Study on aggressive men: Is it because of genetics or a bad attitude?

Question

A research study on aggression in men suggests it may be due to variations in one of two genes. But do the men with the “aggression” gene have to become the "bad seeds"? Not necessarily. The study found that genetics appears to be predictive only if men have more *cynical* and *hostile attitudes* towards others or have fathers who never completed high school. Here's the article about the study:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/06/060621162228.htm

Do you think these "aggressive" genes could be dealt with if boy's attitudes we're more hopeful and positive?

I don't see the link between boys aggression level and the father's educational level, though, do you?

I was *not* trying to imply that all aggression of men or women should be "done away with". I didn't want to repeat big segments of the article, but the article pointed out the negative consequences of some forms of male aggression and the role genetics may play in it, as well as how men's attitudes, their father's educational background, and their maternal parenting can affect these men:

"The Pitt study is the first to look at whether aggression in “normal” men may, in part, be attributed to the same serotonin-related genetic alterations that have been associated with aggressive behaviors in certain *psychiatric* and *criminal* populations. Indeed, the study found those who reported past fights, conflicts with authority figures or breaking objects in bouts of anger were more likely to carry the “low activity” MAOA gene variant that’s been linked to criminal violence. The MAOA gene has been implicated in personality and anti-social disorders and in some criminal offenders."

Answer 1

I don't think we should turn men into women. Most are fine the way they are. Women, in general balance them out in this world with a bit of peace. But it would be boring with out any aggression (think of all the sports and other competitions that feed off aggression). Aggression in men is natural and has benefits as long as it is used in a positive manner.

I believe the grater levels of aggression in boys who have fathers without a high school education probably stems more from poverty than education levels. However typically those who focus on education also focus their children on education and want the best for them. Less exposure to aggressive behaviors may be the link.

However, while males are physically aggressive females tend to be very emotionally aggressive. Both are outlets that can have positive results, however there is a need for moderation of everything.

EDIT-Thanks. I loved yours too.

Answer 2

I would imagine we could do a great deal of "genetic cleansing" if we were somehow able to discover and eradicate the genes determine whether a person is aggressive, violent, or downright criminal. I would also advocate stiffer penalties for certain crimes. A few months to a year or two in prison does NOTHING to rehabiltate a criminal. They most often get out and re-offend at some point. Boys in violent households grow up and tend to follow in the father's footsteps because violence is seen as "okay" regardless of the consequences. I don't think education has anything to do with it. I think it is more of a cultural problem. A good role model would also be better than a bad father.

Answer 3

even if "aggressive" genes were done away with, most westernized nations (which this study used) are capitalistic. capitalism generally rewards aggression. there will always be someone wanting the lions share all for themselves.

i agree that there isn't necessarily a link between boys aggression level and father's education. people can be aggressive no matter what their upbringing, since the pressure to succeed in career life is so strong (male provider role). In poorer socio-economic classes (gasp! there is class struggle in america? i thought we had the best middle class in the world!), it's understandable that young people (and young men) are frustrated at the lack of opportunities.

In the wealthier extreme, Bill Gates was born into a wealthy family of lawyers and bankers. He already had multimillion dollar trust funds before he set foot in harvard. Do a little research on him, and it'll be easy to see that he's one of the most aggressive businessmen the world has ever seen. It's not easy to build a personal fortune of 56 billion dollars.

Answer 4

Ha! You're kidding, right? That's ridiculous. There are plenty of women that are calm and sophisticated and men that are aggressive with bad attitudes. There are great people and nasty people within both sexes.

Answer 5

Genetics or a bad attitude, you say?

Bad attitudes are probably predispositions coded for in genes also.

That aside, someone already mentioned that environment probably affects the manner in which a predisposition manifests, which sounds to me like it's on the money.

As an aside after reading that article, it always strikes me as amazing that a typical neurotransmitter like serotonin could be involved in so many emotional responses.

"The most remarkable thing about the brain is that it isn't very remarkable."

Answer 6

That sounds about right to me. Agression is probably strongly influenced by genetics, but your upbringing and environment may discourage or encourage it and make it manifest in different ways. Somebody with more hostile attitudes is more likely to take their agression out on other people, somebody with more positive attitudes is more likely to reign it in.

