High ph and delicate fish?

Question

Hi! I have high ph levels (right about 8) and I have a community 55 gallon tank, with gouramis, plattys, zebra danios, a red-tailed shark, pleco, and a cory cat, so far.

I need to know what other kinds of fish would be good in this tank with the ph so high. I'd like to have some other (obvious) kinds like sword tails, neons, tetras, angels, loaches, catfish like fish, sharks, etc. I don't want anything huge, but I do want colorful or odd shaped. (And don't say hatchet-fish - they're jumpers! lol) I was looking at a bala shark, I know they get big, but would they eat my zebras? Would a few female bettas live okay in a comminity tank, with moderate current, or do the females prefer the still water too? My male hated it in there...

I guess my real question is, What kinds of fish WOULD NOT survive in the ph so high??? What kinds of fish are considered "Delicate" other than a discus? As far as I know everything else tested ok.

Thank you in advanced for your answers and your help.

Something_fishy -
I do NOT want discus (too delicate) or cichlids, like I said I have a happy community tank. I don't want any agressors.

Magicman -
I've already been told that the pet shop keeps their tanks at 7 ph.
But, they also told me that I was risking the lives of the fish by subjecting them to the high ph of my tank... That's why I am asking you guys.... lol

Answer 1

I agree with the others, no need at all to change your pH for the fish that you have or the fish you are asking about. The fish that wouldn't do well at that pH is short indeed and nothin you are likely to want for your tank. Things like Discus, chocolate gourami, some few killifishes, some of the more rare loaches... nothing you normally encounter in pet shops really (except of course the discus). Simply put, except discus most fish that touchy are really rare because they are so touchy that most shops don't want to fool with trying to keep them alive until a knowledgeable hobbist buys them.

Most likely your local pet shop has the same or nearly the same pH you do, so whatever you see there is most likely living in the same pH you have and will do fine in your tank. You can confirm the pH of the shop tank ofcourse by asking them to test it before you buy the fish.

A few female bettas would probably do fine in your tank, they have less problems with currents in the tank than males. You might want to watch the gouramis depending on what kind they are they may nip and chase a bit. I wouldn't recommend the bala, as you know it gets big and yes, it will eat smaller fishes if it can catch them.

Hope that helps

MM

Answer 2

Most fish stores don't bother to adjust their pH - whatever the public water supply brings in is what's used, unless it's a very touchy species like the discus that was mentioned.

Most fish are fine in a pH from 6-8, and I've kept tropicals at even higher (8.0-8.3 straight from the tap). Pick something hardy that you like and take a little extra time when you acclimate your fish. Float them in their bags for 15 minutes and slowly add water from your tank (pour out about half the water and add just a bit to replace it - something like one of those iced tea scoops or medicine cups to keep the volume small - and continue adding every 5-10 minutes till at least 3/4 or more of the water in the bag is water from your tank). While you're at it, you might want to test the water from the store (what's in the bag). If it's from the same source (water company) as your house, it may be closer to your pH than you might think!

This method is easier and gives more consistent pH than trying to adjust your pH with chemicals.

See the website below for info on pH range for most common aquarium species: http://www.elmersaquarium.com/000tropfishcareguides.htm

Answer 3

This goes without saying, don't trust your fish store personel. Most of the time, if they weren't already given the info they don't know. A simple answer to them is PH 7 nitrates 0 ammonia 0

They don't have a clue. I have both salt and fresh. I get the same answer for salt water which infact is wrong. As well as the PH being 8.

The people here have more combine experience with fish and caring for fish than the punk at the store.

Don't mess with the PH Your fish are not at risk. They will be fine.

Answer 4

You'd be surprised how well community fish can adapt. The 8.0 is not as much of a problem as the pH bouncing up and down, which will prove fatal. You can soften the water, http://www.aquariumpharm.com/en_us/productCategory.asp?categoryname=WaterConditioners
with Water Softener Pillow. Don't use other chemicals, your pH will bounce all over the place. Is your water 8.0 from the tap?
Discus would have trouble in water that has a pH of 8.0. If they were imported from Singapore, the were probably raised in water with a pH of 7.0 to 7.5 and when they got to the USA, they were probably slowly acclimated to water with a pH of 6.5 to 7.0. Making that jump again, would just be too stressful. Locally raised Discus were more likely in water with a pH of 6.5 or less their whole lives. They'd really stress from the change.
Of course there's African Cichlids that would THRIVE in 8.0 pH.

