Why is racism against Albanians and Macedonians acceptable in Greece.?

Question

Even on this forum many Greeks use offensive names and images to describe Albanians and Macedonians and all they get is many thumbs ups from the like minded.

I thought Greece was meant to be a mordern country (like the rest of the EU) where racism is frowned upon

@Edoudo Buscuit. You behaviour is very like a troll. Why didn't you report this racist question but answer it with with a racist comment. http://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Ak3oKJbkqd0GUK2xfdWYpNxhPxV.?qid=20070523080333AAgPNeh

This is a serious question that I want a serious answer to. And I have every right to ask this. At least yahoo answers is a democracy even though you would prefer it not to be.

And to stress I'm not saying all Greeks are racist. I know they are not, but I have noticed that certain kinds of racism is acceptable there. And I want to know why, and what is being done to stop it.

If I'm wrong please tell me why, not argontly shut of debate..your answer shows your true colors.

Thank you for the answers I recieved so far, and for all those who took time to give a serious answer.

I like to keep my questions open,,but I will choose a best on both my Greek questions.

Answer 1

Dear Siren and other friends:

I will try to answer your question that has created a very heated reaction as I can see from the previous responses that you have received.

I am against racism. But before I continue, we need to better understand what racism is. Racism is a fairly new word but an old concept. It was in 1982 that the Oxford English Dictionary defined racism for the very first time as “the theory that distinctive human characteristics and abilities are determined by ‘race’.”

Although many theories and models (relative autonomy, autonomy and migrant labour models) have been developed by sociologists to explain this ever changing and complex aspect of society, I like Martin Luther King’s reasoning why racism is corrupt and wrong. Firstly, he affirmed that it causes significant hurt to the victims, and induces such things as poverty on them. Secondly, he revealed that racism in turn promotes ‘reverse racism’ – a reaction of the victims to the behaviour they receive. Usually this results in even more violence and conflict than was present in the first place. Thirdly, racism’s damage is very widespread – it can affect the entire human race adversely. Fourthly, ignorance and racism go hand-in-hand, and there is no thought, reasoning or understanding involved in the behaviour. His fifth point was that racism reverses development and progress made, particularly in social relations. The sixth point referred to oppressed people’s inherent right to freedom, and that racism does not allow it. Finally, he concluded that it is just unfair in general, and fails to agree with any moral code of any sort. When Dr. King wrote this list, racism was probably a lot different than it is nowadays. It is a constantly changing thing; always reforming and reproducing in any culture by many influences such as media, arts, education, etc. and it has become a big factor in law and order, crime and general urban unrest and violence.

Societies develop racism when they feel threatened. Greece is no exception. It is not unique either as most of the other societies around the world have similar problems. Please, do not try to find “good reasons” (excuses) for racism. To my opinion, it is simply wrong, unethical and immoral. I do not believe that most Greeks recognize that they are racist. Greeks are very sensitive and we would not like to see ouselves as racists. Unfortunately this good trait of ours becomes also our worst enemy in combating racism in our society. Unless a society recognizes that it has a problem, unfortunately, it cannot correct it.

Respectfully,

Konstantinos

Answer 2

You r not an enemy, ur trying only 2 b provocative in a silly manner. Greece does have minorities (religious, ethnic etc) but most probably, most peolpe living in Greece identify themselves as being Greek, no matter what. For example, if you make any research about the Greek participation on the Balkan Wars & WWI, you ll c that by far the greatest contibution 2 the Greek war effort was done by the Battleship "AVEROV". The islands of the Aegean Sea are liberated today only due to this warship which managed alone to keep at bay all the Turkish fleet. Do u know why the ship was named like that? Because it was bought by the Greek goverment with the money donated by a person called Averov who made a fortune in Egypt. It was the most modern & powerfull of all the ships of the Balkan states & it was so expensive that the Greek Goverment could not afford to buy it. Why did this man gave all this amount of money ? (the name "Averov" does not sound very Greek, does it?) No matter if he spoke Greek fluently or had a Greek name, he was feeling being Greek & he is one of the most important donators Greece ever had. If some people want to believe that they are not Greeks, they have every right 2 do so, because Greece (in great contrast 2 some of its neighbours) is a acivilised & democratic country. In the Greek Parliament there are people from the muslim minority (belonging to the Pomac, Roma & Turkish race). A party supporting the rights of the "Macedonian" minority in Greece, tried a couple of times to run ithe elections, but managed 2 fetch no more than 3.000 votes (most of them not in Northern Greece, but in island of Creta & elsewhere). What exactly is the meaning of your question?

