Do You Believe Our Public Education System Works ?

Question

I don't believe it has worked for more than 30 years . Whether it's during a Republican administration or a Democrat Administration .

So my question to you is this. . .. . . WHY ? . . Why doesn't it work anymore ? What's different from the past ?

I think it's the result of many things including and foremost , the liberal teaching ideology . Not enough or any personal responsibility for anything . No corporal punishment . No instant punishment . The notion that we must accept and understand everybody . And the big one. . . . . . The removal of God from our schools . The Christian God that is .

Now I'm sure some of you will disagree and others will agree , so put into words exactly what you think is responsible . Unless of course you think it's working , but if you do , then you must understand that many if not most can provide evidence that it's not .

Chi Guy - How can you believe both ? A Great institution and in total disarray ?
And btw , I know firsthand about the Chicago Public School system and if you're referring to that , you're dead wrong . And 1 more thing . I just now watched a report about how Chicago's system is in ruins . 33 students have been murdered IN SCHOOL , THIS YEAR . 22 by guns . Great institution huh ?

Deep Thought - I agree and wanted to include that , but my question was getting lengthy .

Charlie - Your district may be 1 exception , but not because of graduation rates . Graduation rates are no indication that anything was taught or learned . Maybe so in yours , but not for that reason .

Chi Guy - I agree on the family thing , but the rest is self-contradictory . (is self-contradictory even a word ? )

Answer 1

I agree with you.

I think the hijacking of the educational system by modern liberals to push their world views and agendas is to blame for the educational system's failure.

I also think the break-down of the family unit also is to blame. So I guess I would say it goes back to a loss of decency, morals, and values that our society has suffered.

The modern liberal ideology of being mindlessly indiscriminate; teaching kids that being indiscriminate is a moral imperative, teaching kids to throw out rational thought has had ramifications in the public school system.

Why do private religious school graduate more kids each year and more kids that go on to successful college programs and in turn have successful careers??? I think it's got a lot to do with faith-based education, teaching kids responsibility, and Godly principles applied to daily life.


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Late edit:
People READ the Constitution. READ the Declaration of Independence. READ the writings of our founding fathers. This country was founded on Judeo-Christian values. Meaning God does have a place in this society and in our Government and how we run things here.

Take a glance at a dollar or penny. It doesn't say "In A Higher Being Whom You May or May Not Choose to Acknowledge" It reads: "In God We Trust".


Of course we have freedom of religion. Of course there is a place to go to worship and that is outside the Government. But this country was founded on the belief in God and His Commandments. Judeo-Christian values people!

Answer 2

I think it all depends on where you live. In the larger cities things may not be so good but better in smaller towns. The smaller towns have lower student populations so you get more one on one between the teacher and pupil. And less criminal influence in the smaller towns as well . Then thats not to say they don't have there problems or percieved problems. I feel that discipline has gone down hill in the last twenty years or so and I would like to see improvement there. The teaching methods have improved though since I was in school and that's good. Students do seem to do better on average here compared to the rest of the nation. It is OK for students to pray if they want and the Pledge of Alligence is said everyday at the start of class with the words "one nation under God" included. Students are not encouraged to be tolerant of bad behaivor and values. Just report it to an adult is all. I think you know what I mean on that. There has been a big push to keep the kids away from tobacco, alcohol and drugs for a long time now and that is good. The biggest problem maybe underage drinking but that has been going on for the last 60 years or so if not longer. I know I will never forget my senoir keg. What a night that was. I'm not trying to say that underage drinking is OK but it does happen. Punishment is severe for those who are caught giving alcohol to those who are underage. This is Montana and it seems to be part of the culture. Where I live now is one of the best places that I have known for raising children and I would only be committing a grave mistake by moving to a larger city and enrolling my children in the public school systems you find there. I think that we are just more of the "old school" way. You have to do the work on your own without the use of things like calculators and such but at the same time very modern and up to date. So I think that I will stay in small town USA. Montana is the last best place.

