Can free will exist without time?

Question

Check out the Wheeler-DeWitt equation, before making up your mind.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheeler-deWitt_equation

Shawn B, good answer. I can say that I don't understand it, but within it, the variable of time completely vanishes suggesting that time (as we think of it) does not exist.

Answer 1

Think of it this way -
(1) There exist now propositions about everything that might happen in the future.
(2) Every proposition is either true or else false.
(3) If (1) and (2), then there exists now a set of true propositions that, taken together, correctly predict everything that will happen in the future.
(4) If there exists now a set of true propositions that, taken together, correctly predict everything that will happen in the future, then whatever will happen in the future is already unavoidable.
(5) Whatever will happen in the future is already unavoidable.
The main objections to arguments like this have been to premises (2) and (4). The rationale for premise (2) is that it appears to be a fundamental principle of semantics, sometimes referred to as The Principle of Bivalence (or just Bivalence for short). The rationale for premise (4) is the claim that no one is able to make a true prediction turn out false.

So - there seem to be three possibilities:

• There really is a complete unified theory, which we will someday discover if we are smart enough.

• There is no ultimate theory of the universe, just an infinite sequence of theories that describe the universe more and more accurately.

• There is no theory of the universe. Events cannot be predicted beyond a certain extent but occur in a random and arbitrary manner.

Some would argue for the third possibility on the grounds that if there were complete set of laws, that would infringe on God’s freedom to change His mind and to intervene in the world. It’s a bit like the old paradox: Can God make a stone so heavy that He can’t lift it? But the idea that God might want to change His example of the fallacy, pointed out by St. Augustine, of imagining God as a being existing in time. Time is a property only of the universe that God created. Presumably, He knew what He intended when He set it up. With the advent of quantum mechanics, we have come to realize that events cannot be predicted with complete accuracy but that there is always a degree of uncertainty. If one liked, one could ascribe this randomness to the intervention of God. But it would be a very strange kind of intervention. There is no evidence that it is directed toward any purpose. Indeed, if it were, it wouldn’t be random. In modern times, we have effectively removed the third possibility by redefining the goal of science. Our aim is to formulate a set of laws that will enable us to predict events up to the limit set by the uncertainty principle.
The second possibility, that there is an infinite sequence of more and more refined theories, is in agreement with all our experience so far. On many occasions, we have increased the sensitivity of our measurements or made a new class of observations only to discover new phenomena that were not predicted by the existing theory. To account for these, we have had to develop a more advanced theory. It would therefore not be very surprising if we find that our present grand unified theories break down when we test them on bigger and more powerful particle accelerators. Indeed, if we didn’t expect them to break down, there wouldn’t be much point in spending all that money on building more powerful machines.
However, it seems that gravity may provide a limit to this sequence of “boxes within boxes.” If one had a particle with an energy above what is called the Planck energy, 1019 GeV, its mass would be so concentrated that it would cut itself off from the rest of the universe and form a little black hole. Thus, it does seem that the sequence of more and more refined theories should have some limit as we go to higher and higher energies. There should be some ultimate theory of the universe. Of course, the Planck energy is a very long way from the energies of around a GeV, which are the most that we can produce in the laboratory at the present time. To bridge that gap would require a particle accelerator that was bigger than the solar system. Such an accelerator would be unlikely to be funded in the present economic climate.
However, the very early stages of the universe are an arena where such energies must have occurred. I think that there is a good chance that the study of the early universe and the requirements of mathematical consistency will lead us to a complete unified theory by the end of the century—always presuming we don’t blow ourselves up first. What would it mean if we actually did discover the ultimate theory of the universe? It would bring to an end a long and glorious chapter in the history of our struggle to understand the universe. But it would also revolutionize the ordinary person’s understanding of the laws that govern the universe. In Newton’s time it was possible for an educated person to have a grasp of the whole of human knowledge, at least in outline. But ever since then, the pace of development of science has made this impossible. Theories were always being changed to account for new observations. They were never properly digested or simplified so that ordinary people could understand them. You had to be a specialist, and even then you could only hope to have a proper grasp of a small proportional of the scientific theories.

Answer 2

Some of the postulates made about God in regards to free will assume that there is human logic behind the 'will' of God. For example, why can we not describe quantum uncertainty as the device of some higher entity. Can an earthworm understand Manhattan, or particle physics, for that matter? Perhaps the true 'identity' of what we call God is more like a child at play. If God exists, chances are we have a long way to go before understanding the true nature of God.

