Pittsburgh Penguins?

Question

What is the chance that the Pens' will move to Kansas City

Answer 1

THEY ARE GOING TO KANSAS CITY & HERES WHY

PITTSBURGH PENGUINS FACTS:

Expansion team when the NHL doubled in size for the start of 1967-68 Season

The Penguins almost folded in 1975 when their creditors demanded payment of back debts. A group that included Wren Blair stepped in and prevented the Penguins from folding. Pittsburgh had the league's worst record in both the 1983 and 1984 seasons and it looked as though the Penguins would fold. The reward for such pitiful hockey was the right to draft French Canadian phenomenon Mario Lemieux. Other teams offered substantial trade packages for the draft choice, but the Penguins kept the pick and a legend was born. The Penguins suffered small-market syndrome for most of their existence, and cost cutting prevented another collapse into insolvency. Financially, the team was one of the better-managed NHL franchises between its 1998 bankruptcy and the 2004-05 NHL lockouts. Thanks to significant post-season runs, the Penguins broke even in 2000 and turned a small profit in 2001. Failure to make the playoffs in the next three seasons hurt the team's bottom line, but the shedding of contracts kept the team afloat as other franchises, like the Ottawa Senators, faced significant losses or declared bankruptcy.

BUT KANSAS CITY HAD A NHL TEAM & IT FAILED:

Kansas City was awarded an NHL franchise on June 8, 1972. The Scouts were an expansion team with no star players the NHL wasn't as popular in the 70s as it is today and both the NHL and NBA's attendance in the 70s were hurt by a sluggish economy. They played their home games at Kemper Arena. The team was not a particular success either at the gate or on the ice. Rising oil prices and a falling commodity market made for hard going in the Midwest during the 1970s. After two seasons, with its owners $900,000 in debt, the franchise was sold & relocated to Denver where it became the Colorado Rockies, who in turn became the New Jersey Devils after 1982. The NHL has also failed in ATLANTA & DENVER but both are back in the NHL & the Avalanche is one of the most successful NHL teams in North America.

Thanks to the IHL Kansas City Blades, a team that did well in Kansas City for several years during the 1990's and even won the league Championship, Kansas City now has a well-educated base of hockey fans in the city. Today those fans have wildly embraced the idea of another chance to watch NHL hockey in Kansas City (despite the comments of some people above). As evidence of this fact, one needs to look no further than the fact that all the luxury box suites in the new Sprint Center are already sold to local businesses. This is a particularly interesting fact because a recent article in a Sports Business publication indicated that most NHL franchises derive 60% of their revenue from the sales of luxury suites to local corporations. The rest comes from individual ticket sales, parking revenues, merchandise and concessions.

ARENA COSTS:

The Pittsburgh Penguins could play rent-free and be equal managing partners in the new Sprint Center if they move to Kansas City. The Penguins would not have to buy into the management agreement for the $276 million Sprint Center. Additional Options to pay $27 million (THIS COST WILL BE TAKEN OUT OF FUTURE PROFITS NOTHING UP FRONT) to AEG the company who manages Sprint Center and share management and revenue equally with AEG from concerts or other events at the Sprint Center.

COST TO STAY IN PITTSBURGH:

Current Plan B for new arena in Pittsburgh being proposed by local politicians requires $8.5 million be paid upfront by the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group. The Lemieux/Burkle ownership group would also be required to pay $4.5 million annually for 30 years. So, the total out of pocket expense required by Lemieux/Burkle ownership group over 30 years = $135 million.

Also, the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group has agreed to pay cost overruns on the new arena to a certain point. The politicians in Pittsburgh have maintained that the new area won’t cost more than $270 million to build, but others, including the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group have insisted that a more realistic starting point is $290 million. The architectural firm HOK, ironically a Kansas City based company, designed the building with the same basic design features used for the new Sprint Center in Kansas City. According to HOK estimates, if construction of the Sprint Center began today, the final cost on the building would be estimated at $360 million. This fact has given the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group reason for concern because their total cost for the new arena could would look more like this: Pay $4.5 million annually for 30 years, plus an additional $70 million in potential cost overruns. Total out of pocket expense required by the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group over 30 years = $205 million.

