, God has a perfect prediction ability. In other words, God is omniscient. As it can be seen, free will and omniscience is not contradictory.

However of course, some may argue that we don't have free will since we are shaped by our environment (ergo, a sociocultural argument) but that's another debate...

AND COULD PEOPLE PLEASE STOP WITH THE UNNECESSARY AND IRRELEVANT AND OVERLY LONG COPY AND PASTE JOBS? Geez, if you really want to distract our attention from the ACTUAL question, just give the link ONLY.

Answer 3

No, not really, for example:
Let's say you give a coke fiend $50, we all know what he's doing next, right? It's obvious because we have all learned through some form or another how a fiend reacts when given money, be it friends, TV, experience, etc. Does that take away from his free will?
No it is just a deep understanding of behavior and cause and effect. It is something anyone could do given enough information on a smaller scale. Anyway, I'm totally with you by the way, I don't believe in God per se, and I stand on the same side as you when it comes to free will, just thought I'd play Devils Advocate.

Answer 4

michaelscar is right.

freewill and omniscience do not conflict.

it is freewill and omnipotence that conflict.

(think about it. if you tape a football game and rewatch it a thousand times, then eventually you will know every single play. but that doesn't mean that you are CONTROLLING the plays. you could then apply this logic to everything. like,,, if you were some how able to tape everything in the universe and memorize it, then you would be omniscient. but that wouldn't mean that you caused those things to happen.

i personally don't believe in god or in freewill. (more precisely, i believe that freewill is an illusion. ask if you are curious, and i'll elaborate.)

i'm not trying to defeat your argument here. i'm just trying to refine it. you should ask the question of how god can CONTROL eveything and yet still have there be freewill. THAT is the contradiction.

(also,, so you know,,, it is also a contradiction to say that god is all-loving and all-powerful, and yet still allows people to go to hell, regardless of what reasons he's letting them go to hell for. once again, if you are curious, then just ask how, and i will gladly answer.)

aside from that, keep fighting the good fight, soldier.

Answer 5

Quoting another answerer for emphasis:

"I'm a Christian, and I think the concept of free will simply demeans the Glory of God. Free will is an illusion for our happiness. We don't REALLY have free will."

I think this answer nails it. Your question assumes that it is a central Christian tenet that people have free will and that God is omnipotent. Not all Christians believe this.

But…you raise a valid question for those who *do* believe in free will and omnipotence. I am not a Christian, so I won't answer that, since I don't believe in that anyway. I look forward to an intelligent answer, though. I hope it's forthcoming.

As an aside, I have to wonder why some people consider free will a good thing. Those people claim that God love us enough to give us free will. I love my nephew, but I love him enough to restrict his free will. What kind of uncle would I be if I gave him complete free will? He'd walk into traffic and be killed by a car. That is the kind of danger God would put us through if he actually gave us free will.

Answer 6

Had this discussion in a college philosophy class. Conclusion was that if a person believes in Christianity, the person must also believe that everything we think, say, and do is pre-determined and known by God, and therefore, that we do not have free will. I suppose one way of looking at it would be that God gives us choices, but that He's pre-ordained the outcome for each choice He gives -- if you do this, then this will happen. So free will could exist, but the consequences (whether we know what they are or not) are in His hands.

Answer 7

I understand that this is a difficult concept, especially for those who do not practice a Christian religion. I will try to explain to the best of my ability.

It is true that we believe in one, eternal, all-powerful God. As you stated, this God has created all and knows all since He is the ultimate Source. Therefore, God can control all humankind like a puppet, doing whatever he wants with His creation. Yet, religious doctrine teaches that God loved his creation so much that he willingly forfeited this right to control. Rather, he leaves the choice to the individual: one can follow Him and remain in His love for eternity, or one can willingly derail from that divine plan. That leads to the imperfection in this world; mankind's deviance from God in original sin creates the suffering that humankind was not intended to experience. So yes, God can see who will follow Him and who will reject Him, but he still offers that chance to everyone so that the individual will be able to make that decision for himself or herself.

I do not understand why you say that God would have to be fallible for free will to exist. God, being the Supreme Source, cannot make mistakes. His plan for every individual is perfect (not necessarily easy, but the best choice), but one freely accepts it or not. As evidenced by the evil in the world, nobody today follows this divine plan 100% all the time, but some seek forgiveness for derailing from this path and attempt to get back on the plan.

I highly recommend reading Boethius's _The Consolation of Philosophy_ since it deals with many of these fundamental religious questions. It describes in detail how living in an imperfect world leads to Fortune (not necessarily God's will) as naturally changeable (unexpected highs and lows-sometimes things go your way, sometimes they don't). It also stresses the difference between Providence (the divine reason of order) and fate (that order as it is seen through the events in time--man's perception of Providence). I also recommend asking a local preacher for further clarification if there's still any confusion. Please add additional details if I missed something or if I have made things unclear.

Answer 8

Just wait for some one to tell you not to question God it's just true, some people don't like to think. That's why I believe God was just invented for comfort and morals and later for controlling the mindless masses. You can also expect to get lots of quotes from verses in the Bible, but if some one really thinks that is proof that God isn't infallible if he existed, and if he's not infallible what the hell is he? I mean why follow an imperfect entity? I've seen David Blane do some crazy sh*t, maybe we should worship him, as long as we're bowing to faulty deities.

And if God can see what we're going to do without making us do it then what the hell does he do? He didn't create me, my mom and dad then, out of free will, he didn't give me knowledge, my parents and siblings and teachers taught me, he didn't give me strength, I lifted weights in school, I guess he's been on vacation ever since science could prove that miracles weren't so miraculous.

Answer 9

God knows the heart what you will do already in a given situation but you still have free will. We have free will to choose to serve God or serve sin. John 6:64 "But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him." God knew that Judas, by his own free will would betray Him. Jesus said in Matthew 6:24, "No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other." God's Word is true whether you believe it or not. :-) God Bless.

Answer 10

No!....You have the Wrong Misconceptions, that's why you need to sit under a Spiritual Pastor/Minster that can Teach You the Things Of GOD!.....Yes, everyone has a "Free Will".......It goes like this, if you who want to serve GOD Then You Need To OBEY HIS COMMANDS, AND NOT MAN'S OR YOUR OPINIONS & VIEWS!......then you will reap the Blessings Of GOD, on the other hand If you choose Not To Obey, then you fall into another category and Reap the Curses, why?...because you're not OBEYING GOD'S COMMANDS!.......read (1 Sam. 15: 22), (Acts 5: 29), (2 Thess. 1: 8)......ps. I suggest that you attend a GOD Anointed Ministry That Really Knows GOD And His Plan, And Can Teach You The WAYS OF GOD, Instead Of Rashionalizing & Speculatiing, & Assuming GOD On Your Own Opinions & Views And Also Other's!..........it's very apparent that you don't know GOD or His Ways...Can't kick around scriptures!...a person who wants to know GOD, needs To See The WHOLE PICTURE...NOT THE FRAME!.....

Answer 11

Good question,here is an idea to consider:
Here is an example...A parent has their kids in the dining room and puts a plate of oreo's on the table and says I don't want you to eat them, nevertheless you may choose for yourself. The parent (knowing their children and what they will do) then leaves the room. The kids are really free, they don't "have" to eat the cookies, but the parent knows what will happen...

I am using this particular example to represent the Garden of Eden - Read carefully in Genesis 3:3 and it shows that the tree of knowledge of good and evil was placed in the "MIDST" of the Garden...The Fall was all part of the Plan...But God definitely does give us freedom.