Would it be a fair assessment to say that those who threaten suicide and self-harm.....?

Question

That come up with every excuse as to why they can not go for rehabilitation, counselling, or even tell someone who could guide them in the right direction, are expecting everyone else to change to accomodate them, rather than changing what they don't like about themselves?
Because that is the feeling I get from the thousands of YA posters who are depressed, but not THAT depressed, contemplating suicide, but can't think of a way to do it, and those who are just at the end of their rope, but can't afford to go to a counsellor.
You know, it gets very tiring after a short time when you try and give sound advice to those who are in need of it, and just won't take it, and get mad when you don't tell them what they want to hear - that they are okay, and everyone else needs to change.

Ms. Kitty, I was VERY SPECIFIC in my description, don't misunderstand my question.

Libby, you're cute, but I was very specific in my description, people who claim to be depressed but aren't, taking attention to themsleves, when someone who really wants/needs help is afraid to ask.

Kujo, I am truly sorry for your loss, and in a case like yours, it's obvious he was not playing games, he was truly hurting, and my heart goes out to you and your family.

Cae, you're absolutely correct, it is hard to remember to be patient when you're on the outside looking in. Thank you for your gentle reminder. Bless your heart.

Clansmen, I acutally read your answer, and ignored your nickname, you almost had me, but you jumped to the wrong conclusion about me.

Michael, if the threats had any validity, I'd know it, and it's pretty tough to feel bad for a kid who's on the verge of becoming a columbine-wanna-be. If they have enough brain power to reharese, plan and execute, they have enough to go to the school counsellor, and their parents should parent them.

Alli, I have never closed a door, but do you think a child who is spolied and upset because they can not have something they want is "depressed" as opposed to someone with a chemical imbalance, or one who is bullied, or one who is abused by their alcoholic parent? Come on. I don't generalize, I know psychology, and I know that there is not one size fits all in this category.

Aussie, tie me kangaroo down, Sport.

JaRoll, I agree, that was kind of the point I was trying to make with this question.

treseuropean, Albinoballs (ahem), and Al, I agree with all three of you. I'm not sure if you intended to have my back on this, but I think you do, so rock on!

Answer 1

I think that they're just looking for someone to listen them, and maybe talk them out of it. A friend of mine became depressed and entered counseling. He ended up committing suicide even though he was getting help. I noticed small changes in his behavior, which I now realize were signs, but I didn't think anything of them. I figured that his family and his doctors had it under control and that he was getting the help he needed. I was wrong. I wish that I had taken a more active role in helping him with his depression, but at the time I didn't know any better. And he seemed like the happiest guy in the world, even towards the end of his life. To this day he's the kindest person I've ever met. But he worried too much about pleasing others, that couldn't be pleased. Suicide was just a word to me. I had suffered from depression myself, but had never contemplated suicide.

My friend was gay. He did it because he couldn't deal with the conflict between his sexuality, his religious faith, and his family. After he did what he did, it opened my mind to it and I became suicidal. I felt very alone in a world that didn't want me. I wanted to end my pain. I am also gay and had experienced similar challenges in life that he had. I came very very close to ending my own life. I was suicidal for about two years after my friends death. I didn't seek regular phyciatric help because during my first and only session, the doctor told me that if I was suicidal he would have to report me to the police. That's apparently the law in California. I wanted help but I couldn't talk about how I really felt without being reported to authorities. That didn't encourage me to be honest, and since I actually wanted to die, I just never went back. I think that talking to someone would have helped me to heal faster than dealing with it on my own. But I wasn't thinking clearly and I really didn't wanted to be reported. It was a combination of luck, chance, and just enough family responsibility that I didn't follow through with my plans to end my life. Mostly family responsibility.

When I was at my lowest, I didn't have anything to say. But later on, I would post questions relating to suicide on YA to vent my feelings, and I appreciated all the pep-talks and heartfelt advice. I was still wondering about suicide by this time, but no longer determined. I had already destroyed all of my suicide letters. So when I respond to questions regarding someones suicidal feelings, I try to help them the same way that I was helped. And btw, I have since conquered my demons and found inner peace.

