Agree or disagree...separation of church and state?

Question

if there is a seperation from church and state when it comes to traditional religions, they have been replaced with non-traditional religions. So for instance I view school as a religion, since you have to have faith that 2+2=4, or you have to faith in the meaning of a period at the end of a sentence(most ppl on here would discount my faith in the later, because of my run-on sentences). I had a class this past year on street law, and of course this subject came up, I challenged my teacher with this, and he recanted for you to have a religioin you must have a god of sorts, so I recanted well there is a god, and its called knowledge, and you have to have faith in knowledge....I first thought of this when a social worker came to my door one day, she thought I wasnt going to school but i wasnt enrolled in her school, so she said are you going to school religiously. So its just a thought and I want to see what you all think, also I stumped my teacher, he thinks he got the final word

cus' he played the teacher card, alright moving along, it funny how they use it when they think there proving a point

The thing is how would you know 2+2=4, who decides on that fact, you, me, or society, hell I would make it equal fish, because because it doesnt matter? and Im old enough to know enough..that was my senior year, i finished in January and keep going school....anyway I did it to make fun of the subject, and i still think its funny, because I was some what to strike a blow at school, saying we should go to school, because it violates the law, but the thing is I really school, ya know i was to pick at though

Jim R I got to tell ya, the converstion tha tIm talking about, with my teacher, wats on here is a watered down version, my class was 2 hours long, I took up 35 minute of it with this converstasion, and it ecompassed every thing that we do religiously, and the governet has a say in, but I really push the school thing because shool have different laws, such as freedom of speech doesnt nessiarly apply in school, but it does outside of school, and the same thing is with church, so I would agree but who will be the god of food, good food, I mean I dont know, I answered a question the other day, and someone else put up a link to a site about the the chruch Flying Spegghti Monster, so religion can be nothing, and everything

Answer 1

What is the teacher card? I am the teacher and you have to listen to me? I am a teacher and I believe sometimes my students have more insight than I do in certain areas. There are other areas that my knowledge far outweighs their own. So, we are all learning from one another all the time. I don't see schooling as a religion though. In order for it to be a religion the God would have to be able to intervene and knowledge really cannot intervene, it is just there; a reality. Is your God the principal because he is merely like an angel of your religion imparting what has already been given to him from a superior source. Interesting concept though. What was the original question? Oh, yes, separation of church and state. Yes, I think it can happen, but wouldn't tolerance of church and state be more wise?

Answer 2

It's a matter of practical value that "church and state" be seperated. There were so many wars prior to the 17th c. that were crusades for religious power of denomination against denomination. It was really pathetic.

Really there is always a reason someone goes to war or stays in peace. And I wholly doubt a set of religious doctrines are ever the spurs that begin either. The "liberal" mindset was advanced in Netherlands and England first, and of course they saw rewards.

It translated to America by way of Locke and Jefferson, among the rest of the quasi intelligentsia. But these people weren't just ivory tower guys. They were bourgeiosie with an agenda.

The modern school is a reflection of that agenda.
2 + 2 = 4 ...
not because it's a religion that we accept blindly on faith.
but because the practical application of believing in the fixity
of the definitions of 2, +, =, 4 allows us to run the industrial complex like the good custodians we are designed to be by the state that oversees its production.

Its more complicated than this, but certainly 2 + 2 doesn't =4 in all worlds. For instance the "state" is a petty description of this old relationship of oppressor over the oppressed. There are many factors which make simple addition true. Many of which can be found in the barrel of a gun.

Answer 3

The constitution states that the government shall not interfer with religion. So many other governments declared that all of their citizens must belong to the religion sanctioned by the state. In Sweden, until recently, that was still the case that the only religion there was Lutheran. They have finally changed that law and now there are many religions. There is nothing in the constitution that says that religions should be banned or prayer banned. That is a modern interpretation by the Supreme Court.

Answer 4

"Separation of Church and State". Words first uttered by U. S. Supreme Court Associate Justice Hugo Black. He was a member of the Ku Klux Klan and had a burning hatred for Catholics; even once successfully defending a man for murdering a Catholic Preist.

He constructed this phrase because of his suspicion of Catholics and Catholic schools.

Nowhere in the U. S. Constitution is there anything about "Separation of Church and State". The constitution merely states that the government shall make no law in regard to religion nor (and this is important) nor the FREE practice thereof.

The U. S. Constitution protects the freedom OF religion; not the freedom FROM religion.

Answer 5

none of the above can be trully seperated. it is just that we are at a stage in our evolution where we choose to institutionalise everything. Soon we will realise that institutionalisation of religion, education and human governance was a huge mistake, albeit necessary to our growth. When we realise that there is no "God-person" that is seperate from everything, that we need never pray but simply know what we want and have an action plan to get it, life will be much more pleasant... you know... less frustrated souls around.
Though not entirely thorough, your thinking is on the right track. In looking at subject as religion and the likes, it is best to step as far back as possible so you can see as much as possible. too many people suffer from mental myopia. free yourself from it. see the bigger picture.

Answer 6

You're just re-defining religion to encompass math and grammar (or vice versa).

You might as well define eating food as a religious act (because it takes faith to believe someone won't poison us, or to believe that our digestion will work properly) and consider all restaurants to be churches. In that case health inspectors and the Food and Drug Aministration represent a violation of the separation of church and state.

In other words, the question is ridiculous because we can't agree on definitions of even the simplest and most common terms in it.

[Added later:]

When you talk about separation of church and state, you're using legal concepts. And legal concepts are defined very tightly and carefully. When you redefine legal concepts to suit your own purposes, you invalidate the concept (and your argument).

Even when you argue about purely abstract philosophical concepts, you have to watch that you don't engage in empty sophistry. If you're constantly redefining the basic terms, you may win a lot of debates; but you also make your own words meaningless, thus invalidating your own arguments. It's a slippery slope, and it's best to stay on the high side of the slope.

Definition:

Sophism (gr. sophistes meaning "wise-ist," or one who 'does' wisdom, i.e. who makes a business out of wisdom; cf. sophós, "wise man", cf. also wizard) was originally a term for the techniques taught by a highly respected group of philosophy and rhetoric teachers in ancient Greece.

Today, a sophism generally refers to a particularly confusing, illogical and/or insincere argument used by someone to make a point (for example, the fictional "Chewbacca defense"). Sophistry refers to the practice of using such arguments, and is used as derogative for rhetoric that is designed to appeal to the listener on grounds other than the strict logical cogency of the statements being made....

Answer 7

ok there is definitely a difference between school and religion. no matter what religion you are (or lack of religion) 2+2 will always be 4, there's no faith involved there. faith is soemthing you have in people or in God. separation of church and state deals with keeping God out of schools not keeping school out of school.

Answer 8

2 + 2 = 4 easily proven. not a mater of faith.
A period at the end of a sentence is a mechanism of grammar that is conventionally accepted, not a matter of faith.

And..how old are you to have all the answers already? You are in for a big surprise.