Answer 3

Answering to Konstantinos And it's not just their tomps for proof there are hard evidence that they both spoke as did their people did Greek and they both regarded themselves as Greeks same way Athens did and Sparta did and still do and for many generations(at least at till the time of Justinian) that was how people knew them as
Also Fyromians not only call themselves wrongly Macedonians but they also claim that Alexander the Great did not ask for help from his fellow Greeks(especially Spartans since they defeated them once.Have you seen 300?) to battle the Persian invasion but get this: they claim that he took his army and abadon his people to the mercy of Persians who actually get this too, waited patiently for him to conquer the rest of Greece and built a slave army just like them Persians had ho ho ho
, which if you check you check actual history book written before 1950s they will tell you that the Persian slave army was the detail Great Alexander use to deafeat them the first time and almost every time after that ("slave" is th detail he used)
Now about Albanians the first time we had contact with them was 94 to 98 back then they were refugees of war not like today Cyrians refugees but people who had been at least 5 years in the war and if they didn't steal they would starve when they came in Greece many of them stole and burglerd, acted like thugs all the time and their default mood was either hate or sceaming-Hate then the Media took "care" of that and we were really more afraid-of-them-racist than hate-racist but we still even today don't like the "my only mood is hate": and "I will hurt you for no reason"Albanians who still hasn't wash the war from their minds
Oh and Albanians are Very Racist people: like they really hate Greeks here in Greece and if they are many of them they try to push away Greeks from their neighborhood.
Oh and many Albanians couple HATE silently each other and we find it abnormal
Also many of our refugees who are not Greeks hate Albanians/Fyromians and some also hate Russians like "don't eat that it was prepared/touched by Russians" I don't know why but they brought their hate with them when they come here.
I hope that covers you

Answer 4

Racist Albanian Jokes

Answer 5

"I thought Greece was meant to be a mordern country (like the rest of the EU) where racism is frowned upon"

Big joke that Europe is not racist ask Turks and Greeks that lived in Germany.
Greeks in greece used to live among themselves. with the migration of the last 15 years greeks are still managing to get used to the idea for example that an Albanian may own a shop and employ a Greek guy.
As for the macedonians its a completely different thing. My opinion is that it is unfair for a country to take the name of a whole region which is divived among Greece, Bulgaria and FYROM.
No racicm against 'Macedonians" Greeks are culturally very close to them just dont refer to the name.

Closing remark racism is also "frowned upon" in Greece and everywhere its not acceptable by any means that doesnt mean that some people wont make racist remarks

Answer 6

First of all, the attitude of Greeks towards Albanians and the people from Fyrom is very different. In the case of Albanians, there is not exactly racism, as there are more than a million Albanians here in Greece prospering and working. In other European countries, that you mentioned, there is much more racism (if you think that immigrants in Germany often have their houses burned by neo-nazi racists and that LePen get 10% in France). I am condemning these attitudes, of course, and I am telling you that there is no hate towards immigrants in Greece. However, wherever there is a quite large group which is distinct from the main population of the area, some discriminations occur. Especially if there is a connection with criminality (when Albanians first came to Greece they were very poor, illegal, and many of them became thieves etc.). This is why Greeks had often a negative attitude towards them. But if you see how well Albanians live in Greece and how much they have advanced culturally, socially and financially here, you will realize that there is no racism.
As for FYROM, we don't have any racist feelings towards the people. We do however have national differences, or you could say conflict, on the known matters. We have a disagreement. It's as simple as that. Racism means we would think you are inferior people, or something like that, which is not true. Having an argument on a national level doesn't constitute racism. During the second world war, you know we fought against Italy. There are many songs of the time against Italy, but that doesn't mean we hate Italians or that there is racism against Italians! As a matter of fact, I think Italians are the people we like most in Europe. If the problems with FYROM are resolved in a mutually acceptable matter, and people from there, like you, stop trying to provoke us by calling us racists etc. or by propagating facts that are historically wrong about our country's past, even in Yahoo!Answers, I guarantee that we will be best friends.

Answer 7

Racists exist in every country of this world. Even the emmigrants have differences between them. I am not saying it is good and I don't justify it, but Greece isn' t one of the countries who hate foreigners. Maybe there are certain persons who dislike Albanians, because something happened to their family or their home, when the Albanians first came here, but FYROM, no. As far as Fyrom is concerned the case is different. It's not racism. It's a national matter. Phillip's and Alexander the Great's tombs are in Vergina and history proves that these places were greek and not slav! So you cannot call yourselves Macedonians.

Answer 8

you can find racism in every country(mostly greece LOL) greece isnt really racist towards Macedonians, just albanians and especially turks, i still havnt figured out why but im guessing its something to do with the independence of greece from turkey...(im not quite sure about albania).

Greeks and Turks like havnt every gotten on well and i dont really think that they will start now.....well i hope they do.

Answer 9

Well, I would not say it is acceptable. It is just that some people are biased. I'd say most are not. But the key issue here is that most Greeks are unable to express themselves properly, a problem grossly exacerbated on the internet.

The way you posed your question maybe part of the problem here, however. You mentioned "Macedonians", obviously refering to citizens of FYROM. This would hit a nerve with most Greeks who justifiably feel that the Slavs who reside in that country have been blatantly trying to expropriate the Greek heritage and revise the glorious history of Greece.

The people of FYROM are not justified in refering to themselves as Macedonians any more than the Euro-centric settlers of the USA can call themselves native Indians.

Answer 10

I've lived on a small island in Greece for three years now. And I find that they find it difficult to accept foreigners in general. But once I showed that I respected their culture. That I was willing to learn Greek and eat Greek food and make Greek friends, they accepted me. Greece is a modern country, and they accept foreigners who accept their culture and dont isolate themselves or 'reject' Greek culture. Sure there is racism, but just as much as in any other country.
Something to take into consideration is that "Political correctness" is a completely alien topic to the Greeks, they dont know what it is. Meaning they have no problem expressing their opinions, whereas Rascism might not be expressed as much in other countries because the rascists themselves dont want to be persecuted for it, but deep down still harbour these feelings.