What's difference between a '68 Honda Dream & Scrambler?

Question

I have (what I think is) a 1968 Honda Dream motorcycle,
but some recent photos I've seen, make me re-think
what I've got. They are both 305cc.thought
the only difference is the muffler, as far as I can tell.
any thoughts will be appreciated.

Joey

Answer 1

Honda had 3 different models

CA72= "Dream"..a sort of "Touring Bike" of it's day.
http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/782027/

This is the one with stamped steel frame,square headlight,square shocks,,enclosed chaingaurd,big wide &deep fenders painted same as bike,,link type front suspension,,single carb.
Dreams/Benlys are "Unmistakely DIFFERENT" than regular,typical bikes
............................................................

CB72="Super Hawk" =Standard Street Bike
These had a Tubing,,cantilever style frame,telescopic forks with "solid" spring covers,,,downswept exhaust,
Fenders were"normal streetbike" style of the era--Long and were braced to lower end of fork.
Rear fender was low mounted and long and had a "mud flap" which stuck out straight rearward

http://www.vjmw.org/yourbike/honda/sep11_billy_cb72.jpg
......................................................................................................
CL72= "Scrambler",,,an "OffRoad/Dirtbike " version
(I have to Check Myself each time I say that---sounds Weird these days even to me,,lol)
http://world.honda.com/SEEVERT/motorcycles/images/illust/03.jpg

No electric start.
Fenders were Shorter and Higher Mounted.
No mudgard on rear,,Front was braced across middle of fork tubes,,comprising a "fork brace"
Front Forks had rubber gaiter spring covers.
Higher/Wider/cross braced handlebars vs CB's.
Upswept pipes with a removeable unitary muffler assy,,,,which left "tuned" equal length straight pipes.
Fuel tanks were a bit smaller & different shaped.
They also had a hydraulic steering damper tube mounted from frame-to-fork lower clamp
Chrome grab rail around rear of seat,,mounted Into frame tube,as if a frame extension

Kickstands and center stands were also different among all 3 models to accomodate the different exhaust systems of CB Street Bike/CL Scrambler.
And I "Think" footpegs/mounting bar assy were also

Dreams are quite unmistakeable.
Super Hawks and Scramblers are Very Similar---same basic bikes but with more differences than commonly thought.

It's Not unusual to find "Parts Bikes"--homemade hybrids made of parts from different years/models

Even during their day it wasn't unusual to see various stages of "conversion" attempts to alter one model into something similar to another model.

I 'spose easiest feature to distinguish models BY ENGINE
*CA Dream-Single Carb and Electric Start
*CB Super Hawk-Dual Carb & Electric Start
*CL Scrambler- Dual Carb and NO Electric Start

Starter is mounted in front of engine ,beneath exhaust.
It's obviously absent on CL Scramblers

The Single/Dual Carb Cylinder Heads are Interchangeable.
These days,by now,,Anything is possible to have been converted ,swapped,etc to restore/revive an old bike

The CRANKSHAFTS and cams are Different.

CB's are 180* cranks>>1 piston Up,other Down,,like "modern" Honda Twins,,1970's 350,450,etc. &
they SOUND like Hondas

CL's are 360* cranks,,both pistons up/down simultaneously.
One on Compression while Other is on Exhaust.
These sound like Triumphs,Nortons,etc

Beleive it or not,,,You can tell the difference between a CA Dream,,a CB SuperHawk,,and a CL Scrambler BLINDFOLDED and from across the Street.

Between the Single-vs-Dual Carbs,,and the Crankshaft/Firing Order,,,
Each Model has it's own very distinctive,,"signature" tone which is abosolutely unmistakeable as being the other Model.

Useless Trivia,,,but makes for sure-thing Bar Bets 4 Beers ;)

.........................
Here is a site which has pics of all 3 types.

http://www.classichondarestoration.com/redCB77.php

The 250 "CA/CB/CL77" models are 'bout Identical to the 305 72's.
So any 250 info/pic is a valid refference in most aspects.

You may find www.honda305.com a useful site,,there's actually a bunch of interest in those old bikes.

