Where is the other space?

Question

Our Universe is defined as an infinite space (endless) by many. Wouldn't you need space to create space?

If the Universe continually expands, which in theory it does, and planets/soloar systems regenerate, space is required;
hense the question. Planets/solar systems are animate objects which occupy this space. so i see a conflict with time over matter.
over time

Answer 1

My understanding of the thing is that from our 3d point of view, space seems infinite indeed; but it is actually contained within spacetime. General relativity tells us that space curves into time just as our intuitively flat earth curves downwards over the horizon into a third dimension (in Earth's case, it's a sphere, as we know). Shapes traced out in space by planets, nebulae and asteroids may well be described as polyhedrons and spheres, but we cannot talk about the shape of the universe this way; we have to invoke fantastic 4 dimensional polychora such as hyperspheres in hyperspace.

So I think your question "Wouldn't you need space to create space?" might be misleading: It's like asking "wouldn't you need points to create or define more points in a single point-universe that was expanding?" "wouldn't you need lines to create more lines?" or "planes to create more planes?". I would answer that you need at least one line to define or create more points on it; you need a plane to create more lines, you need space to create more planes, and you need HYPERSPACE, or SPACETIME to create or define more space. In a two dimensional universe, the "other points" are elsewhere along that 2d line that defines that whole 2d universe; likewise for all the higher dimensions right up to the Einsteinian universe where the "other space(s)" are found elsewhere in spacetime, outside our universe whose "inside limit" in hyperspace is defined by the Big Bang.

From the wording of your question, I gather you're thinking more about the "outside limit": and my answer can only be that the outside limit of the universe, from our 3d perspective, is meaningless. Again,we are not in space here; but rather hyperspace, or 4d spacetime; which is what the universe is really made of, according to modern theory.

To go back to our flat earth analogy; we all know our planet is really a sphere with a centre and an edge. Now let us imagine our planet is an expanding planet: an expanding sphere. Now imagine what would stubborn 2d thinking flat earth society members observe? They would see everything around them getting farther and farther from them and from everything else: They would wonder "Then what is the Earth expanding into?" More flat Earth.. would come the answer: Well, if there's more flat earth, then there must be someplace where there is no more flat earth... so let's go out to the edge and see that... BUT there is no edge, because the Earth is really curving into that third dimension that those flat earthers cannot or will not acknowlege, recognize, or even imagine.

The shape of our spacetime universe is described through analogy in various possible versions; all based on how much matter and energy we think is out there forcing and warping space into that 4th dimension of time. One suggestion is that the curvature of the universe just continues on until it folds back onto itself like a 4d hypersphere; another is that it just goes on and out forever into time; another is that it oscillates back and forth like a bellows, expanding out from a Big Bang, reaching a maximum "spacetime diameter" and then collapsing back in to make another Big Bang.

Finally there are cosmologists who say our whole spacetime universe is contained inside some higher dimensional "brane" that is defined by something more than spacetime . .

So: I would answer no: not infinite space, but rather finite spacetime. And no, you don't need space to create more space: you rather need time to create more spaces in spacetime. Which means that you'll find your other space elsewhere in time by "jumping off" the universe into the 4th dimension.

It's complicated.

Answer 2

Jeez! how many times do you people have to be told..THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS INFINITE OR INFINITY! It is only a mathematical construct like the square root of minus one. A handy math tool but has no actual existence.

Since the Universe contains EVERYTHING, it only has an INSIDE.
No outside.
It can expand all it wants, there is NOTHING to stop it.

Answer 3

It is not normally possible to relate Outer Space realities to experiences and learned truths which one has absorbed here on Earth. This makes comprehension of Outer Space difficult for some people.

Example: On Earth, with gravity pulling down all the time, there is a definite sense of "UP." In Outer Space there is no "UP."

Example: On earth, using the magnetic fields of the planet itself, and the reference to our Sun there is a standard means of facing EAST, WEST, NORTH, and SOUTH. In Outer Space there is no EAST, WEST, NORTH or SOUTH.

Example: On Earth we measure things in micrometers all the way up to thousands of Miles in length; such as,the Earth has a circumference of roughly 25,000 Miles. A Yard is 3 Feet long. A standard sheet of paper is 8 Inches by 11 Inches. In Outer Space measurements are in Light Years, Multiples of the distance from the Earth to the Sun, and Degrees of Arc.

Current technology permits astronomers to "see" objects in Deep Space at distances of 13 Billion Light Years in all directions from Earth. Radio Astronomers using Radio Telescopes can "detect" objects in Deep Space at distances of up to 40 Billion Light Years in all directions from Earth. Those distances are not, however, the total extent of Space. They are merely the points at which our technology fails to provide us with any useable information. Space continues on and on. We just cannot see any farther than that with our present levels of equipment sophistication. I suggest that rather than worry about what is beyond space, you try and visualize the total number of miles in 40 Billion Light Years to see the futility of these discussions.

One Light Year is roughly 6 Trillion Miles.
40 Billion times 6 Trillion = ??? Miles.

Answer: ___________________ Post it here.
Oops, not enough room to write down the total number
without any powers of ten notation? That is just a small
example of the size of space.

Another way to look at it might be to consider yourself as: "a single grain of sand" attempting to visualize the total size of the Earth and the Solar System. The grain of sand has no reference with which to contemplate Saturn or Uranus and Pluto...thus it has difficulty with the concept. I don't ask you to buy into the concept of space being infinite on blind faith, rather to just accept that space is huge beyond belief, and extends beyond all of our abilities to measure or define it.

Regards,
Zah