As for my take on free will, as long as there is a source of consciousness and a dimension of change (could there not be conscious entities that exist, say, only in the first three spatial dimensions?) there can be free will. Interaction with the world implies action, observation, and response, and as we all know from the quantum world, these (esp, observation) change uncertain outcomes. So sure, time isn't necessary. We only think it is because we grew up with it.

Answer 3

Space-time is the existence mode of matter, the way the Universe expresses itself. To imagine any phenomena without time is just an imagination.
Quantum gravity is a theory without any experimental evidence. It is too early to make up ones mind upon considerations on Wheeler-Dewitt equation.

Answer 4

did anyone actually read and understand Wheeler-DeWitt before making up their mind?

i found it to be thoroughly impregnable

anyways to ask the question if free will exists without time to me is same as saying is if a place exists without the cross-streets...

Answer 5

so which you're asserting loose will is barely achieveable by way of MAGIC? that's not an argument in any respect. there grow to be some thing interesting interior the information final years. i've got not study plenty approximately it, yet some mathematicians, interestingly, claimed that subatomic debris have loose will, and that this explains how we've loose will. it sort of feels shaky to me. What we discover as randomness is in basic terms a loss of advice. If we knew the miraculous velocity and attitude of effect on the table, we could desire to think cube rolls each and every time. that's boastful to think of we could desire to think the collisions of subatomic debris--of direction they're "unpredictable," because of the fact we lack the approaches (and records of what variables to music whether we could desire to be conscious them) to make any good predictions. I even have some thing drawing near a non secular theory that strategies isn't comparable to rely, that strategies isn't effected via rely, and that organic strategies, as a result, has loose will. i don't improve this theory in loose will to those psychological activities that are certain via rely--that are vocalized or related to types. In a manner, it is to assert that loose will can not exist without God (metaphorically).

Answer 6

Well this problem has me wondering, only from the reference, it would appear the equation takes an instantaneous value of events, with the absence of the time element, in an attempt to decipher what would be the likely outcome, should it ever be, that the universal fourth dimensional events, that move with time, and bear impact on the subject be suspended. Though this is not, in actual fact, considering whether it’s possible to function in the absence of (time), its more about predicting what would happen, in the absence of time with direct relationship, to the events that would happen, given time where present, but now are not.

Would everything stop, given everything in the universe depends upon everything else, for it to function, and by removing all those others activities, would it be possible to continue to function in their absence as an independent entity?

Perhaps,

Problem being, quantum physics being what it is, and having the infinite ability to come up with an infinite amount of variables exponentially, yet every one could mean the same thing; if decipherd accordingly. You also have to consider, the removal of all predicted paths of relative motion in three/fourth dimensional time and space.
In effect freezing not time but time/space.

This problem I fear where not to predict what would happen if we freeze time, but more what would happen if all those three/fourth dimensional space time events, that may impose themselves upon us, over time, where absent.

A very good point to consider, given the probability of travelling in excess of light, or to near distant universes where our understanding of time/space equilibrium, won’t be present. Would we be able to function?

A very, very relevant question, should one be intending to visit such strangely diverse environments, that given the question; would we be able to think and function as quantum beings, in those environments, is a very big, 'don’t know.' Though time relative to ourselves, would coexist, it may not be clearly apparent to the subject in question.
Sorted!

Geez, uz people do post some tough questions.
Edx

Answer 7

Could any kind of will exist in zero time or eternity. Many believe in eternity, but I haven't met any who believes in zero time.

Will is developed in stage two:

Stage One Oral-Sensory: from birth to one, trust vs. mistrust, feeding;
Stage Two Muscular-Anal: 1-3 years, autonomy vs. doubt, toilet training;
Stage Three Locomotor: 3-6 years, initiative vs. inadequacy, independence;
Stage Four Latency: 6-12 years, industry vs. inferiority, school;
Stage Five Adolescence: 12-18 years, identity vs. confusion, peer relationships;
Stage Six Young Adulthood: 18-40 years, intimacy vs. isolation, love relationships;
Stage Seven Middle Adulthood: 40-65 years, generativity vs. stagnation, parenting;
Stage Eight Maturity: 65 years until death, integrity vs. despair, acceptance of one's life.

hope
will
purpose
competence
fidelity
love (in intimate relationships, work and family)
caring
wisdom
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erick_Erickson

Answer 8

Nope - you have to be somewhere in time and space to exercise free will in our four dimensions. Then too - on the astral plane free will also exists..... although time also exists there but is measured quite differently.