Hope any of that helps

Good Luck with it,,,they're all Genuine Classics and established several milestones in history of Jap Bike Industry.
VERY Big Deal in their day,,,and some of most desirable bikes on the market.

Answer 2

Forget all of what TMX42 wrote above. Honda made two series of engines for these bikes. The CA 72, CB 72, and CL 72 were all 250cc engines, made n the early 1960s. The 305's used the CA77, the 305 Dream, The CB77, 305 Super Hawk, and the CL77, 305 Scrambler. The CL, and CB77's used 180 degree crankshafts, one piston up, the other down, while the Dream, CA77 used a 360 degree crankshaft. I work on all these engines, and there are some differences, but basically the 305 Dream engine has smaller valves, both pistons travel up and down together, but one piston is on compression stroke while the other is on exhaust stroke. The Dream only had one carb, so the cylinder heads are different from the Scrambler, and Super Hawk. The CB77 and CL77 used basically the same engine. Over the years Honda made changes in gear ratios, and clutch disks. The Super Hawk had an electric starter, it needed it, because one had to kick the lever towards the front of the engine. Believe me if your foot slipped the lever would hit you right in the shin. I have no clue why Honda did this, but I was not amused. So onto my favorite 305, the CL77 Scrambler. To this day it remains one of my all time favorite bikes. It uses the same engine as the Super Hawk, except Honda got the kick starter right on the Scrambler. If there was a difference in the gearing on the two bikes I never noticed it. Both would clean the Dream in a race easily. Top speed in my experience was 85 to 90 with the Dream, and 95 to 100 with the Super Hawk and Scrambler, and I am probably being generous on the last two. The Dream was a smooth riding bike, and had a unique look to it with the stamped sheet metal frame. The Super Hawk was "flashy" with a lot of chrome, while the Scrambler was all business, nothing fancy, but my favorite among the three. I have heard some people say they owned a Dream with a Super Hawk engine. I don't believe either of the other 305 engines will fit in a Dream frame. I worked as a mechanic at our local Honda shop from 1968 to 1970.

Answer 3

Honda 305 Scrambler

Answer 4

Honda 305 Dream

Answer 5

The difference between a dream and scrambler is the frame. The dream has a sheet metal frame and the scrambler has a steel tubular frame. Also the scrambler frame runs under the engine for protection from rocks etc. The 305 scrambler like the others ie. 160cc and 350cc was basically a dirt bike with street legal lights and mirrors.

Answer 6

This Site Might Help You.

RE:
What's difference between a '68 Honda Dream & Scrambler?
I have (what I think is) a 1968 Honda Dream motorcycle,
but some recent photos I've seen, make me re-think
what I've got. They are both 305cc.thought
the only difference is the muffler, as far as I can tell.
any thoughts will be appreciated.

Joey

Answer 7

Dreams are completely personal, embodiments of person's wishes, desires and best of all that a person is made of, whereas aims are what we have between ourselves and the world around us, the world where our dreams are often realised through our aims. Dreams and aims are different, but they are also interlinked, as no dream could be a happy dream if the dreamer would make no efforts to bring it to reality, or to become internally realised in the mind in some elevated and idealised formed, and thus influencing the rest of the proceedings of life at large. The fact is that life in its entirety is a dreams that sometimes we interpret through our sense of divinity and sometimes just objectively materialistically. Throughout our life, however, we keep dreaming immensely, it is just that we always understand our dreams according to the reach of the awareness of our being. Whereas our aims, we formulate only when we realised a just need to do so in relation what we encounter or deal with in the world that we gradually become. We come into this world as a dream, make efforts to make it our home, and then we return to the unknown worlds of dreams that we nurture while alive, if we aim properly in life the journey could be for more pleasant and purposeful. We could still have our dreams intact by the time we leave.

Answer 8

Honda did that on a lot of their early models. Both models would be the same, except the "scrambler" model would have high pipes'

Answer 9

The Honda "Dream" models had pressed sheet metal frames and large full fenders. I don't see how you could confuse the two, they are very different.