Answer 5

I've had very good results with a product called "Discus Buffer" manufactured by SeaChem. While I do not keep Discus, the Angels and various species of Tetra in my 55 have been in superb health for years.

http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/DiscusBuffer.html

Answer 6

I have to agree with MM and the rest. As long as your fish are OK you really don't have to do anything with the Ph.

I would suggest adding tank water to the bag first to acclimatize the fish instead of adding them to the tank right away though.

Good Luck.
E.

Answer 7

Most fish do fine in an 8. There are very few species, and just because the ideal ph is a specif number, most freshwater fish do fine even higher than an 8 and lower than a 7. The fish you mentioned will live in the 8 ph. Remember however when adding any new fish to float them a little longer and add your tank water to the water they come in. This will allow them to acclamate tot he change in ph since most fish stores keep their fish around 7-7.4 PH (Not all since it depends on their water.

Here is more on PH and how it works in your tank:


The property of water to resist changes in pH is known as buffering capacity. You can determine the capacity of your buffering system by measuring total hardness. A reading of 4-6 dH or higher is usually adequate to keep the buffering system in place and maintain a stable pH. A reading under 4 dH means there isn't enough of a buffering system and the pH is likely to drop. For higher pH levels, you will probably want to aim for 6-12 dH. Many hobbyists choose to measure only Carbonate Hardness (KH), which is a measure of the calcium carbonates in your water. This test is also effective in maintaining a proper buffer system. When testing for Carbonate Hardness, a reading of 75-100 mg/L is adequate for most aquariums, while a reading of 100-200 mg/L would be desired for higher pH levels. For the purpose of freshwater aquariums, measuring either total hardness or carbonate hardness is necessary, but measuring both independently would not be needed.

You need to know that anywhere in your aquarium where detritus (a fancy term for dirt) accumulates is a source of Phosphate production. As detritus accumulates in your gravel bed and on your filter pads, the Phosphate levels in your aquarium rise. Free Phosphate ions may bond with calcareous buffering material, precipitating calcium from your aquarium, and reducing your aquariums ability to keep pH stable. This is why it is so very important to clean your filter pads regularly and vacuum the aquarium gravel with each water change. In addition, your tap water contains buffering ions. Doing regular partial water changes will help to replenish the buffers which have been lost. This is important in all aquariums, because fish respiration and organic wastes alone will cause a gradual drop in the ability of your aquarium to buffer against pH swings.

Now the question becomes what to do if the fish you want to keep have very special pH requirements. If your fish prefer a pH level which is reasonably close to the pH your aquarium water is naturally buffered to, then I do not recommend you make any changes at all. Unless you are keeping an extremely specialized fish your fish will be fine. On the other hand, if your fish have pH requirements which are far from the values in your tank, then you have work to do.

Let us consider methods of raising the pH of your tap water. There are many additives on the market today which claim to raise your pH. Most of the liquid products on the market today are a 50/50 success at best when used alone only to find the ph will soon return to the normal level of 6. You also need to use a product to increase the buffering ability of your aquarium. To maintain a stable pH in the upper levels of the pH scale for fishkeeping, I would recommend using a buffering substrate such as crushed coral. You can add crushed coral to your existing aquarium. You can place larger amounts of shells or chrushed coral beneath the substraight in the tank. I personally place the crushed coral in a mesh bag and place the bag in my filter. You will want about 1 kg of crushed coral per 40 liters of water to buffer the water to hold a pH around 7.6. This method does not allow for the use of large quantities of crushed coral, but can be effective if you only need to make small adjustments to your aquariums buffering ability. This is why ocean items such as shells and ocean sand should not be used in a fresh water aquarium. It does raise the PH level.

Be assured that attempting to control pH is the most frustrating experience for a fish hobbyist. I would guess that 50% of the problems encountered in new aquariums are a result of the aquarist attempting to change the pH level. Few fish keepers actually need to adjust their pH. For the majority of aquarists your tap water pH will be adequate. The dangers of adjusting the pH incorrectly far outweigh any benefit you may receive by moving your pH a few points on the scale.

Remember, when it comes to adjusting your pH, less is more! Stability is most important. Routine maintenance is the key to keeping your pH stable and your fish healthy!

Also, do not use baking soda in your tank. Over doing the ph plus adding additional salt is not going to do your tank any good. It will also revert back to the natural water properties when the carbon filters pull the Soda out.
Hope this helps