Answer 3

I really don't think it matters on the federal government because in US the public education system is really controlled at the state and local level. Some states fund education adequately while others do no. Here in Ohio the Ohio Supreme Court has ruled against the current funding source which is a combination state and local thus local districts with greater funding are better equipped to meet the needs of their students while the big city districts really are not. We vote on the millage (tax rate) that goes to our local district so in some districts there has been no increase for year. I do blame the school unions for the problems in many states and in the big city districts this huge bureaucracy they want to create between teachers and top administration.

Answer 4

you have it right on just about every count. its not working.
the kids have control of schools and their parents. schools are now responsible for teaching kids everything from etiquette to how to wipe their noses. as of late, the BIG problem is the inundation of non english speakers into the system and they are usually illiterate in both of their home language and english. american schools are teaching class in full spanish....text books, bulletin boards, the dominant language in the classroom. so much so that english speaking students are fluent in spanish when they hit 2nd or 3rd grade. surely this will work for the non english if we teach them in english.........TEACH THEM IN ENGLISH! why do we waste money on non english text books?

because of no child left behind teachers teach a test. no longer are science and social studies taught. p.e. is maybe 40 minutes a week. kids are taught by their parents that the teacher is wrong and that if they are not making satisfactory progress, there mus be something wrong with the teacher. god forbid that parents and students be held accountable for anything.

jr/high school history classes are full of revisionist history and kids have no idea of what a great country america is. for gods sake, its hard to find a flag in a classroom, let alone find any that still say the pledge.

i was reading the other day that there has been a large upsurge in history books in book stores. they say because people what to learn about the history, what went before. i agree with that, but i would like to add that they are starting to have this new found interest because of what they were sadly lacking in their education. there are just so many things wrong and it will take a long time to fix, if it ever is repaired, with our education. all the money goes to administration and what little tax money goes to the schools is never enough, especially in inner city schools. a sad state of affairs...

here in california, 48% of the state budget goes to education.

Answer 5

I believe there are several reasons for this...
1. We have become families of 2 working parents. If the parents are always gone, who's supervising childs education?
2. Teachers are getting younger and younger, with that they lack maturity. When I was in Highschool 15yrs ago, I had a teacher literally only 22yrs of age. Who stated "Its not my job to make sure you learn the material, its my job to present it to you and expect you to make it interesting".
Its that kind of "teaching" that lets everybody down.
3. Education has taken the back burner to sports, work, extra-curricular activities etc...
4. Over crowding and time restraints
5. Passing before students are ready

The BEST teacher I ever had was in 8th grade, she REFUSED to push forward on any subject until the entire class got what was needed. Including study partners, rewards, extra tutoring, ANYTHING to get the job done.
She believed extra perspective can fix any situation.

I don't know that I agree that the removal of God from school is responsible for education problems, although I do believe any religion (not just christianity) should be allowed for the individual child if desired.
But if the Parents aren't dedicated to a childs education, then the public school system means nothing.

Answer 6

Earnest,

Using your premise that the system is broken, I would say the larger reason it doesn't work is the way school are use nowadays. Parents tend to just drop their students off at school and expect that the school will essentially raise them, teaching them the three Rs, some social studies a little science and a little morality on the side.

There are several parents that I could point to anecdotally but parents tend to disconnect from their children and use the school as a warehouse of sorts. And even when they arew back in their care, parents tend to use tools like the TV and the Wii to act as surrogate guardians, further neglecting the parent's role in their children's education.

My children are gifted but I also sit with them an hour a day and work on their class assignments. If every parent did that, my children would be average I guess but the system would work again.

Answer 7

It hasn't been broken quite that long but it is close. There is a school that was shown on one of the Prime Time or 60 Minutes sometime in the last year. I wish I could remember the name of it. They didn't teach to a test, younger classes still memorized the "times tables", no calculators, a list of required reading for all grade levels including the classics, generally a back to the basics teaching. Having the children 'think" and develop the cognitive capabilities they will need in the real world. They didn't have computers to do research, calculators in the classroom, and other assorted things that are "needed" today. The interview went on to discuss if these kids were at a disadvantage graduating High School without all the computer training and modern methods. A business man who hired summer interns hired a couple of these bright graduates. His comments were that they could pick up the functions of the software faster, the objective of the project, and put it all together much better than the student who had computers in the classroom. He would hire them over other graduates! Something to be said for the way we were taught. The other students were taught to take a specific test. I'd love to send my children there.

