Socrates went to his death on the proposition that it is better to suffer injustice than to do it.?

Question

Do you agree? This is not a homework assignment. I am an old man. I just want to know your opinion on this important moral idea.

Dink misses the 10 points by a mile. What does sexual conduct have to do with anything that is your business. You violate the point you try to make. The press looking into your privite affairs might find somethings out of order?

Oh goody Doc. Y. Helping somone is an injustice to them? You would not last long in a Socratic dialog. No 10 points for you!

Wiz, I like so much of what you say, but what do you mean by "made of value" What is a measure of value? Thanks for your contribution.

Oh and Doc. You didn't answer the question. Is it better to suffer injustice? And you know quite well what Plato meant by the term, or are you of the Plato was an idiot school? hummmm?

Answer 1

I can't even vaguely agree.

If I help a motorist who is stranded on the side of the road, this is completely unjust. I have done nothing to cause his situation - why should I expend my time and energy helping him out? In all likelihood, his problem is of his own making and the most just thing to do would be to force him to deal with the consequences.

I do it anyway. I am the cause of an injustice. But I think most would rather have me around than a city full of far more just people. Don't you?

EDIT:

If you believe that Socrates was put to death for merely being a 'gadfly' as Plato tries to make it seem in his Apology, you probably have another think coming. You should probably investigate the activities of two of Socrates' OTHER star pupils: Alcibiades conspired with Sparta to overthrow the Athenian republic and Critias later did the same with the wealthy of Athens, killing thousands in the process. You may note in the apology that Socrates tries to defend himself obliquely by saying that he didn't cooperate with Critias' slaughter any more than he cooperated with the Athenian republic... but I doubt that was much consolation to many at the trial with dead friends and family.

Likewise, Plato expounds at length on what exactly justice is in "The Republic", and if we take his views for Socrates' it is pretty much fulfilling your purpose and doing nothing outside of it. It is wrong for the soldiers to rule and for tradesmen to defend the country. So my example is apt - it is not my job to travel around an help people in need, so it is an injustice for me to do it. Even according (perhaps) to Socrates. Socrates defends his gadflyisms in the Apology by suggesting it IS his purpose - one assigned by the Oracle.

Answer 2

This proposition is typical of modern thought which believes we can correct our mistakes through studying the past. It makes no difference what Socrates thought. It has not been fruitful in the beneficial sense. The same goes for all subsequent philosophers.

Philosophy is the unfruitful search for truth. When truth is found it is no longer philosophy. Philosophy contains no meaningful beneficial fruit. The fruit we need is understanding of ourselves and this understanding cannot be found from an incorrect perspective.

Genuine enlightenment comes only from self-understanding. A world full of ignorance is only changed one person at a time. With all the historical "wisdom" man has remained an insolent self destructive creature. History's only value is as an unconscionable motivating force driving one to self-understanding, the antidote for ignorance.

Perspectives have consequences and wrong perspectives have wrong consequences. The only true perspective is that we are made of value. What we scientifically know of "matter" and our intellectual discourse support the value perspective. We just never look at existence this way.

Consequently, we live in a world of materially conceived systems of arrogant and ignorant professionals whose persona and livelihood depend upon the multitude of contradictory images generated by a false perspective. To challenge this perspective is to threaten the people who control everything. It seems unlikely to me we will escape the consequences of their machinations. Our current history is and will be the result of assuming we are made of matter. It guarantees our inhuman nature.

Jerry Hewes

Answer 3

It takes a lot of guts to stand up for what you believe in. And I'd love to say I would follow in Socrates' footsteps, and die rather than intentionally commit injustice, but I can't know for sure that I would without ever having been in that situation. I hope I would be as brave (and noble) if ever faced with that choice.

Socrates' famous last words "I drank what?" ; )

Answer 4

I agree with Dar. I firmly believe it is better to suffer injustice than do it.

Answer 5

suffering injustice does not perpetuate it as does doing injustice. it's the lesser of the two evils.

Answer 6

I don't believe in injustice for anyone including myself. Personally, I believe that Socrates was a recipient of good press. Rarely do you find that persons highly romanticized and thought of as heroic are so. In our time, look at John F. Kennedy. His philandering and adultery rather removes his heroic image if one honestly looks at it. Good press and fawning imbeciles continue to sustain his image to this day and likely will continue to do so.

Injustice, no. Rationality and honesty, yes.

Answer 7

if you can't overcome injustice, then your choices are to "fight evil with evil" or suffer it. If you can't overcome it, then u must endure it. good luck.

Answer 8

I do agree.