English national anthem at rugby match on Saturday, should it be played in light of the info attached?

Question

Today the English rugby team arrived in Dublin. On Saturday they play Ireland in Croke Park in front of 82,000 fans. Croker, as it is known here, is the headquarters of the Gaelic Athletics Association which controls all Gaelic games and has never before allowed any other sport to be played on it's pitches.
The question above relates to the fact that the last time the English came to Croke Park it was in 1920 when soldiers entered the playing area during a match between Tipperary and Dublin and shot 2 players and 12 spectators including children. Do you think that the GAA would be within their rights to ask that an alternative song be played than God Save the Queen. After all all the other Nations of UK and Ireland use songs other than the anthems
Also If so which tune should England sing

BTW I am an English supporter living in Ireland

LUCKATO
Ireland don't play their Anthem out of respect for the Northern members of the team. They sing a song called Ireland's call written by Phil Coulter
I think the IRA argument is a bit lame considering the Army in Dublin is supposed to protect the populous not shoot them at a Sunday football match

SUNFLOWER
You are right but this was an international event, not a head to head match of one country against another

LISA H
I heard an african man sing sweet chariot from start to finish in Harrow Weald tube station 17 years ago and it is a very long song. I don't think most supporters would get past the chorus

DROCKS 27
Personally I like "I Vow To Thee My Country"

TOMO
Good points mate, you feel forgive and move on
Now if Yahoo had shown me previously asked questions like this I wouldn't have let it go out ... but no similar questions came up so here I am mate

ANF
agreed, .... suggestions?

GORGEOUS
Already covered that point see above
and in reality maybe the GAA don't have the balls to deny a disabled athlete an anthem for a medal. True

GREEN
You put him in his place hun, at least you have balance with your opinion. Yes good luck, you might be right as Johnny Wilkinson is doubtful now

M1CKMAL
I hope you do one day mate and don't appologise about feeling passionately about it. Every point of view is valid

REDSETTER
Lessons learned, good point

PUTONYOURFLIPFLOPS
I don't do one sided questions, only brief facts, if you want to give me a more fully informed answer Google Hogan 1920 GAA or any other link words and you'll get some pretty good background. the Telegraph had a very good piece with the backround prior to the match

NORFOLK 'N GOOD
In reality I think we have to give the English credit for never banning the Irish songs under difficult circumstances. Plus when the Welsh and Scottish refused to come to Dublin during the troubles, the English team turned up

7 AM
Hmmm you seem to be the only one who's gone off on a rant. You picked the wrong guy to rant at. I hadn't mentioned the political question until you raised it. I only asked if the GAA should have the right to suggest a change.
Whatever the IRA did the day before would have been targeted assaults in their struggle and no-one can justify a random spraying of bullets ito a football crowd as justifiable retaliation. So please don't even try
You seem to forget I am English and have no axe to grind
In fact the GAA are keeping quiet on the issue, they are happy to let it go ahead. the noises come from dissenters and the media looking for sales. Most people don't care anymore.

JIMBOBARINO
You win the Pedantic Pete award, well done. The question isn't from a Nationalist nor is it political. Read it again !

7 AM
Also Ireland plays 1 song "Irelands call"
You only hear a short blast of the anthem as a presidential salute when she arrives to meet the teams. The same way the queen, or prince of wales etc are given a short blast or God Save depending on their seniority when the arrive at concerts, theatres

David H
That's an idea that could pick up momentum

CORMAU 2000
Again, read the question and you;ll see I've nothing to get over. No axe to grind here. However please dont justify 14 for 14 so flippantly. What had kids in a football crowd got to do with a war between 2 fighting forces ?

Answer 1

luckato are you retarded? what do you mean I.R.A killings? don't give opinions on something you know nothing about. face facts the English occupied my country and i don't condone the IRA but the English killed many Irish there is no doubt. However i welcome the team on Saturday and don't mind if the anthem is played it is a different generation of English who had no part in what happened to us in 1920 . I believe we need to move on and forgive and good luck to the English team on Saturday by God you ll need it cause were going to hammer ye.

Answer 2

I'm Irish and proud and I admit it was a terrible thing that happened in 1920. I've lived in England, Australia, America and now back in Ireland so I have an idea of what Irish people think. I became very patriotic when I left Ireland but I feel that this is just another excuse for people to get on their high horse and moan and complain. I'd say there are a few families walking around in Northern Ireland who bump into the killer of one of their family members. Can we not learn from them and stop the complaining. Yes it was a terrible thing that happened but I wonder if those people who died in 1920 were alive today would they be so outspoken or would they want some peace in this country? If something happens on saturday which possibly could it will be the moaners fault for escalating the problem. And yes sunflower is right. The English national anthem was played before in Croke park at the Special Olympics in 2003. So if all these people are so adamant that it should not be in Croke Park, where were they then??

