Why do feminists delude themselves into thinking that "women's rights" are not DEPENDENT on chivalry?

Question

"If I had to choose between chivalry and rights, I'd take rights because those are unconditional and depend on no one else's good will."

Feminists that think this statement is true please put your hand up. Thanks.

Reality check. Men are stronger. You may not like chivalry because it depends on our goodwill to take pity on you and give you rights. This is what the loss of chivalry really means - the loss of men's goodwill.

This is why people say feminists are cooking their own goose, because you violate men's rights, men can rectify that by taking up arms.

This is also why many men find the idea of negotiating with feminists laughable. Feminism is so out of control that eventually a large enough number of men WILL just want it gone.

That is the fundamental difference between feminism and the men's movement. 10,000 feminists is a demonstration. 10,000 men is not a demonstration - it's an army.

You are dependent on enough men being willing to protect you forever.

Understand?

Read it again rio.

"Without big strong men to protect you, other big strong men would just rape you."

Please tell me how that is absurd, vegan or whatever your name was.

Rio: You're just not keeping up. Feminism eats chivalry for breakfast and not because "feminists don't want chairs pulled out" because they make men not care less. It's been gone through a number of times.

Rio: You still don't comprehend the question. Read it again. I'm done explaining it.

Jon: You just proved my point. Men defend women's rights. What if they don't?

Baby Girl: "Rejecting chivalry is violating men's rights" does not make sense to you because it doesn't. You just got sidetracked by a twit's answer. I'm sure feminists LOOVE chivalry. I'm sure the love anything that gives them privileges regardless of what it is. Chivalry depends on men's goodwill and feminists are not destroying chivalry by "rejecting" it, they're destroying it by being man haters and violating men's rights in a number of ways described elsewhere on this board.

I'm still highly amused that some people actually think I'm the stupid or delusional one for thinking women en masse could protect themselves from men en masse should men take up arms.

Even an armed forces of castrated men like some posting below led by women vs an army of the same number of anti-feminists would be a slaughter.

Answer 1

Preach on Brother... oh and Vegan... if men get SICK and tired of your BS feminism... what makes you think you'll have the right to tell us what we can or cant stick our lances into? LOL... women in the middle east dont have that right... if they refuse their husband they can be lashed in public for disobedience.

You guys keep pushing your stupid feminism in the same way in this country, and I promise you that enough men will get sick of it, and it doesnt matter if you outnumber us or not... one man can easily subdue multiple women... and all you womens way of dealing with a man... "kicking him in the balls" yea... cups really come in handy then what are you going to do? Cry to an attourney? LOL

Answer 2

This feminist says it's more about a potential partner being a gentleman, which I love and require. Also, that 'chivalry' is really just being well-mannered and common courtesy, because the men who hold doors for women more likely than not also hold them for men. So, it's not really about the traditional concept of 'chivalry', it's about the sort of person you are, whether you're male or female. I was raised well, I have very strong ties to etiquette/being well-mannered, carrying myself with class, etc., so to be compatible, I need a man who values these things too =o)

Answer 3

Before you put out questions - you need to know what you are asking. Feminists are simply those who believe is equal rights for both women and men. I think your perception that all feminists hate chivalry is a falsehood. Do you really know every single feminist personally out there? I think not.

Look, rights are something that women had to work, suffer, and achieve. That statement has less to do with chivalry and more to do with explaining how important rights are to a human being. I bet that the person who said that quote was responding to someone saying that chivalry is dead because women got rights. Chivalry is not nearly as important to play an equal role in society as rights are. Get it?

I am not understanding how rejecting chivalry is violating a man's right. Please explain this. It just doesnt make any sense.

Hmmm, 10,000 men is an army - I am not sure how this plays into your argument except that I think that if you give women the same ammunition and armery, they can do an equal amount of damage as men can in a way.

Pantera - Rio is right - all the word feminist means is that you believe that women and men should have equal rights. That's it. ;)

Answer 4

I am not a feminist.
I do believe in equal rights for men and women.
The battle of the sexes has been around for years and I do believe it will end when the human race becomes extinct.
Women have strengths and abilities that men do not.
Men have strengths and abilities that woman do not.
Each sex makes up for what the other doesn't have and is not capable of doing.
It is because of this that men and women should learn to work together. Something that is well under way but still has to be fine-tuned.
We need to learn that we can't live without one another and to stop bickering like little children. We need to start respecting each other and stop trying to fight over who is the "dominant" sex. The realtiy is that neither of us are.

Answer 5

Most people (women or no) who reject chivalry do so because of the underlying attitude of "You need to be protected, since you can't do it yourself."