Answer 2

There is a difference between general depression and the clinical state. There are those who will use their melancholy to seek attention. There are also those who are genuinely ill through a chemical in balance.
It is partly a cultural misunderstanding, people seem to expect to happy most of the time. This is of course not possible. It is a lack of maturity and experience in some that leads to this misunderstanding.
If more was understood about the various states of mental illness this problem would not be so common.
Anybody with better knowledge would no more want to have a broken leg or a physical disease or would try to align themselves with it nonchalantly.
Yet one cannot close the doors for the sake of those who genuinely are suffering and will benefit from medical attention.

Answer 3

Statistics show that the more a person talks about committing suicide the more likely they are to do it. It is a fallacy that if someone tells you they want to kill themselves then they won't do it because the opposite is true.

As for depression - I assume that you have never suffered from it (and I sincerely hope you never do) because it really is a bottomless pit of despair and no matter how much good advice people give you, you cannot see a way out. You cannot see how to make this advice work for you or even that you are worth saving. As someone who has suffered depression and come out the other side, falling back into it is my greatest fear. I truly do not think I could survive feeling like that again.

So I'm really sorry you are tired of giving your good advice to people who won't take it - be thankful that the people who are too low to take your advice are just names on YA and not someone you love dearly!

Answer 4

I think you have an over-inflated sense of self-importance if you really believe that answering a suicidal persons question is going to make them all of a sudden be well again. Its more than just changing what they don't like about themselves. What if they just lost a family member or have been abused. How can they "change" that?? Depression is a major problem that takes a lot more than a paragraph from you to overcome. If a person is suicidal then, yes, they probably do want and need attention. If you don't want to hear them "complain" then don't read the question.

Answer 5

No, I don't think that is the case, with people that seriously suffer from depression, weither it is mild or severe. As some one that has suffered with depression I can tell you, one of the worst things about it is trying to gather up the motivation to get things done. I don't know if you can really understand it, unless you have been there. When someone is seriously depressed, your outlook on the future is bleak. It gets to the point where one feels like there is no reason to do anything. Why would you, when nothing and I mean nothing gives you one iota of happiness. It also makes you feel as if nothing you do is going to help make it better and that you are going to be this way the rest of your life. Absolutely everything you have to do, is a struggle. I will try to give you an example that will possibly help you to understand. Everyone has had that one job in life that they just despise. Remember how you used to wake up and dread going into work and how you just could not wait until the day was over? Imagine feeling that way about EVERYTHING. Talking with family and friends, going out or just sitting at home after a long day, relaxing bring no pleasure what so ever. Imagine how bleak your outlook on life would become if you thought that is all you had to look forward to the rest of your life. Depressed causes you to be like that, without a reason or a cause, other than a medical, of course . That is an extreme example of someone with severe depression would feel like. The level of malaise varies with every person, but that isn't the point. The point is, that it makes it very hard for a person to get motivated. Unless, that person has someone close to them who can help, they could possibly never get better and could possibly end up committing suicide. Also, if someone ever says they are contemplating committing suicide, you should take it seriously. No matter how much they say they are not THAT depressed, it is a cry for help. It's their way of saying, may be this person will take me seriously, cause I am at the end of my rope. You say, "You know, it gets very tiring after a short time when you try and give sound advice to those who are in need of it, and just won't take it, and get mad when you don't tell them what they want to hear - that they are okay, and everyone else needs to change." How can you say this? It's almost like you are blaming them for their problem. If you knew anything about depression, and you should if you are offering advice to people as often as you claim, you would know that the things they do, which frustrate you, are caused by depression. Granted, at some point they are the only one that can take initiative, but we should make every effort to push them in the right direction. I can imagine what your advice to them is, from the question you have posted here. I bet you are one of those people who tell them they need to snap themselves out of it, that they should get out more and to just think positive. This is a medical condition. There is something physically wrong with them and short of seeing professionals, nothing is going to help them. You have to realize that although what you are telling them to do seems simple to you, for them it isn't and this is as frustrating for them as it is for you. If it is to much for you, may be you should stop offering your advice. It seems to be making you bitter towards people, who do not deserve to be treated that way.