Somehow to get federal money there had to be a way to tell if students were improving and schools were meeting academic requirements - "let's have some tests!" One or two at certain stages in the educational development were not too bad. In Ohio, this year it has gotten to the point were they are doing at least two topics every year all the way down to Kindergarten! How stupid is that! Of course this state's supreme court declared the state funding unconsitutional and the state government can't get it fixed. I've lost count how many years it has been, so all the small cities and townships pay our property taxes which include money for our schools. So, if the school tax levy doesn't pass, that school district has no additional money. Who suffers - the children.

I don't remember much about having God in school or not when I was younger. There never was a big to-do over it. But we did stand tall everyday and say the Pledge of Allegiance. We sang songs about the free and the brave, America the Beautiful, and others. How many of today's kids know any of these songs or have that instilled pride in this country, other than from their parents. We had a standardized test. It was the IOWA Basic Skills Test but that let the teacher's know how well we were doing overall including our ability to think through problems. Where has physical education gone? Is is any wonder these kids are out of shape and overweight? I believe in the three R's and music, physical education, and the other classes that round out a person for living in the world. Someone thought they had a better mouse trap, but no one wanted to admitt it wasn't working and step back to what did work. Instead it just got band-aid over band-aid to where now it doesn't have a cohesive connection to anything about teaching. There are times that improvement is good and there are times when something isn't working that you step back to what was working. This was one to step back.

Then there is the respect factor. Besides the fact that no-one wants to take responsibility for anything they do, and this isn't just the younger generation now. Nor the liberal ideology (my ex always blamed someone else and he is a conservative Republican). Somewhere, somehow, we decided that teachers had no right to control students in their classroom. Parents became 'sue' happy and on television saying how the school wronged their child. Sorry. I don't buy it. Teachers should be given the respect they deserve, should be allowed to control their class, and should not have to put up with abuse because it is only "abuse" when it involves the child. I have watched some of these parents on TV about how the school did this or did that..blah blah blah. Because their kid broke the rules in some manner including hair issues, tee-shirts, other dressing attire, etc. Instead of upholding the rules of the school, these parents are blasting the school system. So this kid is going back to school with no respect for the teachers, administration, nothing. What is wrong with these people. My children were told up front. I'll listen to both sides of the story but don't expect me to just jump to their defence. Usually, it is not the school's or the teacher's fault. While they are in school, the teachers, administrators, and any other adult is in charge. They will listen to them and respect them just as they do their parents.

Now that I've rambled: 1) somewhere we got off track with teaching and instead of going back to fundamentals that worked, the patch method occured. I don't believe it is liberal teaching ideology. It is going to take more schools like that one I saw and more parents demanding it to turn this around.
2) Respect. With respect and consideration, comes the personal responsiblity. The law of natural consequences is what my children have gotten. These parents today are also trying to get something from the system for free. The stupid law suits, most of which should be thrown out, that are 95% the person's own fault.

I know that alot of churches have gone "casual" attire wise to keep and/or attract people. I've gotten in discussions about this and been told there are poorer people who don't have the clothes. In days long gone by, people had their "Sunday go to meeting" clothes. They took care to go to church in their best, whatever that may be, to show reverance to God. I don't believe wearing Tee-shirts with junk on them is necessary in an affluent area. I end up in a battle with my teenagers now because I will not let them go that way. There is no reason they cannot show respect going into the Lord's House.
I'm getting off my soap box

Answer 8

public education system works

Answer 9

So, you are saying we should abolish the entire system of public education, because of the effect that one history teacher had on one kid on one particular day? You think that might be a bit of an overreaction? Maybe you should get involved and try to improve the school curriculum if you don't like it. No, easier to blame the system. Also, I notice you didn't actually say what the "liberal propaganda" that the kid said was. I don't care about you anymore.

Answer 10

Well, in California it is getting worse. We have Plenty of money for it thru tax Dollars. A recent survey showed our Public School System showed we have over TWICE as many administrators than we do Teachers in the system.
So 2/3 of the tax Dollars set aside for salaries, DOES NOT GO TO THE TEACHERS, it goes to Administrators and to the Union.
How much sense does that make???