What will you do (as a pilot) in this double flameout? (Note: Fictatious scenario)?

Question

Aircraft: Boeing 747-400ER; Route: NRT-LAX; Location: 490 mi on flight path from LAX, Timeframe: February morning twilight. (Situation begins @ FL 380, 0.872 mach IAS)

0320: Received reports of Class 3 storm near LA. (Wind: 85kts, bearing 022)
0422: Heavy turbulence, flying into hailstorm. (Wind: 110 kts, bearing 344)
0431: FOD in No. 4 causing fan breakage and fire. Probable ice problem.
0433: Fire extinguished. No. 4 engine failure. Abnormal pressures in No. 3 reported.
0500: No. 3 flameout.
0505: Received reports after communications with LAX that storm in LAX area is now Class 4. Strong winds and hail expected.
0517: Decended to FL290. Re-attempting to ignite No 3.
0524: No. 3 failed to ignite. No. 3 engine failure. (Wind: 143 kts, bearing 057)

Objective: Land the aircraft safely with all passengers and crew.
Good luck solving this one! :D

Answer 1

What would I do?
What every airline pilot is trained to do- THE ENGINES OUT PROCEEDURE as laid out in the EPC/Emergency Proceeudres Checklist and divert to the nearest suitable airport! The diversion will be made by the PF/pilot flying while the PNF/pilot-not-flying would do the EPC checklist.

As an example of the tasks to be completed by the crew, here is a 747 flameout EPC (could only find a link to an SP, not a -400). Black boxed items are memory items:

http://www.rvs.uni-bielefeld.de/publications/Incidents/DOCS/ComAndRep/ChinaAir/APP_D.html

If LAX is no longer suitable for landing, then there are military airfields in the SoCal basin with long runways that would certainly be good alternates in such an emergency scenario. Immediate vectors would be provided by SoCal Approach Control to the best landing option.

The previous incidents where 747s have had flameouts have been learning tools for the airline training departments:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9
http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19891215-1

The experience those crews had have lead to proceedures for such a scenario. Crews are trained to respond with their memory items and then follow the EPC checklist for whatever situation may arise. Once that has been accomplished, contact with the company dispatch should be made to get additional assistance and performance calculations.

From FL380, and only 490 mi away from the destination, there should be enough altitude to make it to a coastal airport with the remaining engines. If for some reason (worse than forecast winds, total flameout whatever) the aircraft could not make land, at least a ditching, per the EPC procedure for scenario, could be made much closer to shore and aid/rescue.

Answer 2

1. Fly the airplane. Keep the dirty side down, and start a 2000 fpm descent. Change course to direct Point Reyes, about 160 miles distant.
2. Call ATC (Seattle Center, 124.85) and declare an emergency.
3. The nearest available airports will be SFO, SJC, OAK because the airplane will be on a great circle route from Japan's Narita. You are less than 200 miles from all three of them. Get weather conditions and head for the best, preferring SFO because it has the longest runway. (It is also closest.)
4 Go through the usual emergency procedures with respect to cabin, engine restart, et cetera. Advise passengers of why the floor feels tilted to the side.

Answer 3

I agree with heading to another airport. Not an expert on these, but can't 747's fly with one engine once off the ground?

Of course, the movie version would be much different. Perhaps if Tex Johnston were the pilot, he'd do a barrel roll on his way down to land on the aircraft carrier as he did in the testing of the Dash-80...

Rory, to answer your question, yes, they do fly above the clouds at cruising altitude but still aren't immune to turbulence, and they need to go through the clouds to get to the ground...

Answer 4

Well it's a long way from helos to B747-400's but i'm thinking that #2 would go to MCT and # 1 as required/able . Accept a shallow descent and immediatly get on the horn looking for closest suitable alternate.Pull out ECP manual , get hold of Ops . Jettison excess fuel if possible and request FL100 or lower. Attempt a restart of #3 again...
Procede to alternate
Like I said..just pulling what seems to make sense...but then I fly Helos and they rarely make sense!!

Answer 5

Fasten my seatbelt and get another drink, hope the pilot is not drunk....wait a minute I'm the pilot. Ok, call in an emergency and divert to a safer airport, maybe SFO or Portland. Pray.
Funny I fly SFO to NRT and back regularily...

Answer 6

maintain penetration airspeed and consult restart checklist

ignitors on etc

declare emergency and request immediate vectors out of storm as well as list of nearest fields

delegate first officer to check suitability of airfields and whether or not it can handle a 400

notify lead flight attendant of situation and ask her to prepare the passengers

747 will fly on 2 engines...but you need to land immediately, not knowing the possible damage..or possible impending flameout of other two, fastest possible vector to airfield would be wisest

nothing a well traing crew can't handle

Answer 7

Roll back to 0320. Why the hell didn't you check WX at alternates at this time??

And whatever possessed you to fly into hailstorm?

Trim up for best asymetric two-engine airspeed and proceed to alternate with best WX.

Turn in airman's certificat upon landing. You've blown it badly!

Answer 8

Continue on two engines to alternate...or KSFO, KSAN, KMHV where the weather might be better.

(In a novel though, I'd shoot for a landing on a nearby itinerant aircraft carrier.)

Answer 9

Why land it safly with all passengers and crew when you can tilt the nose forward and hurl at the ground at a high speed.

Answer 10

I agree with Ik Weet Niets!
It will fly on two, or at least take you to the scene of the crash