What is the deal with so many, here on YA, who seem to think that Spaniards, Italians & Greeks aren't white?

Question

I could only get so much on the question line but it's probably worth including the Portuguese & Sicilians as well.
Seriously, though, what is the problem here? Never in my fifty-plus years have I encountered such erroneous thinking until I began participating here on YA. I can remember a time when everyone was on the same page. I'm guessing the majority of those who think this way must be very young and take the term "white" far too literally. And please, none of those foolish
"We're all one race - the human race" responses. We are all one species - Homo Sapiens but there are three races: Caucasoid, Mongoloid & *******.
(Australoid is a fourth but there's not a lot of agreement there. This would be the classification for the Australian Aborigines.)
In any case, race is not defined by skin color anyway but rather by craniofacial anthropometry. Thanks.

I didn't say a single species was foolish. I said the notion of a single "race" is foolish.
Also, there are always those trying to discredit racial theories, whether it be three, four, five or seven races (Those being the four most often found in older textbooks.) but the three race theory really holds up the best. It would seem that those doing the discrediting are the PC-minded types who are simply trying to classify ethnicities, and perhaps even nationalities, as separate races! This realy only serves to devide people further IMO. There is a difference between race and ethnicity and it would certainly appear that a lot of people just don't understand that difference.

I only separated Italians from Sicilians because most of the questions dealing with this subject, here on YA, do so. I make no such distinction personally. To me, they are all Italians. My experience here, however, is that while most people agree that Italians are white, they seem to think that Sicilians are not.
True, there is some African admixture present in a small percentage of the population but it is North African, primarily Berber, and that is still Caucasoid. There is virtually no sub-Saharan (*******) DNA present. African does not necessarily equate with black.

The Caucasian ("white") race consists of those from Europe, the Middle East, North Africa, Western Asia and parts of Central Asia. This broader definition, as opposed to the rather narrowminded definition that only "Anglo-Saxons" are white, represents 55% of the world's population.

Simply put, the only peoples who are not Caucasoid are the East Asians (Mongoloid) - those with the epicanthic eye folds, such as Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, etc. and sub-Saharan Africans
(*******).
Australoids are sometimes regarded as "archaic" Caucasoids.

It seems like a lot of people want to deny white people their own diversity of ethnicity, culture and color. We can range from pale to olive to brown and still be unmixed Caucasian. Many whites, especially here in the U.S., are an ethnic mix but again, that is entirely different from a racial mix.

That's the point! Looks have little, if anything, to do with race. It's not about skin color, hair texture, etc. As I said, it's all about craniofacial anthropometry.
I can generally tell an Irishman from an Englishman. Does that make them different races? Of course not. They are different ethnicities within the same race.

http://www.answers.com/topic/berber-people

http://www.answers.com/topic/white-people-2

OK, and while I'm at it, let's not forget about Latin America & U.S. Hispanics:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Latin_American
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Hispanic

Some interesting comments for sure. Still, never in my entire life have I ever known an Italian/Sicilian to regard themselves as non-white and I was once engaged to a Sicilian girl. I'm not really buying into it that they do, or that anyone, other than perhaps some kid from the current hip-hop generation or a young buck trying to get his rut on with a young lady of color, would even give consideration to such a notion. I might suggest, however, that those who think this way take a trip to Bensonhurst, in Brooklyn. Try going up to a gathering of the locals, tell them what you think and see what happens.

Gracias don juan por las fotos. Todos personas son blancos.
(I'm guessing Galecian, near the border with Portugal?)

Correction - I meant "todas las personas son blancos." All of the people (in those photos) are white.
(Still need a spell checker for add details!) Thanks!

BTW, I'm Irish,English & French. All of the original peoples of Europe are white
or Caucasian, if you prefer. I'm just shocked that so many of today's young people seem to be so uneducated in this area. I don't know if it's just youthful nievite but I hate to think that so many people are actually this simple-minded.

Here's the DNA site I'd recommend:
http://www.ancestrybydna.com/welcome/whatisancestrybydna/

The only reason I'm concerned with this is that today's young people seem to totally confuse race with ethnicity. It's getting to the point where, if one has dark hair, they're thought of as non-white. It's ridiculous. I don't know what they teach in schools anymore. It's also apparent that it's become "hip" to identify as non-white in recent years and it seems that anyone who is darker than Elmer's glue is jumping on that bandwagon. So foolish! White people can range from near-white to olive to brown, all without being mixed with any non-white race. Again, if one isn't of East Asian or sub-Saharan African descent, or mixed with one of those, than he/she is technically "white" or Caucasian, regardless of skin tone.
Of course, I realize that from a social point of view, not everyone would see it this way. The concept of race, based on color, is wrong and is a social construct. The concept of race based on
craniofacial anthropometry, however, is perfectly sound. That is what I go by.