Education is usually closely tied to socioeconomic status, and we know violent criminals are usually from poor backgrounds (lack of opportunities plus a social atmosphere usually full of misery and resentment), so that makes sense.

Answer 7

That was an interesting article, thanks for posting it. :-) I'm curious about the father's education level, too. That strikes me as totally random; I'm not sure how it fits in. I was pleased to see the effects of mothering noted as a contributing factor to avoiding aggression. Cheers to all the mothers of sons out there who are raising them well.... I've always said that if we aided mothers in doing their jobs well, we'd save money in future prison costs. Perhaps there's something to that.

LOL... I see Gray *still* won't admit that mothering of infants matters in terms of psychological health. I suppose we'll agree to disagree, then.

It sounds as though if it were a matter of poverty = aggression, they would have called it that. I'm still scratching my head at the education level correlation.

(sigh) Yes, Gray, I have an anthropology degree. I am well aware that it is nature AND nurture. I never claimed otherwise. I just find it interesting that you quickly brush aside any possibility that poor parenting of infants can lead to psychological problems. Like I said, we'll just have to agree to disagree. I really don't feel like arguing about it. We'll be going round and round all day otherwise. I'm sure we both have enough stats and studies backing us up, that we'll be here until 3 am. Focusing on genetic predisposition is simply one way to handle the problem of criminal behavior. Dr. Hare is hardly the *only* person with a valid opinion on the matter.

Well, Ms. Thang, I would love to sit and chat with someone so kind and obviously *far* more brilliant than me, but I have a Mensa meeting to be getting to. They all think it's cute when people confuse holding degrees with having an actual education or a well-trained mind. Cheers

Answer 8

I swore by Poseidon, " he who holds and shakes the earth ", to never visit this site again, but the educational correlation to violence data needs explanation.
Come, come people, what is educations correlational translation to violence? INTELLIGENCE!!! Intelligence is strongly cross correlated with violence and someone who is a high school dropout is either intellectually challenged, or possible a psychopath/Machiavellian personality type. Not to so that is the all of it, but the mean behavior. Suffice it to say that.
Now, as to the battle that seems to be joined between the good, Juniper and the not-so-good, Greymalkin ( what is a Greymalkin ). In this particular instance, you two seem to be talking past one another. ( though I thought I would never live to see the day when Greymalkin almost took a innate position ) And throwing degrees at one another is not helpful. ( though I could not help being pleased by Junipers reminder to Greymalkin that her degree is rigor-less! ) Though I out degree you both ( despite Greymalkins delusional interpretation of a couple e-mails ) I will not condescend, to Juniper. I will give a condescending pat on the head to Greymalkin, for a good presentation of Hare, who happens to be one of my favorite psychologists. Until my return ( which I hope is never ) you ladies try to work out you differences with the cooperation ladies are famous for.

PS Captain S. appears to be needed in this section. Insightful answer.

Answer 9

"Bad attitude" is scientifically vague, but you could easily make an argument for genetics vs. say, environmental factors. Hopefulness and positivity aren't quantifiable values, but behavioral manifestations are. This is an interesting concept to explore if you're careful to keep personal biases hidden to avoid corrupting your data. Good luck.

Answer 10

" a genetic predisposition toward aggression could be rebuffed by a mother who nurtures her infant, suggests another study involving primates."

This research involved the study of rhesus monkeys. Instead of targetting 'aggression" - which has survival value and is not necessarily pathological - we should devote more energy to study of the worst of the worst offenders. By that I mean prison inmates. More men than women are incarcerated for violent crime; the research findings of Dr. Robert Hare tell us that a high percentage of these inmates are psychopaths. There has been some recent research findings that suggests psychopathy may be (to some extent) passed on in the mother's genes: in other words, that there is a genetic predisposition to the kind of behaviors that land these dangerous, often violent offenders, in prison. Not all psychopaths land in jail: their exploitative behaviors can put them in powerful positions in business and government. Their parasitical, pathological behaviors are actually rewarded - and the mess they leave behind often not noticed until it's too late.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I am more interested in what makes the read baddies tick because they are responsible for so much human suffering and are a huge drain on resources.

"I don't see the link between boys aggression level and the father's educational level, though, do you?"
Indirectly. There would be a link between father's educational level and his ability to provide for his family. The higher his socio-economic status the more resources available to him.