If Ideas are eternal, does this mean that mind is eternal since Ideas cannot exist apart from mind?
2007-03-21 10:34:43 · 12 answers · asked by sokrates 4 in Arts & Humanities ➔ Philosophy
Sophist
I am talking about Ideas in the sense of abstract objects that can be thought by more than one mind. Examples of Ideas are justice, beauty, circularity or triangularity. I have reference to Ideas as that term is employed in Plato.
2007-03-21 11:37:44 · update #1
Pax
Platonic Ideas are eternal and immutable.
2007-03-21 11:38:22 · update #2
Ronin
Read the Republic. Plato argues that Ideas are eternal. Who created justice or the property of being a circle or square? Who created the property of oddness or evenness? The answer is that these Ideas were not created, but are eternal and unchangeable.
2007-03-21 11:40:02 · update #3
Sure your argument is valid[1].
It has the following form:
Xes can only exist can only exist as long as some Ys exist as well.
Xes exist forever.
Therefore Ys exist forever.
However it may not be SOUND[2]. Basically if you want to convince me of your conclusion -- you will have to convince that BOTH premises and logic are correct.
Your logic is true.
However, to truly prove your conclusion you also need to prove that:
1. Ideas cannot Exist Apart From Mind
2. And that Ideas Are Eternal
In my humble opinion it is a tall order to prove these two things.
But you are welcome to give it a shot.
P.S. I do not see why ideas "are eternal and immutable", also you did not really define a term "idea". Giving a list of things like " justice, beauty, square-ness" does not help me understand what "idea" is. If anything "platonic forms" confuse me even more by trying to define a hard concept with even harder one.
As for some answers on who created "ideas", why not "big bang" created the ideas, or even "God" created the ideas or "humans created the ideas"(see [3], a lot of recent philosophers argued for this, for example Schopenhauer, and more recently Quine, basically there was a shift on modern philosophy away from Platonic idealism, although some pholsophers like Kurt Goedel stick with it.)
2007-03-21 14:25:21 · answer #1 · answered by hq3 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
The individual mind is definetely not eternal. The reason an idea seem eternal is because it can exist in several people's minds and continue that process. Though one may die, his or her's ideas may still exist among others. While an individuals mind may not last forever, the people around them can adopt the same way of thinking. But the reason why ideas are not eternal as well is because these thoughts can become altered and changed throughout time. Therefore both are not eternal at all. They all evolve and change into something new.
2007-03-21 19:34:20 · answer #2 · answered by Leona 3 · 0⤊ 0⤋
That certainly seems to be the logical implication, doesn't it?
Though there may be more to it (maybe mind is an eternal "stuff", but no single, individual mind is eternal- perhaps there is a greater whole that individual minds join with and separate from- this is what most Eastern religions profess).
2007-03-21 17:39:16 · answer #3 · answered by IQ 4 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Thoughts or ideas which come from our minds are NOT eternal, anymore than impulses and signals that come from our brains are eternal. The brain, a finite and created thing, cannot produce eternal things.
Only God, an immortal and infinite being, can create immortal things (like our souls).
2007-03-21 18:02:52 · answer #4 · answered by Veritas 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Nothing can be said to be eternal because eternal suggests future and as future has not yet taken place it is reasonable to assume that eternal cannot be proven. I would suggest that the mind is not eternal, nor are ideas. If time and space suddenly came to a conclusion and no longer existed does that suggest eternal is possible. We could speak of present mind and past mind but not eternal mind. This is purely hypothetical.
2007-03-21 17:47:49 · answer #5 · answered by Dr Paul D 5 · 0⤊ 2⤋
Ideas nor the mind are eternal. Everything has an ending and a beginning. If not our mere existence would be impossible.............
2007-03-21 18:45:40 · answer #6 · answered by OLD SKOOL ( discreet ) 1 · 0⤊ 0⤋
The assumption is that ideas are eternal which is false. Ideas come and go. Some work some don't.
2007-03-21 17:55:23 · answer #7 · answered by Sophist 7 · 3⤊ 0⤋
Who said ideas are eternal? What stone is that written on?
2007-03-21 18:14:59 · answer #8 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
While ideas are, actually, transitory, the human soul, and consciousness, is eternal, though the "clothing" is subject to "death" .
2007-03-21 18:31:38 · answer #9 · answered by drakke1 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Yes definitely.
2007-03-21 18:05:54 · answer #10 · answered by oscar c 5 · 0⤊ 0⤋