IS PITTSBURGH DEAL POSSABLE:

EST. Cost of Construction $225 million
Heinz Field, cost $281 million
PNC Park, cost $216 Million
(YOU DO THE MATH)

ADDITIONAL FACTS TO CONSIDER:

The Penguins ownership group was attempting to sell the team when they thought they had an arena deal in place in Pittsburgh. This was before the Isle of Capri was denied the gaming rights by the Pennsylvania gaming commission. A potential buyer, William “Boots” Del Biaggio, is waiting in the wings in Kansas City. Del Biaggio has already agreed to purchase the controlling interest in any NHL franchise that relocates to Kansas City, thus relieving the current owners of any financial risk associated with moving to an “unknown” market. In other words, the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group could relocate the team to Kansas City without risk of losing any money in the sale or if the team runs into financial problems after the move.

Over the last ten years, Kansas City has become a world leader in BioMedical Research. Places like the Stowers Institute have attracted some of the world’s foremost leaders in cancer and stem cell research. Why is this relevant? A recent comparison of Kansas City and Pittsburgh revealed people in Kansas City have approximately $22,000 more per household in disposable income than the average Pittsburgh household. Why is this significant? Because this means they would have more disposable income to spend on entertainment events such as hockey games.

As for the “loyal hockey fans of Pittsburgh,” they look more like a bunch of fair weather fans to me. Check out the official attendance records for the team. It basically shows that they have only come out in strong support of the team when the team is winning or potentially moving. So, I don’t have much sympathy for them.

ATTENDANCE FIGURES IN PITTSBURGH:

2001-02: 15,649 (Ranked 22nd in NHL)
2002-03: 14,749 (Ranked 25th in NHL)
2003-04: 11,877 (Ranked 30th in NHL)
2004-05: SEASON CANCELLED
2005-06: 15,804 (Ranked 20th in NHL)
2006-07: 15,888 (Ranks 20th in NHL)

Taken alone, none of these additional facts means a great deal. But, if those passionate Pens fans would set aside their emotions for just a moment and look at the big picture, the combined impact of all three together, it is easy to see why the Lemieux/Burkle ownership group is considering relocation.

MY TAKE:

I lived in Minnesota when the North Stars moved to Dallas. So, I feel your pain Pens fans. But don't worry Pens fans, there is hope for you yet. It only took us 7 years to get a new expansion franchise. Maybe by then you will have better politicians in Pennsylvania who will care about hockey and the image of your city.

Answer 2

After the news on Monday, it seems more possible that they could move. mario has done everything he can financially and the city/state still won't meet him in the middle. He has an offer to take the team to KC and play in the $280MM Sprint Center RENT FREE while sharing in the revenues from all the luxo boxes (already sold out without a tenant) and all other bookings at the venue. He basically said they have negotiated in good faith but didn;t think that the city/state had done the same. He's tried for 8 freaking years to get an arean built. If PITT hasn't done it by now, why do they deserve a chance.

Welcome to Kansas City!

Answer 3

I live in Kansas City, and we don't know. Mario is to be in town at the end of the week.

Answer 4

It's looking pretty good, but the news might be a scare tactic to try to get these negotiations rolling. I think it's really still anyone's guess.

Answer 5

according to what i've heard from a source close to ken sawyer there is a slim chance that a move will take place although this was before they delcared the impasse yesterday

Answer 6

Well I live in Houston and the radio here is asking the same questions... so we are just going to have to wait and see.

Answer 7

So far it looks pretty good that it will happen.Lemieux is pretty ticked off right now about the lack of a new venue.(sorry if i mis-spelled super Mario's name)

Answer 8

70-30 Pens will stay.

Answer 9

I don't think they did. LETS GO PENS

Answer 10

i highly doubt that they will be moving to a different city