Perhaps part of the problem is the gross misunderstanding that so many young people have regarding the terms "Hispanic" and/or "Latino." These are not racial terms. The former indicates that one is from a Spanish-speaking background and the latter merely indicates that one is from Latin America, regardless of race. Many of the other groups I mentioned have a somewhat similar appearance so it would make sense that those who wrongly think that mestizos represent most Hispanics or Latin Americans might develop a similar misconception regarding other ethnic groups who, as I say, might have a similar appearance.
Anyway, it would appear that few people bother clicking on the links provided. No comments for any of them.

I've decided to let this go to vote. For what it's worth, a few weeks back, some girl responded to a similar question regarding Italians & Robert De Niro. She said she didn't consider him white! (A lot of people don't realize that he is only 1/4 Italian in any case.) Also, what about David Caruso, Hulk Hogan & Tim McGraw. They are Italian-Americans. (Sicilian in Caruso's case.) I guess they're not white either. LMAO!

Answer 1

well Spaniards and Italians have a high percentage of African DNA but Greeks are white

Answer 2

It's because everyone takes the whole race thing to seriously and therefore bring in their cultures. People are too set on being distinctive that's why you have people claiming they're Asian American, African American, and god for bid if you confuse a Cuban with a Latino. I'm Mexican Indian and I could care less if someone calls me Hispanic or Spanish. I didn't grow up in that culture, I grew up in America so why would I get offended? It doesn't make me who I am as an individual. People have too much pride in things they don't even really know about sometimes.

Answer 3

Just as "there's not a lot of agreement" on the Australoids, there's not a lot of agreement on race in general, esp the way you define it.

I'm very informed about race and culture. And I'd have to agree that Spaniards, Italians and Greeks aren't White. Look at their histories. Funny that you separated Sicilians from Italians too.

Edit:

Yes, we disagree very much. I mean, let's deal with reality here not just textbook distinctions. I don't draw the huge distinction between "Subsaharan" and North African Africa that many do. You can call Berbers "caucasoid" if you want, but first look at them. Just LOOK AT THEM. Same goes for Australian Aborigines and, yes, many Sicilians.

Answer 4

Its because there are two schools of thought going on. One is where everyone that isn't 100% black African is considered white. The other is where the only group that is considered white is Nordics. Its known as the Classic Caucasian and Classic ***** school of though.

It happens on both ends of the racial spectrum because its very surprising that people believe that anyone whose skin isnt completely black with kinky hair is mixed or non black, when blacks encompass a wide variety of colors and features.

It just goes to show that at many levels, there is too much of a middle ground on what constitues race. That's why its better to consider population clusters such as Irish vs Greeks, because they are likely just as far apart structurally as comparing, Irish vs Kenyan and Greek vs Sengalese.

Answer 5

Reading your question and details you bring about some good points. I would rather not worry about who is and isn't "white". I would rather just get to know someone and not worry about this. I'm only sixteen almost seventeen and I completely agree with you. Most people that I talk to think that you are only white if you were born in America. What about our ancestors? I'm part German and Native American along with several other things. What about that? I think that people take this too far.

Answer 6

I dont know about Greek men but I have dated Italian men, among which some claimed to be 'white' and some didnt. The ones that claimed to be white had light brown/blond hair and colourful eyes (green, blue etc); but the ones who claimed to be nonwhite had dark features (they werent black either). I like my men with dark features (dark hair, eyes), compared to light features, and I will pick a brunette guy easily over blond guys.
But I do agree with you that there are different people of different ethnicities, within the same racial groupings/categories.

Answer 7

Well, I was wondering that myself, as I have seen answers in Yahoo where people claim that people from the Mediterranean have not white skin. lol. I think maybe they have never been there, or they have visited South Europe during the summer, when everyone is tanned...

Answer 8

I just think that they think of "white" as people of Northern European heritage. But, I think most people group "races" into white, black, Hispanic, Asian and Polynesian even though there are probably hundreds of nationalities that can fit into those categories. But, I'm probably not making much sense.

Answer 9

porque es un topico, los italianos, españoles, portugueses, griegos no sois blancos bla, bla, bla

la verdad es que toda esta gente que dice que los mediterraneos no son blancos, es que, ni se han molestado, en conocernos, simplemente la historia la han aprendido viendo la tv, caso muy tipico, hay gente que incluso piensa que los italianos son una especie de mulatos ¿?
pongo algunas fotos

Answer 10

They are clearly European Whites. It's the blacks trying to claim them and their civilizations as being black.

Notice how blacks always try to claim other White civilizations near the African border. Blacks have nothing to claim in Sub Saharan Africa so they make up lies with the help of liberals to make them feel better about themselves.

Answer 11

I think you should send your DNA for analysis to see where your ancestors came from and then reevaluate your position on race