Was America aware that there were German U boats in the Hudson bay during WW2?

Question

I was told by a Canadian who was a child living in a fishing village at the time of the second world war. She told me that German U boats would dock at villages along the Hudson and you would often see the crew walking around the village or staying on shore leave. She said the villagers did not object and it was all quite friendly. I am surprised that they were able to get so close to America.

For those that doubt the story - I was told by the matron of a nursing home where I worked as an aid in the early 80's, she was a fully qualified psychiatric/general nurse in her 50's from a village or settlement on the hudson bay. The nursing home was in British Columbia, Canada where I lived at the time. The owner of the home was an elderly German couple and their son. I don't think this woman would have lied about this.

Answer 1

There is no evidence in any War History on both sides of the Atlantic of thios ever happening. There are no "villages: on Hudson Bay where this could have happened. Settlements like Churchill manitoba, and Moose Factory Ontario were well garrisoned. Churchill was an important port in its own right.

This story comes from the plot of a 1941 Movie called The 49th parallel which is about a German UBoat being sunk in Hudson's bay and its crew trying to escape from Canada ( None made it) Here is a link http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0033627/

The only documented case of a German UBoat landing in North America is that of U537 which spent 48 hours off the coast of Baffin Island in October 1943 setting up an automatic weather beacon. They were not detected and certainly did not go about visiting villages. Here is a link to that story:

http://www.pinetreeline.org/other/other8/other8ap.html

Answer 2

Stranger things have happened during war. Indeed it is a fact that U Boats where known to penetrate the smaller communities around the Americas, including Canada and go ashore to obtain supplies or trophy's if they where able to. There are reports of the long range boats and crews cominging into contact with settlements in the Carribean, South American states, Canada and the US. It should be remembered that most of the Countries and Islands of the American Continents where either not at war with Germany until 1945 or did not have a defense force capable of repelling even a handful of Kreigsmarine sailors.
As for the US doing something about the U Boats when they did enter the war, the did nothing for a number of months until the coast trade was so disrupted by the 'second happy hour' sweep of the Atlantic Seaboard. They did not even blackout there towns, cities, roads and the Germans had a fully illuminated scene of some lovely fat targets thanks to the incompetance of there administration. It was not until 1942 and the experienced Royal Navy Officers telling the Americans how to defeat the U Boats so close to home, that things changed.

Answer 3

Two American merchant ships were certainly sunk by German U-boats before the attack on Pearl Harbour, so the relative proximity to US waters is possible.

I had not heard of the Germans landing, but I had heard that the Germans liked to guess the type of American car they were looking at by looking at the headlights on the coast roads when they surfaced at night.

The German U-boats did significant damage to US shipping when war was declared which might suggest prior knowledge of the local area.

Also during the period of neutrality it is possible that they could be treated as little different from the fishing boats that would call in at port after fishing the Grand Banks.

However, on the whole I would think it is extremely unlikely that they actually landed, a U-boat was a very significant weapon of war at that point in time. In the event of an acident that lead to the US recovering a U-boat it would have been a serious danger to Germany so I'm sure it would not be allowed.

Answer 4

I think they are confusing the gulf of St. Lawrence and Hudson Bay (or the Hudson River - no where near Hudson Bay). Hudson Bay is pretty far North, for the most part sparsely populated (still) even less populated 65 or so years ago. I would have been very easy to come ashore in many places and evade detection. And while it would be possible to land there why would a U-Boat be there? I doubt they would have travelled the thousands of extra miles to get to Hudson's Bay since there little of military significance there. (And for much of the year it would have been impenetrable due to ice) These are diesel subs so they could not travel that long submerged.

As for U-Boats in the Gulf of St. Lawrence - yes they were very aware of U-Boats there.

http://198.103.134.2/clients/sub.cfm?source=history/other/sea/secondlawrence

I don't think they are lying to you, just confused. As for German U-Boat crews coming ashore. It may have happened on rare occasions but walking around in the open - I doubt it.

Answer 5

Remember, America didn't enter the war initially. I am suprised that U Boats would dock in Hudson Bay as Canada declared war on September 11th, just 8 days after Britain, France, Australia and New Zealand on the 3rd September 1939.

Answer 6

Lancej0hns0n is not quite correct to suggest that the Allied (really, British) mastery of the German naval encryption codes allowed the Americans to know where all the U-boats were. When the U.S. first entered the war in earnest, the Germans ran riot up and down the East Coast and in the Gulf of Mexico, sinking ships with impunity. The Americans had no clue where the subs were, and they did not use a convoy system, and they didn't even enforce blackouts of coastal cities. So the U-boats could easily spot lone freighters and tankers silhouetted against, say, Charleston at night and pick them off with no trouble whatsoever.

Once Enigma was broken, finding the wolf packs was indeed easier, and a combination of other factors (convoys, radar, air patrols, massive numbers of escort warships including escort carriers) essentially ended the Battle of the Atlantic by late 1943.

Answer 7

America did not enter the war until she was attacked at Pearl Harbor by the Imperial Japanese Navy and only then because Adolf Hitler in a moment of mad rage declared war on the United States.

It does not surprise me that German U-Boats and their crews stayed in Hudson's Bay and visited villages there. Their task was to attack shipping in the Atlantic, which is exactly what they were doing and taking advantage of shore leave etc.

Answer 8

I agree with Ted K, this sounds like fantasy or a rehash of the plot of the 49th parallel.

To correct the suggestion of some of the posts above, Canada as a dominion in the British Empire was at war with Germany since 1939. The Canadian Merchant Navy was heavily involved in the Atlantic convoys right from the beginning and inevitably many Canadians were killed by the U boats. I somewhat doubt that they would have been hospitable to a U boat crew.

Answer 9

we have a few conflicting answers here based on poor reading....the questioner asked about Hudson's Bay, which is about 1200 sea miles from the Hudson River in New York.......geeeeeeez!

Second read the post about the movie.......

third, look at a map of where Hudson's Bay is......it is no where near the Atlantic convoy lanes that ran from Halifax to England......while the Germans did send one mission to Baffin Island to set up a weather station, the idea that they would divert a U-boat another 600 miles away from the scene of the action is not bloody likely.

Answer 10

actually german u-boats got a lot closer than hudson bay - there were some reports of u-boats in the hudson river - that's right new york city - i'm not sure if they were ever substantiated - but as we could break the german encryption codes - we knew where every german naval vessel was - the problem is that we really couldn't do anything about it without making it obvious that we could break their encryption