Answer 6

Depression and mental "lazyness" go hand in glove usually. It takes a lot of effort to kick yourself up the rear and admit your problems/do something about them. You go through a lot of hopeful "if enough people agree with me then I'm fine as I am" feelings before that can happen. For a great deal of people, depression is the only thing they can truly rely on.

It can become frustrating for people looking at it from the outside, but then, solutions are easy to see when you're not stuck in the middle of the problem.

Answer 7

Look, I cant speak 4 others but I can speak for myself Back in 7th grade I started thinking about suicide In 8th grade I actually attempted it I never told anyone bcuz I knew that they would never approve They call us cowardly & selfish yet they dont try 2 help you when you ask them 2 They either ignore u dont believe u laugh @ u or look @ u in pure disdain I cut myself on my arm & my mom noticed The only thing she did is look @ me in disgust & tell me she never wanted 2 c it again So I told her it was an accident shaving my arm & she feigned believing me so she didnt have to deal w/ me After that she never saw it again bcuz instead of cutting my wrist I cut in between my breasts on the skin hidden bneath my bra Once I bcame dpressed I realized that nobody ever cares about u but about the way u appear & if u r anything other than flawless u r unacceptable That is y I keep 2 myself bcuz I know that if I tell them they will do the exact same thing they always do Just not give a sh*t

Answer 8

You emphasis "threaten" suicide. Don't get too comfortable with the idea it is just an empty threat, Maybe the other shoe hasn't fallen yet, but someday you will be "beating yourself up" thinking you should have KNOWN!

I think what you are trying to say is that suicide is often a petty, selfish act to "win the argument", or some such stupidity.

"See?", they say from the grave, "this is why you were in the wrong!"

Don't listen to the enemy, who tries to use it to bring you down.

Their suicide proves nothing, except their own fragile character!

Threatening suicide is a seperate issue from WHY.

Show them that their troubles have better answers. They are trying to solve a temporary problem with a permanent solution (like killing flies with a shot gun in a cartoon).

What ever they say, right or wrong, take some thought, about how to keep them from self destructiion, because it is little consoation that it was crazy and/or stupid. Dead is dead!

Pray they don't get so miserable that they take YOU with them!!!

As we see with suicide bombers, a person who is willing to KILL themselves, will kill others too easily in their "manic depression".

WE all get too sure that they're just "acting", especially when they threaten again and again without doing it ... or not succeeding (yet) suspiciously, as if it was "all an act" ...when suicide itself is "act two".

Suicide victims often grab for glory, trying to hurt you really bad, emotionally or worse.

There is a fine line between harming yourself and harming others, as we see with moms doing post-birth "abortion" murders of their babies!

Suicide victims also grab for glory, by getting into the news (and history books too) by heartlessly comitting a murder-suicide, taking with them their wife and children

...or, if younger, offing their schoolmates

...or a whole plane load of hostages, and take out a couple thousand peaceful business people of all races and religions, in a trade tower in NY!!!

Often suicide is a cry for help.

But too often, it is a CRAZY call for help.

If you think suicide is an unforgivable sin, consider that suicide victims are innocent by reason of insanity.

Do your very best to help them, but guard your heart. They just might do it, despite your best efforts.

I have personal experience with this.

Answer 9

Speaking from the point of view of someone who's previous partner threatened suicide and then also carried out the threat - I tried everything I could to help him, I even spent an hour on the phone to the Samaritans asking them how to help him. I followed their advice and it still didn't stop him. It was very tiring as he was constantly asking for help but never took it. He would not listen to rational advice.

Answer 10

I don't know if they expect everyone else to change for them, but they may just be lazy about stopping the self-harm and/or getting help. Either that or they don't want to. The beautiful thing about human beings is that they can do ANYTHING they want (within reason; you can't go to neptune in 20 minutes). It's willpower that allows us to set our minds to something and DO IT. This generation especially has lost this revelation for some reason or another. The government is blamed, society is blamed, the self-responsibility has been removed from many people's minds. People smoking cigarettes can stop, people on weed can stop, people in debt can stop spending so much BUT ONLY IF THEY WANT TO. Key point: put the onus on the individual to deal with whatever they are going through. Get help along the way, but it is ultimately your responsibility.