What is doing the most harm to traditional family values and the sanctity of marriage?

Question

Last year there were more children born out of wedlock than in
Slightly more than half of all marriages end in divorce.

Most divorced people re-marry and divorce again.

This pattern leaves more than 75% of all children being born in America without ever having a chance at knowing what "traditional family values" really means.

How will gay marriages being legally recognized by the state they live in do more harm to traditional family values than the things straight people are already doing to wreck it?

Is there any evidence that people actually believe marriage is a holy union or is that just an excuse to back up their bigotry and hatred of something they don't understand?

Paul: I know that is what you are told to say regarding gay marriage, however even the Bible regularaly blessed marriage between one man and multiple women. Many of the Old Testament Patriarchs were polygamists. Read the Bible, you will see. Your observation is appreciated, but flawed. Marriage HAS changed over the years. Besides, you didn't answer the question. You only told me some of the reasons you don't think gay marriage should happen.

kys1: The Bible does not mention homosexuality as one of the reasons he destroyed the Earth with the Great Flood. According to the Bible, He intends to destroy the Earth with fire anyway, so the destruction will occur with or without homosexuality. Thank you for your opinion.

Thank all of you for your interesting opinions so far. Those of you who have taken this opportunity to declare why you oppose gay marriage have missed the point of THIS PARTICULAR QUESTION. The question was how is "how is the possibility of gay marriage going to do more damage to the sanctity of marriage and traditional family values than what is already being done by straight people.

Am I to understand that it's ok, for straight people to wreck traditional family values, but not gay people? Doesn't that sound just a little bit wrong?

WWJD: I have never once heard of a gay person insisting on a straight person engaging in a homosexual marriage. Gay people don't want straight people to have gay marriages.

Namsaev: Peculiar response. Thank you for your opinion. We seem to agree on many points, however, you didn't answer the question.

Oh, by-the-way, divorce is no less frequent within the conservative christian movement than it is within the liberal. This isn't a conservative vs. liberal problem, it is a problem with society in general. You, personally, might not be part of it, but we all suffer from it.

I understand it is easier to blame liberals and homosexuals for all of society's ills, but that is neither honest, nor accurate.

southflorida: I don't need to justify gay marriage. I really want to know how one is any worse than the other. Nobody has bothered to actually respond to the actual question, they are just offering their opinions on the related subjects. I appreciate all the opinions, though.

Answer 1

I'm under the impression it has more to do with the parenting methods rather then a 'man and woman' household. I've known plenty of people who had both a mother and father growing up, but still turned out horribly and without morals. I've known plenty of people who just had one parent who turned out to be wonderful, productive members of society. I've known people who's parents stayed together 'for the kids' who were absolutely miserable growing up.

What is needed is a higher standard of parenting. You can't blame the liberals, or the conservatives, the heterosexuals or the homosexuals. You can only blame the individual parents for putting forth a child into the world.

And I don't quite understand how a "family value" differs from an individual who has morals. I don't think you need to have a standard issue mother and father unit in order to be a good citizen. You just need to be taught right from wrong by someone who cares about you and nurtures you. Someone who takes an interest in your growth.

I think that people in general need to learn a little bit of kindness and understand that bringing a child into the world (or adopting a child into their family) regardless of sexual orientation is a big under taking. I don't think that having gay parents is going to be better or worse for a child. Like I've been (uh, kind of repeating!) saying, it all depends on what is taught.

I can understand a church not wanting to recognize a gay marriage - it goes against their beliefs and that is just fine. But they should be able to have the same benefits as straight people when it comes to their legal rights.

Answer 2

It's not that being against "gay marriages" is bigotry and hatred, it's just that there really is no such thing. A marriage has always been defined as being between one man and one woman. Any changes in that is... well.. just wrong.

That means that a marriage cannot exist between two men, or two women, or fifteen men and forty-seven women.

Y'see, I have a thing in front of me called a computer right now. We all pretty much know what a computer is. But if a majority of the people wanted to call a cow a computer, that wouldn't make it a computer (even if they called it that) it would still be a cow.

Socially and legally, I do believe that our country is headed toward a place where there will be some kind of legal union for gay couples. Even though I personally don't like that I'd be okay with that for legal purposes-but it isn't a marriage.

Economically there are issues as well. Many companies and states, and even the federal government recognize spousal rights for many things. In some areas (like probate), that's no big deal. In others (like spouse health insurance and social security survivor benefits) that is a big deal. Insurance tables are assembled under certain assumptions. Adding a large number of "gay couple spouses" would dramatically alter those assumptions and tables. So then the question becomes, do we exclude gay couples from these or accept them in? If they are a "real marriage" and we exclude them that would be all kinds of wrong. If they are a "real marriage" and we include them, that could easily bankrupt many programs and would also be wrong. That will have to be handled as well.

