Civil Fines and self incrimination?

Question

In the case of red light cameras, many cities are issuing tickets to the owners of vehicles that are photographed running red lights. The fine is a civil fine, but the driver can sign and affidavit identifying the driver if it was someone other than themselves.

The 5th amendment protects a person from incriminating themselves in a criminal case. From my understanding, such cases are typically considered criminal offenses, however, my city is taking them as civil fines.

What happens if the person refuses to verify whether or not they were driving the vehicle? Are you protected from self incrimination is a civil trial?
And how can you be fined for something that no one can prove that YOU did? (Photographs are ONLY taken from behind the vehicle)

ok.. further detail... and btw.. this is hypothetical... I did not get a ticket. So this is just for the sake of curiosity.

Suppose I went to court and said "I was not driving the vehicle." "who was?" "someone I had met that night... I didn't catch his name"... supposing their were two individuals in the vehicle, one could say that they had become intoxicated and were driven by a sober individual. yes yes defrauding the court, perjury.... but those are offenses that would have to be proven. It would be impossible to disprove such a story.

Answer 1

well the justice system plays by their own rules so really it's their call we are not protected by the constitution any longer law makers make up new ways all the time in order to take our rights promised in our constitution look at the patriot act for example

Answer 2

There's NO 5th amendment right in a civil case.

Many States have de-criminalized traffic infractions for this very reason. In speeding trials, for example, the State can ask you "Were you speeding?" If you say yes, you get the fine. If you refuse to answer, they fine you for contempt of court. If you say "no", and the judge believes the cop anyway, you can then be criminally prosecuted for perjury - a felony that carries prison time.

"And how can you be fined for something that no one can prove that YOU did?"

when you register your car you agree, in exchange for the State allowing you to drive it on their roads, to abide by certain rules. One of those is that you agree to pay the red-light fine if the actual driver can't be located.

"(Photographs are ONLY taken from behind the vehicle)"

I don't know where you are, but sitting on my desk is a red light summons from Fairfield, in California. It has 5 pictures on it. The front license plate, the back of the car showing the plate, the drivers face in close up, the car still behind the stop line with the light already red, and the car in the junction with the light still red. There's also a URL which, if I visit, shows a video of the car driving through the redlight from two different angles.

$475, which I shall be discussing.... in detail.... with my older son next time he's home on leave. :-(

Richard

Answer 3

A traffic infraction is not a crime.(misdeameanor/felony) It is a violation. That doesn't even apply in this case, as the ticket is not being issued as a traffic ticket (which would have to be served on the operator) In the case of cameras, they are ticketing the car, not the driver, much like a parking ticket.That makes it a civil matter. It doesn't matter who is driving the car when a parking ticket is issued, does it? The owner must pay. Same deal with red light cameras. It goes on nobodies Lic, is not a criminal offense. If you don't want to pay it, then you better get whomever was driving your car because as the registered owner, You are responsible to know who is using your car.

Answer 4

The founding fathers were VERY Godly men. George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, etc. all had a strong Christian faith & formed America as a Christian nation.