Answer 3

These events are a long way past now and should be consigned to historical facts. As for the National Anthem, I have always felt that God Save the Queen was a pretty weak offering as it says nothing about the people or the country. I would really like there to be a new English National Anthem as part of the set with Wales, Ireland and Scotland.

Answer 4

to norfolk'ngood the ira bombed Warrington they do not and have never represented the Irish people or our government but the British soldiers that shot 14 people in Croke Park did represent the British government of the day. Having said that I have no problem with God save the Queen being played at the match as we all need to live in the present and look towards the future and not dwell on the past. The English anthem i'm led to believe is Land of hope and glory so maybe in the future they might consider palying this before games as Wales and Scotland play theirs

Answer 5

I don't know what the hell is wrong with some people why on earth should they not play the National Anthem at Croke Park, it is accepted protocol at such an event, the GAA knew this when they agreed with the IRU that the games could be played, they are taking the gate, they take the game, all of it protocol included.

And as for Anthems Ireland play two Anthems before International Games, the only country to do it unless you're going to count the Haka, which is another bone of contention.

And finally, Yes 14 people were shot at an incident in Croke Park in 1920 but people who are quick to raise this issue often fail to mention the 14 people executed by the IRA the day before which was the reason the troops entered Croke Park in the first place.

For crying out loud this was in the past, the Irish question has supposedly moved on, there were deaths on both side, as there is in any uprising, freedom struggle, terrorist war, call it what you will, do you see the English victims of IRA bombings complaining because Gaelic Anthems are sung at Twickenham.

This is a game of Rugby, as someone as already said on this forum this question has been asked enough. Keep politics out of Sport, sit back and watch England take another step on the road to recovery.

Add:

That wasn't a rant it was passion, and no I wasn't trying to justify anything, I have witnessed the results of both War and Terrorism first hand and it aint pretty.

Having now read your 360 I will say this, you should be very careful about playing games with evocative subjects especially ones like this, it's antagonists with questions like this that stir the muddy waters of the past and bring old feelings of hatred to the surface. Ireland and Englands history is now hopefully in the past, where it belongs, you cannot go forward whilst continually looking backwards.

Again, it's a game of rugby, not a spring board for renkindling old hatreds.

Answer 6

Not 100% sure but where all the british army english then? because if not then are we going have the same bad feeling towards say scotland and wales.Dont think so some how.

I also wonder if any mention would be made about the previous days murders.........bet they wont as its far to easy to target the english.

To rake up old wounds is a terrible thing to do,lets hope there are no heroes out there with a score to settle.Id like to see politics kept out of sport all togeather.

Answer 7

I hope that when we get a newly elected PM we will see the practise of singing the National Anthem at these type of events, reviewed, as it would be more fitting if at all English Sporting events they had their own anthem instead of the UK's national anthem. It smacks of British Empire and all that and gives the English nothing to identify with. Nothing to do with not showing respect or allegiance to the crown.

However, to answer you question at this moment in time what is the alternative than to play the UK Anthem and I'm sure whilst the Irish will never forget, they will not give a Castle Mane XXXX at this moment in time. They are a forwarding looking nation, thanks be.

Answer 8

When you started typing this you should have been shown by Yahoo all the similar questions asked recently.
And quite a few taking the piss out of the situation.

Of course it should be played, how far in history do we go back to decide if an anthem should be played? Is there a definite cutoff date, or should we start a panel who decide. Maybe that would give Rob Andrew something to do.
The banning of the Hakka was bad enough, ridiculous talk of banning the English from singing what ever they feel like singing is a disgrace.

It's a game of rugby, keep it that way

Answer 9

it was 1920, so get over it.

If the english had to sing another song it should be rambling rose cos they are crap at the moment.

The GAA have rented Croke park out to the rugby, they don't really have the right to ask them not to sing the anthem, the english are a proud nation (don't know why) and they are equally proud of their anthem (don't know why its about an old lady)

I don't actually see why they should have to sing a different song rather than their anthem. It is a tradition.

Let them get on with it and play the damn game!!

Answer 10

very good question and i am looking forward to the answers. I'm absolutely torn. A big part of me thinks that we should look to the future and allow the English team to sing as they would in any other stadium. However, i can totally understand why the Irish may want England to refrain from singing the national anthem. I'm english and hate the national anthem anyway, who really cares all that much about the queen anyway?
Maybe they should sing Sweet Chariots!
Its going to be a land mark game whatever happens. can't wait.

Answer 11

This simply is not true. In 2003 the Special Olympics World Summer Games were held in Ireland. The British national anthem was played in Croke Park then. What is the difference?

Does it not count when it's the Special Olympics?