Reality check:
Yes, men *are* physically stronger.
But, women have more physical endurance and a higher pain thresh hold.

People are saying that Feminists are cooking their own goose because they are deliberately offending both sides of the equation

Ooo...taking-up arms because you can't hold your own in a fair argument... That is called cowardice. What's next, you're going to crawl away and begin lashing out at those who won't accept your view as the only one? I have news for you... the general term for that now-a-days is "Terrorist".

Yes, "Feminism" has become a dirty word...primarily due to the radical Feminists of the 80's and 90's who were more interested in not becoming "equal" to men, but proving they were "better" than men, and that they had no need for them. They were, and are, as objectionably sexist as the most mysoginistic men.

As for your movement and army analogy, it falls short...well short. Both are demonstrations, your envisioned men's demonstation is simply more objectionable. Gender has NOTHING to do with the ability to carry, use a firearm, or even use it accurately!

Women are ONLY dependant on men being willing to "protect" them when the men are unwilling to do the dirty work of rearing their own children.

Your kind of venom is something I will *never* understand...despite the fact that for the first ten years of my life, my mother was a stay-at-home mom.

Answer 6

Oh...the anger. This sounds like one sick fantasy on your part. Men taking up arms against women? The "Sex Wars"? Sounds like some racists who fantasize about "race wars." You are deluded, Happy. Feminism doesn't seek to take away men's rights. Only men who are afraid of women think that.
As for "taking up arms"...as ludicrous as your idea is, you forget one thing: Men may be stronger, but guns are the "great equalizer."
And Happy, if any woman had to depend on a "man" like you protecting her...god help her.

Answer 7

You should research your facts so that you don't come here and make a fool of yourself (like you jus did)

"Men are stronger". - any competent martial artist can show you how useless strength in an opponent is. As a matter of fact, women have more endurance, they live longer and they tolerate stress better.

Your physical strength is useless in a fight if your opponent wakes up in the middle of the night and sticks a knife in you while you sleep.

"Rights" are not given to someone because the giver was chivalrous - they are fought for and won by people that decide that they will die to gain their rights. When you're talking about "rights" and chivalry, wht you are actually talking about is "priveledges". Those are irrelevant to the discussion.

As for your talk abut men "Taking up arms".- Against whom are you going to fight? Are you going to kill your sister, your mother? What happens to the race if you kill all the child-bearing women? How do you propose to win this "war" if you doom yourself when you win?

You claim that a "large number" of men oppose feminism. I have news for you - a LARGER number of men support it. The non-supporters are dinosaurs headed for extinction. Pick your knuckles off the ground and join the majority.

Regarding your 10,000 feminists vs 10,000 men comparison- 10,000 men is a mob (the army is unisex, in case you didn't notice). And 10,000 fighting-mad women would be a force only a madman would oppose.

Understand?

Answer 8

Feminism rooted in equality and mutual respect is wonderful. when it takes on an inverse chauvanism, then it is dangerous - largely because it taints women's rights as a whole. Groups like NOW tend to focus their efforts on politically volatile issues instead of equal rights issues.

The irony I find is that for alot of "feminists" they are hardly feminine.

Answer 9

So basically what you're saying is that I'm discriminating against men by not letting them pay for my dinner? I'd consider that an act of charity. I'd choose rights because I just plain hate chivalry. Rights are dependent on the goodwill of EVERYONE. Don't men like women who can take care of themselves?

Now that I know how important it is for you to pull out a woman's chair, my resolve never to date you is strengthened.

EDIT: You act as if we want to remove a man's right to be chivalrous. That's pure crap. Be as chivalrous as you want, just not around the women who hate it.

EDIT: Oh, I see. Men hate feminists because we want them to treat us like people instead of like goddesses. Pardon me. Know this: The greatest gift a man can give to a woman is his respect. If he can respect a woman even when she denies herself special treatment from him, it's even better. And if a few men don't like my politics, well, ask me if I care.

EDIT TO PANTERA: If you believe in gender equality, you're a feminist. That's just the way it is.

EDIT: The only connection I see between women's rights and chivalry is our right not to take it. We need men to defend our rights, just as we need other women to defend our rights. Whether we need men to defend us on the street is a whole other argument.

Answer 10

Happy Bullet. You are delusional as ever! It does not matter too much how rights were acquired, but how they are defended! Men are pretty strong in defense of their mothers, sister and wives; against the likes of you! By your posts of some months back one would think that you would think twice before insulting women who can " take " you. I mean that in both the physical and sexual sense!