Who thinks that Ferrari set McLaren up?

Question

I think whoever it was in McLaren that spread Ferrari data everywhere was being paid by Ferrari to do so.
Remember, Ferrari have been taught how to cheat by Schumacher and Brawn.

Colin and Dragoi, are you seriously suggesting that Schumacher was subject to the same scrutiny as all the other drivers?
Since 1994 the paddock has known that he has got away with all sorts of cr@p that any other driver or team would get thrown out for. Illegal TC, specially blended fuel etc. etc.

The Ferrari data could have been misleading, designed to wrong foot McLaren.

Answer 1

Ferrari set out the honey pot and collected themselves a Coughlan. McLaren reacted when the upper management found out and did what they could to sweep it under the rug (guilty but no punishment) until Alonso and de la Rosa incriminated themselves and McLaren in exchange for immunity because Alonso was upset about Hamilton doing better than him.

Answer 2

Ponderous.

My long and short view of this is simple.

It is wholly irrelevant how the Ferrari data came into the possession of ANYONE within McLaren. What is relevant is that McLaren did not make the judicious decision to immediately inform FOM and the FIA of the sabotage and espionage being attempted by Stepney in giving these documents to McLaren's staff member.

I'm a McLaren fan, but I don't think anyone from McLaren whose name is tied to this thing showed himself to be beyond reproach in his reactions to the matter. Dennis maintained all along their innocence, but yet they clearly used whatever information they gleaned to inform on Ferrari about the movable floors in Australia. And the wing.

The bottom line is that McLaren caused their own undoing by not making the wise choice and immediately reporting Stepney.

Sure, it's possible Ferrari management was complicit in initiating this whole debacle, but it never matters HOW you benefit from illegally gained knowledge, it's THAT you benefit that will get you into trouble every time.

I'm sorely disappointed in McLaren for this loss of sensibility.

That said, I'd still buy a McLaren SLR over a Ferrari, because everyone has a Ferrari out here in California. But if I were going to buy two supercars, I'd definitely also buy a Ferrari.

:-)

Answer 3

The FIA has released that they have found emails between Alonso and Pedro de la Rosa regarding the stolen information.

Hamilton was not aware of these emails.

It's nice to see that hamilton was not involved especially from the point that there still is a possibilty that further action can be taken against McClaren.

Ferrari set up? Possible but i doubt the would have sacraficed Nigel Stepney and i don't think he would have agreed to tarnish his reputation for life regardless of how much they paid him.
However, i think Todt and crew will be loving all this, seeing the arch enemy squirm especially after Michael Schumacher had to had that race winners cup over to big Ron a few weeks ago.

I agree 100% with your last comment, Michael Schumacher won world champinships by cheating, ramming Jacques, ramming Damon and i dont' think for one second that Braun wasn't involved in those decisions.

Ferrari has blatantly cheated for years but got away with it because, well it's ferrari and nobody wants to upset them.

Apparently Todt has got a FIA top job lined up in the near future i can only see things getting worse.
We'll end up with new rules that say all cars that are red get a 2 minute head start.

Answer 4

Ianb
Who has been fined and got a ban this year and maybe next?
oh right,Mclaren. Shumacher a cheat,hahaha,if Schumacher was still racing I can promise you Mclaren would give him a contract and throw Alonso out. when People inside F1 and drivers speak about how great Schumacher was and is.do you think you know better than them? lets see you in a race car..and Ross is well known for his greatness...think before you speak

Answer 5

No. Why would Ferrari risk giving their valuable data to a rival team? It would get McLaren into trouble when people find out (already happened) but at the same time, it would give them an advantage. Ferrari isn't stupid.

Answer 6

You could be right. The whole thing is very fishy. I think Ferrari are more involved than we know. the people who work for F1 teams are highly skilled and they swap between teams all the time as do the drivers, so surely team information is passed on all the time. So if this goes on all the time, why is has suddenly been done via email. Has it been done so there are hard copies of the information ?Alonso may have something to do with this, in my opinion. He is very unhappy with the success of Hamilton... a case of sour grapes?

Answer 7

This I find amazing. Normally, at the first mention of the word 'job', your average Scouser disappears in a cloud of dust. If this is true then it is surely a bold move on Ferrari's part.

Answer 8

the first step ferrari made in all this when they found out what stepney had done was to fire him, and try to prosecute him.

only then did they try to do some damage control by dealing with those whom the info was leaked to, through the official channels of the FIA.

they appealed the decision when the first case was thrown out due to limited evidence of the implementation of the technology, after which ron dennis presented to the FIA more evidence that came to light in an effort to co-operate fully with the investigation.

i do feel sorry for ron, who has been completely betrayed by people within his own team, but its not ferraris fault because one disgruntled idiot from their team went to another idiot in mclaren with illegal information.

also, what about all the whining that mclaren do about ferrari who use everything they can that they percieve to be within the rules, and then mclaren themselves go and do something completely illegal and dangerous;
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/09/07/2026499.htm

we can cry cheating and favouritism as much as we like, but if we examine the facts and proofs, we can see that the treatment and actions of ferrari (and i'm talking teams, not former drivers here) are no better or worse than most teams.

mclaren ran an illegal gearbox. honda a couple of years back ran a car with an illegal fuel tank. the fines and punishments are just as lenient if not more so than anything ferrari has done.

when you have proof of your foundationless allegations then i'll be happy to consider them.

if mclaren just get rid of their cry baby selfish whingey world champion who brought six tenths of a second to the team all by himself, and had questionable email conversations with other members of the team, which is what really did them in, then they'll be doing much better i think.

the fact that he made a deal to give up the evidence and get away without punishment himself really show's his team spirit. he goes crying that anyone who beats him is a cheater, then goes and does things like this, along with blatantly blocking his own team mate. (much worse than what schumacher ever did to him, considering he'll do it to his own team mate!).

"FIA said Thursday it did not penalize McLaren's drivers because they provided evidence in exchange for immunity"

http://www.thestar.com/Sports/article/256796

http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?seriesId=6&id=3019160&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines

sorry. went on a bit of a rant there, but i'm just tired of people trying to blame anyone but mclaren for whats happened here. unfortunate that because of a few people the whole team has to suffer, but i say sue the guilty parties within the team for the damages. and fire alonso and de la rosa for participating in it too.

finally, are you aware that the ferrari employee (stepney) who initially leaked the info to mclaren employee coghlan in the first place is actually facing criminal charges in italy? does that sound like someone who leaked info based on team orders?

also, stepney and coghlan both approached honda looking for a job, with the info. (honda did the right thing and refused the first hint of any inpropriety, and reported it when it became apparent that something bigger was afoot).

Answer 9

Mr Stepney is the subject of CRIMINAL prosecution in Italy. . We must wait to see what the Italian judiciary system have to say and do with Mr. Stepney.
Punishment is not so strong, McLaren is GUILTY I repeat for the people who still haven't understood that, McLaren is GUILTY, so Alonso or Hamilton will win the championsip with an ILLEGAL car, in a incorrect, deceiver team

for the blind one i answer with that...
http://put.edidomus.it/auto/mondoauto/attualita/pdf/McLaren13sett.pdf
http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/17844641__WMSC_Decision_130907.pdf

that's ridicuolous and scandalous, like the blind one who still are funs of mclaren
is that sport? is that good for sport? many compliments....

Answer 10

Corruption comes to mind. Get rid of McLaren and then Ferrari win the constructor championship by fair means or foul