Did the Roman Empire really finish around 476 CE?

Question

Or just put on the togs of the Catholic Church?

Hitler dreamed of ruling for a millenium, could it be said the Romans surpassed his dream? The Catholic Church remained highly influential until the 18thC.

Cracked up laughing Amberley, great answer!!!

Ooops, think i'd better change part of the previous details to *Hitler dreamed of creating an Aryan empire that would last for a millenium.* He himself would have been a li'l past it by then. =)

I do mean the Catholic church in particular oldknowall, it's political influence was massive. Good answer. =)

Another good answer and very true rdenig-male, but the Catholic Church ruled from Rome apart from the Avignon period. That's what i'm getting at.

The ideology of the Catholic church was influenced directly by Roman Empire John, and Rome was always the *spiritual* home of the empire, so to speak. It continued to be a massive cultural and ideological centre, even King Alfred went to Rome for education in the 9th C.

Wasn't aware of the sweet Rev Paisley saying similar, more than him think it tho. =)

A lot of posters are missing the point of my question, i probably could have explained it better.

I'm well aware of the Western/Eastern division of Empire but Byzantium *Constantinople* was heavily influenced by other cultures, definitely not truly Roman. Part of the reason Constantine made it his capital was to escape the influence of the Pope. *He wasn't the Pope himself as some think* The Catholic church, based in Rome strongly influenced by WESTERN Roman empire proceeded to gain tremendous political stature.

Very good answer booklady, the Catholic church was highly political, clearly didn't believe Jesus's words to *let them be no part of the world* =)

Just thinking of so many major events influenced by the Church of Rome. Too numerous to post, mentioning Papal legitimacy for William the Conqueror's invasion of England and European settlement of the Americas will suffice.

Excellent answer carlos_frolich esa. I have been a li'l frustrated by so many worthy but purely chronicle stylee answers when i asked a speculative question. Cheers. =)

Loved your answer too bearstirringfrom cave. =)

Think this post is a dead parrot now, time to close it.

Some interesting answers, particularly loved Amberley's surrealism, Old Know All's wit and Carlos's big pic wisdom. =)

Answer 1

You are on target - - - the Roman Empire Lived on and is Still a Part of American Culture though the Evangelicals established their Primacy and have continued to grow Strong.

Actually when one considers that South America and France as well as Spain & Portugual & Italy are largely Catholic, well let it just be said that the Roman Empire is alive and well...

Pax---------------

Pax Romanus

Answer 2

I'll assume you mean the western half of the Roman empire, ie the bit that had been ruled from Rome rather than Constantinople.

The last emperor in the West was deposed in 476, but the administrative structure that had been used to rule the empire was still there. The empire didn't so much fall as fizzle out.

The question is, did the Church take over? I don't think so, not in the sense that it 'ruled' Europe in the same way. The next few centuries were too complicated for that. Yes, both empire and church were based in Rome (except for the period when you had a Pope in Avignon), but the Pope didn't have imperial authority. The Holy Roman Empire was created to try and resurrect the concept - but a) many parts of what had been the Roman empire weren't under the control of the Holy Roman Emperor (it was mainly what is now Germany), b) an awful lot of people who weren't in the church had an influence on who got the job of emperor, and c) ooccasionally the Pope and the Holy Roman Emperor were on opposite sides.

As far as most of Europe was concerned, the Pope had political influence, not direct power. Rulers could defy Papal authority and did. Whether they were successful or not depended on how good a politician they were, and how good the current Pope was.

The emperors in the east did surpass Hitler's millennium ambition, though. The first emperor to rule from Byzantium/Constantinople was Constantine I, who moved the imperial capital there in 330. The empire lasted until the fall of Constantinople in 1453.

Answer 3

No. The Western roman empire ended than but there is the Byzantine empire (until 1453 when fallen under Ottoman power), which inherited the culture and the traditions of the empire of Rome. The one side of the separation was the new Orthodox Church,by which emperor Constantine wanted to avoid the influence of the Pope.While the Catholic church stayed higher than the "Caesar" the church of Constantinople allowed the power of secular authority. Of course there were attempts to use the formal glory of the Roman empire to gain prestige : Charles The Great was pronounced Emperor of Rome at 800 CE,than the Saint Roman-German Empire - there comes the later idea of the reunites of Germany, resulting even in the title of the ruler - "Kaiser"="Caesar" - that's why Hitler is so obsessed about the roman inheritance idea... The story of the Byzantine empire is incredible and very neglected by the western historians.Even with the adopted as official language the Greek and the many transformations in law and culture,even with the struggle between the Catholic and the Orthodox Churches the Byzantines believed that they were the inheritors of Rome. So officially the Roman empire has fallen 1453.Do not forget that the Catholic Church was an anti-state organization at its formation, what formed later was not part of the Empire,not a state (though the Vatican is virtually) and it was the dominant political power for centuries to come.

Answer 4

If you count the Eastern empire, the Roman Empire lasted until the fall of Constantinople in 1453. The Byzantines considered themselves Romans. Christianity wasn't a big part of the Western Empire until around 300 CE.

Answer 5

Well, Maenad, it was only the Western remnant of the Roman Empire which collapsed in the 5th century. The Empire had changed its base long before from Rome to Constantinople. It lasted for a further 1,000 years. Only the Rev Ian Paisley, Irish nutter of our day, thinks that the Catholic Church 'put on the togs of the Roman Empire'. The Catholic Church remained influential for a lot longer than the 18th century.

Answer 6

The Western Roman Empire was destroyed circa 476CE. However, the Eastern Empire based in Constantinople/Byzantium lasted another 1000 years until the 15th century CE, although its actual empire and area of influence gradually contracted over those years. So, yes, it is arguable that the Roman Empire surpassed Hitler's idea of 'a thousand year Reich'.The Roman Catholic Church adopted some of the administrative trappings of the Western Empire - for example the diocesan system was derived from Roman administrative areas which used the same name

Answer 7

Any particular Roman Empire? Rome fell in 476AD, but Attilla had very liberal views about religion. In areas where the Catholics and the Gnostics were in dispute, he built churches so they could have one each. The Bysantine Empire carried on for a few hundred more years. Then we had the German version called the Holy Roman Empire (not holy, not Roman and not an Empire). That chugged along in one form or another until Luther's reformation caused the German states to fall out with each other.

The Catholic Church remains the largest organisation in the world. Roughly a third of the world's population are at least nominally Catholic.

Answer 8

Positivism influence. Ocident uses to see everything as white and black. No margin for tones.

End date is by far centuries until complete colapse of reminiscences and assimilation through other empires
Egypt dynasties and Chinese had longer empires as a consolidade culture than Roman..... but jewish have their record. Since when they come from Yemen - before the 13 tribes, not so much of their culture, habits and religion changed.

Considering Europe, Catholic Church - still rulling but more subtle.

...but considering North and Central Africa and MiddleEast Muslim rulled until nowadays, but most impressivelly till close to XVI.

Answer 9

Hitlers brief reign of terror, about 15 years, was nothing compared to the time of the Roman Empire. The Romans surpassed Hitler many many times over in the scale of their conquest and in the duration of their empire.

Answer 10

The Roman Empire did end in 476 CE.
They closed the whole thing down on April 12th at 4:15 PM.
Afterward, they had a huge clearance sale.
I got some cool togas, leather sandals, and a Nubian slave!

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