Why is taking steroids less of a crime in baseball than gambling? If Pete Rose is out of the Hall of Fame?

Question

for good, then so should Barry Bonds and all of the future roiders coming up for possible enshinement the next 10 years, i.e. Bagwell, Biggio, Sosa, McGwire, Canseco, Palmeiro, Clemens (yes, Roger juiced people), the list goes on. Everyone talks about how gambling is just the end all be all top cardinal sin of baseball, and I'm not saying it's good, but let's get real people. Pete Rose gambled on baseball after he was retired. That shouldn't have an affect on any of his playing stats during his 24 year career from 1963-1986. And even if he did place a bet on baseball when he played, would that have helped him get another hit, on his way too becoming the all time hits leader? NO, it wouldn't of. On the other hand, Barry Bonds and all the roiders used a sustance that helped their power, hand-eye coordination, stamina, mental clarity, and so on, and helped to overly inflate their statistics. What they did is far worse than what Pete Rose did. And even if steroids were "legal" at

the time, that still doesn't make it right. What Bonds, McGwire and Sosa and everyone else did, was they cheated the fans, and the integrity of the sport and in the end, they messed up the record books and are surpassing clean players such as Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Babe Ruth, and so on. Pete Rose's gambling problems happened after he had retired, those were the years that were investigated into - 1987-1989, and should have no bearing on his playing career. Rose in - Bonds - out.

Answer 1

Blame it on the entire league (starting from the top down) - they tried to be more attractive with antics like the "long ball" and now MLB is a joke. Pete Rose should be in the HoF without a question. Honestly, who cares if he gambled? As Krusty the Klown said, "Is it a crime to bet on sporting events (in other words, gamble)?!" Only in America, my friends...

Answer 2

First off, I don't think that it is "less of a crime". Rafeal Palmeiro is the only player who may have had a chance at the Hall test positive. Perhaps Selig should announce that Palmeiro is banned because of his positive test. All your other "suspects" have never tested positive so we can be reasonable certain that they didn't use steroids after they were banned. As far as whether any of them used them before the ban, we can dislike it, but I don't think we should penalize them (especially since it can't be proven). The spitball was made illegal around 1920. Plenty of pitchers used it before then, even HOFers. I think using something legal can't be penalized no matter how much we are against it or how stupid it is for the individual using it is.

There is one difference. Gambling is illegal, steroids weren't until recently. Another difference is the level of effort put forth. By all accounts the steroid user is trying to gain an advantage to do better. The gambler may not be. It is easier for a player to "let up" or make an error and lose on the field but gain in the betting world. That is why gambling was made illegal, because it cheated the team owner and fellow players (probably in that order).

Having said that: I support Rose in the HOF, Shoeless Joe Jackson, and McGwire too. They were great talents that really defined the game during their particular eras.

PS. Babe Ruth blatantly used an illegal substance during his last year in Boston and through most of his Yankee career. It wasn't until Prohibition was repealed in 1933 that the Babe ended his outlaw ways.

Answer 3

Currently it's kind of like comparing an apple to a rose they may both be sweet but they're different species. At the time gambling on the sport you were involved with, in this case baseball, was banishment from the sport for life because it was provable. Until recently steroids weren't even tested for, but MLB has the toughest penalties for steroid use despite the difficulty in proving intentional or accidental. Due to the difficulty in proving steroid use and why the current penalties are fair, but in order to get the ban overturned on Pete Rose it would take a good number of signatures and a sane commissioner to get it done.

Answer 4

In my opinion, the worst crimes in baseball are, from least to most severe, with an example:

Level 1. Arguing calls with an umpire (Take your pick)
Level 2. Putting an illegal substance on a bat or ball (George Brett Pine Tar Incident, though I know that the umps were wrong and that all turned out well in the end... Brett was not a criminal.)
Level 3. Physically touching or bumping an umpire (Lou Pinella)
Level 4. Making harmless, low bets on baseball. And only betting.
Level 5. Making larger bets on baseball. And again, only betting. (Petey Rose)
Level 6. Throwing balls or any other equipment at a player with an intent to hurt (Closest is the Nationals/Phillies incident, even though that wasn't meant.)/Giving any obscene gestures. (Danny Graves)
Level 7. Fighting with other players (Pick a brawl, my favorite was Barret/Pierzynski last year in Chicago)
Level 8. Using equipment to physically harm another player (Juan Marichal)
Level 9. Attacking fans in the stands (a la Ron Artest, only in MLB)
Level 10. Cheating by player enhancement a.k.a. STEROIDS (Barry Bonds, Raffy Palmeiro, Mark Mc, Hosey, and possibly Swingin' Sammy. NOT, and I repeat NOT, Jeff Bagwell or Craig "Stick" Biggio. And how DARE you accuse Rog Clemens of juicing people, you no good SOB!)
Level 11 (The Unforgivable Act) Participating or having knowledge in the throwing of any game or series. (The Chicago Black Sox)

Anything level 10 and above gets you an automatic ticket out of the HOF, while 8 and 9 hurt your chances a hell of a lot. Anything else, and you are pretty much OK for the time being, unless you get 6 or 7 too many times.

With that, Rose is in, Bonds is out, and that is my final decision.

Answer 5

The big difference between the two is that steroid users are trying to gain a competitive advantage and help their team win, along with padding their stats and making more money. Gambling on games that you play in or manage is a completely different story. I don't care what he says, Rose managed differently from night to night depending on whether or not he bet on the Reds. That attacks the integrity of the game to a much greater extent than steroid use ever could.

Answer 6

Gambling and cheating are equally horrible crimes to baseball. Either erodes the integrity for the game’s fans.

Cheating is cheating.

In fact, yank notorious spitball pitcher Gaylord Perry out of the Hall of Fame today — for the same reason.

On a sidenote, Rose SHOULD be in the Hall of Fame just for his playing achievements. Feel free to put on the plaque that he brought shame to his legacy with gambling as a manager.

Answer 7

F-. Back to kindergarten.

Rose broke a rule -- and did so repeatedly -- with full knowledge of the defined sanctions.

There were no rules* against steroids or HGH or Chemical X prior to 2003. No rules, no rulebreaking.

And here is demonstrated complete ignorance of WHY those rules were enacted. There are reasons why internal gambling is really, really, really bad, whereas steroid abuse, while not very nice, is not really as bad as gambling. (I have found that explaining this is pointless, as those most in need of the explanations are stone deaf to rational discussion, and so will not bother here.)

Rose is a bad penny; people just cannot get rid of him.

* Yeah, I know of Vincent's 1991 edict. It was utterly unenforceable, and toothless since it was not commonly negotiated with the MLBPA. The 2003 amendment to the CBA, was.

Answer 8

Pete Rose bet on his own team. Being a manager he has a lot of control over how well his team does. He cant make them win games but he sure could make them lose.

Like it or not steroids were legal or at least untested for years in baseball.

As a player Rose could be in there. He has the numbers but his gambling as a manager overshadows it.

Answer 9

I totally agree with you. PEDs should merit a lifetime ban. It won't happen, but it should. Selig is a whimpy old man and the Player's Union cares for the fans like Hitler cared for the Goldfarbs, so we have to put up with an idiotic situation. It appears that, oh, about once every 100 years something comes up that calls for the ban. Betting, and now steroids. Gee, that's a list of two whole things.
But, until Selig grows testes and until the Player's Union gets the idea that fair can include the players having a little responsibility, we have to allow Bonds' and the others spitting on the fans and the game.

Answer 10

Criminally speaking, they're both crimes. Period.

But as far as the integrity of the game, gambling is far worse.
Players can take all the 'roids they want; they still have to hit the ball. If anything, it's players cheating because they're TRYING.

Which is why gambling is worse. Because that's most often going to be players NOT TRYING, or trying to lose to ensure the easy buck.
And for those who think, "What if he bets on his own team to win? Then they'll be trying to win either way." I say this: Guys who are into gambling that deeply aren't going to roll the dice and see what happens; they're going to go for as sure a thing as possible. And if your leaving a pitcher in one inning too long, or pinch-hitting for someone at just such a time, helps you guarantee you'll lose and thus earn you a big score, you're going to go for it.