And then there's the "across state borders" issue. Legal "gay marriages" in Massachucetts must be honored by the state of Kansas--so now where we and other states have spoken and voted against it, we are now forced to honor a legal "gay marriange" from another state. So now we have three of five judges in the state of Massachucettes that have effectively made law in all 50 states--leave out the part about it being "gay marriages" that I'm personally against and I have an even bigger problem with that because I have no representation, recourse, or oversight of five judges in another state.

And finally, do not confuse my comments here with hatred and bigotry. At first glance it may seem that way, but I mean to oppose the issue while being respectful to the other side of the issue.

Answer 3

I understand your question! The information your using to shape the discussion is flawed. I don't think it is the a religious point at all. The needs of the world are not the same anymore, divorce yourself (no pun intended) from the traditional thoughts around theology and marriage. In general humankind on the planet earth, at least western civilization is not an agrarian society anymore. Since humans walked upright there has been the need for a helpmate. A need to have children (or free labor) to work farms or animals to sustain life. Now, as the world grows, and the needs of humankind are different marriage as a system is changing.

Look back not a million years ago, not 10000 years, but the 1700's. In those times if you could read and write, a person in their lifetime took in the same amount of information that is contained in an average Sunday newspaper. Now think about how Sunday newspapers you have read. The way we shape reality, serves the present. The information from the past has two functions, it gives context for the future and leads higher thinking people towards innovation. Now a simple that might help you see the answer. Is traveling from New York, to Los Angles fast by stagecoach or Jet Aircraft? People still take trains and even walk across country. Now if you bring religion back into the topic, it is easy to understand that any religion as it faces the future or history has challenges in its dogmatic themes. Sanctity is effort, and effort is best deliver by the individual not a system.

Answer 4

-What is doing the most harm to traditional family values and the sanctity of marriage?

Loosening of standards of what is right and wrong.

That said I'll back that up with how your comments prove my point.

-Last year there were more children born out of wedlock than in

Are you old enough to remember when having a child out of wedlock was NOT at good thing? Do you remember when having an abortion was NOT a good thing? Today there are about as many abortions performed on married women as unmarried. Lower the standards and you remove traditional values. What happened to responsibility for your actions?

-Slightly more than half of all marriages end in divorce.

Once again -Lower the standards and you remove traditional values. There was a time when divorce wasn't nearly as common as today. But then neither were extramarital affairs. Once upon a time forsaking ALL others and TILL death do us part meant something different. Once upon a time a persons word meant something. Today even a signed contract is only as good as your lawyer.

-Most divorced people re-marry and divorce again.

See the above answer. I don't want to repeat myself.

-This pattern leaves more than 75% of all children being born in America without ever having a chance at knowing what "traditional family values" really means.

I don't mean to pick on liberals, but it's liberal thinking that has created the problem. And not to leave the conservative side out. They haven't set a very good example of what the traditional values are supposed to be.

-How will gay marriages being legally recognized by the state they live in do more harm to traditional family values than the things straight people are already doing to wreck it?

It's just another chink in the armor. The Berlin wall wasn't taken down by a single massive explosion. It was taken down by repeated blows from hammers. And just so you know that number of "Christian" denominations that recognise 'gay' (Why are they called gay anyway? They never seem that gay to me.) are small in comparision to those that don't. There are liberals in all walks of life *LOL*. Back on point. Would child molestation be acceptable if it were recognised by a number of denominations?
No it wouldn't. Again Lower the standards and you remove traditional values.

-Is there any evidence that people actually believe marriage is a holy union or is that just an excuse to back up their bigotry and hatred of something they don't understand?

I believe in a Holy union. I've been in one for over forty years now. Is it bigotry to be against something you believe is wrong? Is it hatred to say out loud something is wrong?

How do you feel about beastiality? I don't understand that fully either but I'm against that as well. With the liberal mind set one day it will be accepted. After all -Lower the standards and you remove traditional values. All hail the new tradition!

Pardon me if I don't stand and applaud where this train is going.

Answer 5

I thought the argument if you let a man marry a man, then next you can let a man marry an animal, or have marriages with more than two partners. The first one is bogus as an animal can't say give consent by saying "I do". The latter has been part of Muslim and Mormon tradition for generations, though it is outlawed in the Western nations today. However the fear and jealousy involved with a husband taking another, younger, prettier partner is a concern of many women. Finding a way to make it legal and accepted by perhaps a religious community is a therefore obviously a concern. It is really a manipulatively worded argument to make women associate gay marriages with a trend to allow bigamous marriages and thereby play on their insecurities.

