I Think...Therefore, I Am -- But What If I'm Not Thinking?

Question

Like in a coma...

My friend watches this reality coma show on television...and I caught a glimpse of it when I was at his house the other day. The doctor was saying, they allow brain trauma patients two weeks to show signs of brain activity before calling it quits. In other words...some patients (or the ones on the show) showed no signs of brain activity at all, for up to two weeks. Astoundingly, these patients otherwise seem alive; which I can only image how hard that must be for the family. Anyway, so this show got me thinking on this idea about thinking...

Answer 1

Then someonelse is asking your questions for you.

(And there was much laughter.)

I repeat Spinoza by saying "Ambulo ergo Sum", I walk therefore I am, but; that really does not bring you any closer to deciding what to do about the person who does nothing, which is pretty much dead in the eyes of men.

So what will help here?

I am guessing the theory of ultimate failure that once you finish with anything it suddenly becomes flawed or imperfect.

Take for example the race for the homerun title. Barry Bonds is close to setting the all time record but there are those who argue that he does not deserve the title because he used steroids. Others argue that Babe Ruth did not deserve it because he never played against black players. Some say Hank Aaron played in smaller ball parks. The point is that when their careers are over or the tile is achieved people will always be there to point fingers and say look at the flaws in what was done.

Your life is the same way. When you are dead, and people have the opportunity to decide who or what you were for you, and their thoughts of you supercede your own. They become your existence.

(Bet you wish you hadn't left Timmy's habitrail under the Christmas tree unguarded now.)

The point of Descartes was not that your ability to think proves your existence, but rather; your thoughts prove your existence. They are your footprints in the sand of time. The bigger your thoughts the more people believe that you "truly existed".

Of course, to paraphrase Richard Bach in his novel "Illusions", "Everything in this... could be wrong." People think 755 is the all time homerun record when Josh Gibson hit over 900 homeruns in his career. Einstein is credited with the thought E=mc^2 but dit he really come up with it or was he really just the first person to prove it?

I can be gone in the touch of a key stroke and you are all that remains of me. Think about it."Cogite ergo sum" - You think therefore I am.

Answer 2

Descartes saw the potential loophole in his axiomatic statement "cogito ergo sum," and therefore elaborated that even if he actively doubts his existence, the very act of doubting requires him, in some form, to exist. One cannot doubt one's existence without thereby establishing that very existence. As far as a coma goes, scientific studies have shown that limited brain activity does occur in coma patients, though what the activity signifies is still somewhat a mystery, as often coma patients remember nothing of their time in the coma. While your proposition does seem to throw a wrench in Descartes' postulate it is true that it is an argument skewed between philosophical conjecture and scientific reality, in that the "cogito" is stated during a period of philosophical reflection. Descartes meant that at any point when one analyzes one's own existence, whether attempting to affirm or deny, that very act of analysis proves the existence.

Answer 3

Yep, pretty much, in a coma. What Descartes started with was "je doubt de tout" - I doubt everything - to the level of absurdity - in order to find one single truth. At that point he realized the only thing he knew for sure is that he was thinking. It's quite simple, really.

If you try to extend that to humanity, not thinking makes one form prejudices which lead to wars (like the one in Iraq right now), which leads to killing/no longer being. This is just an application of his reasoning, which, is obviously timeless and not timely.

Answer 4

Even those in a coma are thinking, they just are not conscious of our definition of thinking.

I know when my father was in a coma, they warned me to be very careful of what I said for he most likely was hearing every word and therefore only say things that were positive. No one know what the sub -conscious is really all about, especially those of us that only live in the present state consciousness.

Answer 5

Honestly I don't think you ever stop thinking. Not even in a coma. People in a coma are in a dream state. I believe they can still take things in so you have to be careful what you say to them or around them in that unconscious state. You are always thinking unless you experience brain death in which case you are not really alive anyway.

Answer 6

You may still think in a coma.. who knows, you may experience REM and all sorts of other things.
however, to play devils advocate: by not thinking you contrast the ability "to think;" your abstaining from the activity does NOT make the activity go away. It should still reason out that you "ARE."
But, that wasn't Descartes' point in that particular argument.
fun question

Answer 7

What's with you and Descartes? OK. Now that that is out of the way. I believe that "I think" is not a un-doubtable basis for an ontology to be built on. Thinking does not necessitate being, merely that there is thought.

Answer 8

Empirical evidence in the form of giving wrong answers suggests that we are thinking. If we all gave the same answers I would agree.

The other argument I would use is two people with identical information and data giving opposing answers.

Answer 9

It's possible, but I as long as I can remember I have thought.

Rene Descartes was just another seeker of wisdom trying to figure out his world.

Answer 10

"I think therefore I am."

I don't think the quote refers to the actual scientifically described process of thinking. It actually refers to the attitude and will of humans to research life.

It views things from a metaphorical perspective.When you say 'I think' you confirm your existence in parameters of consciousness. It's like saying 'I seek.' From the quote's perspective, thinking is the inner spark that keeps you in a continuous cycle of searching and defines you as a seeker. Therefore, you only exist if you're a thinker = seeker. Why does the quote use the nature of a seeker to confirm existence? Because seeking means being connected to your life, to your environment, to your surroundings. You seek therefore you are fully implied in your surroundings. You look at your surroundings and question their nature, you start pondering - that's what seeking is all about. Seeking and pondering are ways of acknowledging your surroundings. When you acknowledge your environment and become aware of your life surroundings through seeking them / thinking about them ... you are existent.