Answer 6

Yes, straight people can do alot of damage in a marriage, 1 people have become more violent, I have been divorced andhave re-married, but I value my life. Noone wants to be with a spouse who chokes them and hits them and threatens to kill them on a daily bases. But that is only my experience. 2, who's raising the kids and how are they being raised, because if your not teaching your kids the right values, this is only going to be a growing problem. I now have children and I stay home and raise them myself, I trust noone with my children. As far as gays go, I am not of the chritian denomintion, I am of the old hardshell baptist, and I will never understand or agree with gay/marriage etc.The bible says it is an abomination, he destroyed this earth once because of all the wrong the people were comitting, including having relations with the same sex. What makes people think he wouldn't do it again? This is my belief, if you or anyone else believe dif, I respect that. My bible also tells me not to jugde others. I don't have to agree but At the same time i have to respect that you may not agree with me. I just believe that what is wrong with the world today is that people have removed God from there lives or have yet to find him. I don't hate gays, I just don't agree, I can only go by my bible and what it tells me.

Answer 7

I'm a Christian with slightly more liberal views.

I'm also more concerned about kids who grow up in homes out of wedlock than I am about children raised by homosexuals.

Consider this: I've been mentoring a little girl who is the 5th of 6 kids in a single mother home (four absentee fathers fathered her half-siblings.) since 1998. I got married in 2003, but she met several of my boyfriends and the trail of men her mom brings through the house. In her large family, there are many children born. I know of only one couple in her family circle who are married.

For Memorial Day in 2004, we took this child, who was 10 at the time, on a little road trip about 8 hours from home. While on this trip, we had dinner with a friend of mine from college. He happens to be male. I mentoned in the car after we said our goodbyes to him that I used to have a major crush on him. She asked me if I still did. I told her that it doesn't matter because I'm married now and I don't get any more boyfriends. That answer totally baffled her. She continued to rib me for a while about this man being my Next boyfriend." She just didn't understand the concept of a committed loving relationship.

I believe my marriage is a holy union. I also question a society where My husband and I had more rights (as in became next of kin to eachother, no questions asked by the state, government agencies, or religious organization) a little over a year from when we met vs a gay couple that had been together for 20-30 years (or longer) because we were able to legally wed and they are not.

Answer 8

The kids today don't have a quality example of what a marriage should be. Therefore, how can they be expected to know what to do? The only examples they see are most likely what's portrayed on TV and in movies, which is hardly something worthy of being repeated.

That's a bad question though. You're just trying to justify gay marriage by the faults of traditional marriage.

Answer 9

The closed-minded, hateful and fearful views of the religious right are doing the most harm to traditional family values and the sanctity of marriage. If you read or listen to what some of these people say about gay people and their wish to get married and have a family, it is completly hateful. Plus, they only want to force their religious views into the country's law and on to everyone else. That is wrong.

Answer 10

The break down of the traditional family starts with the parents who won't put any effort into keeping a family together. Thus children do not learn morals or ethics. Without the knowledge of right from wrong people continue on a path that becomes more centered on themselves and their needs rather than making a family and rearing children to be good parents and citizens that contribute to their society.

Answer 11

You have pretty much answered your own question. People do not take marriage seriously today. Every one rushes out to get married and if it don't work out get a divorce. Marriage is and should be considered sacred in the eyes of God. Don't marry unless you plan on making it work. That is why you should know the person you are marrying.
Also, the only thing I have against Gay Marriages is we are having it pushed on us. If you really think about it, basic anatomy shows that Man and Woman are to be together, we are made to fit together, we are made to procreate. Two men cannot make a child and neither can two women. A child needs the influence of a man and a woman to be whole. Mother and Father.
Honestly think about it. If you want to be together, fine that is your decision, regardless of my religious beliefs. But, if you chose to do this, then you should take the consequences that come with it. No children, no marriage, except in your own heart.
Why are you trying to change the world for your desires and wishes.
You know who is suffering for all of man kinds follies, children. If we were to follow the bible to the letter, there would not be so much pain and confusion in this world. There would be no divorces, children suffering because of drug abuse, alcohol abuse, child molestation, broken and battered bodies.
We would not even be having this discussion.
But there will be no such world, because man kind has to let all of his desires, lust, greed, cruelty, non-discipline take hold and forget about others, forget about right and wrong.
Every bit of suffering in the world is do to man kind not wanting to be self disciplined!
If you know in your heart that what you want is wrong, then deny yourself. That is why Paul said in the bible "I crucify my self daily" He was talking about taking his lust and desires and putting them under control.
A child molester or a rapist says they cannot help but think about their desires, then they need to go and seek help in order to stop it. Don't set around and think about it until they take action.
If everybody took action upon their desires and wants, what kind of world would there be. Craziness, no order. We are civilized people, at least I like do think that. We are made above all other creation. We should be responsible for all things. Look into the past and you can see what is the result of people out of control. Hitler is just one example, the death and destruction that followed him.